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  1. #1
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    Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    I stumbled onto another occasion when Bill Maher made sense -- he's worth listening to here, where despite the humor he's dead serious:





    He picks a perfect foil in the Washington Post's Kathleen Parker.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    It's a first in a long time for me but I watched his monologue from first to last and pretty much agreed with everything in it. Maher didn't go into that area where Sterling really deserved to get pounded on but as a true believer in the freedom of expression, and privacy rights, he made a strong argument on how forcing Sterling out on the speech offense (rather than his own egregious illegal acts of discrimination, in which the NBA and the peanut gallery did NOTHING to hold him to account).

    If Donald Sterling should have lost the Clippers, it was when he was found to have violated the rights of perspective tenants in his apartment buildings by discriminating against them on the basis of their race... his actions were grievous and immoral, as well as contemptible and illegal. I shed no tears for him now, and as a person it couldn't have happened to more of a jerk and I hope he does go without too much of a fight. Yet what was done was something underhanded, probably done out of pique and certainly only that furthered the agenda of his mistress and no one else.

    I cheered as Maher, someone I usually dismiss as a pompous egotist. wiped the floor with commentator Kathleen Parker's comments about pretty much surrendering concerns of privacy rights in a 24/7 cutthroat sophisticated media environment. His allusion to the kind of life in East Germany where the only thoughts freely expressed were in the heads of those living under such a regime, and fighting the Cold War specifically because that was the kind of world we did not want to live in was spot on.

    Outside of that, the thing I love was his commentary about the sherpas who have been risking and recently losing lives making it comfortable for wealthy Westerners among others to climb up those perilous paths going up the Himalayas(specifically Mt Everest)... do it yourselves!!!! (loved that one!!!!!)
    Last edited by Sausy; May 11th, 2014 at 07:39 PM.
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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by Sausy View Post
    If Donald Sterling should have lost the Clippers, it was when he was found to have violated the rights of perspective tenants in his apartment buildings by discriminating against them on the basis of their race... his actions were grievous and immoral, as well as contemptible and illegal. I shed no tears for him now, and as a person it couldn't have happened to more of a jerk and I hope he does go without too much of a fight. Yet what was done was something underhanded, probably done out of pique and certainly only that furthered the agenda of his mistress and no one else.
    OTOH, it may have been the only way to bring the hammer down on someone who was otherwise getting away with being a barbarian.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sausy View Post
    I cheered as Maher, someone I usually dismiss as a pompous egotist. wiped the floor with commentator Kathleen Parker's comments about pretty much surrendering concerns of privacy rights in a 24/7 cutthroat sophisticated media environment. His allusion to the kind of life in East Germany where the only thoughts freely expressed were in the heads of those living under such a regime, and fighting the Cold War specifically because that was the kind of world we did not want to live in was spot on.
    That was superb, wasn't it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sausy View Post
    Outside of that, the thing I love was his commentary about the sherpas who have been risking and recently losing lives making it comfortable for wealthy Westerners among others to climb up those perilous paths going up the Himalayas(specifically Mt Everest)... do it yourselves!!!! (loved that one!!!!!)
    I liked that as well. I also liked the parallel there: both the Western climbers and Sterling have been pompous asses treating their privilege as entitlement.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    I wholly agree with the sentiment and opinion but on the other paw, how does the Fourth Amendment apply to your girl friend?
    Under democracy one party always devotes its chief energies to trying to prove that the other party is unfit to rule - and both commonly succeed, and are right. H. L. Mencken US editor (1880 - 1956)

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by Stardreamer View Post
    I wholly agree with the sentiment and opinion but on the other paw, how does the Fourth Amendment apply to your girl friend?
    You caught that, too!

    It doesn't actually, but it does sort of set a standard that we the people ought to respect, since we demand it of our government. OTOH, the government today is piss-poor at respecting it.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    This is just his occasional Sunday-morning libertarianism (the party he identifies as, politically) coming out. He has certainly never considered it in any way out of bounds during his many years on the air to hold against various politicians things from their private lives, marriages, divorces, sexcapades or caught in e-mail/phone conversations/accidental recordings/live shooting fubars that we likely would have never known about in the era before the mass information/internet/cellphone/social media era.

    Nor do I think it's out of bounds to do so, either. Just for the record.

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by xbuzzerx View Post
    This is just his occasional Sunday-morning libertarianism (the party he identifies as, politically) coming out. He has certainly never considered it in any way out of bounds during his many years on the air to hold against various politicians things from their private lives, marriages, divorces, sexcapades or caught in e-mail/phone conversations/accidental recordings/live shooting fubars that we likely would have never known about in the era before the mass information/internet/cellphone/social media era.

    Nor do I think it's out of bounds to do so, either. Just for the record.
    I don't watch him enough to make a comparison. I caught this one because someone exclaimed that he sounded human this time, so I took a look. But I did think his point against the "Oh, hell, there's no privacy; just edit yourself all the time" crap was good. We're dealing with a whole new level of intrusiveness possibilities, and it deserves some thought before just caving in.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by xbuzzerx View Post
    This is just his occasional Sunday-morning libertarianism (the party he identifies as, politically) coming out. He has certainly never considered it in any way out of bounds during his many years on the air to hold against various politicians things from their private lives, marriages, divorces, sexcapades or caught in e-mail/phone conversations/accidental recordings/live shooting fubars that we likely would have never known about in the era before the mass information/internet/cellphone/social media era.

    Nor do I think it's out of bounds to do so, either. Just for the record.
    I have to agree.

    Media figures who have made a living off the private affairs of politicians and celebrities really aren't suddenly entitled to find religion.

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    He might have meant those politicians who have been hypocritical family / traditional values zealots in the past, but who have been exposed doing things contrary to their support for morality and purity. I would ask him about the context before interpreting it as hypocritical. His message is essentially correct, many progressives buy into that self censorship ( or speech codes, or right speech) crap that would restrict speech or expression... even hate crimes legislation is troubling because it quantifies a crime motivated by alleged be given more weight in sentencing than a conventional crime. Punish criminality, don't add points because of supposed intent. Going off from Bill's actual words but real liberals are those who would defend liberty, expression and privacy instead of showing an authoritarian streak by having society restrict expression with speech codes and censorship.

    The best way to challenge bad speech is through using speech to correct, to challenge... one day your speech may be deemed improper in some form and to choose restriction, even if intended well, is to invite others to restrict for what they too may believe is the common good.
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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    "Many Progressives buy into" no such thing. There is no first amendment right to force other people to put up with you. You want to be a bigot go right ahead, you have no right to have that respected or to force other people to listen or associate with you.

    Your rights are about government intrusion NOT societal displeasure. Which is why I find it funny that your second paragraph suggests just that while completely contradicting what you were saying in the first.

    He lost the team not because of what his girlfriend did, but because he signed a contract and lost money for the league and they got pissed off about it.

    Girlfriends and jilted wives have always been "invading your privacy." So have friends and anyone else who talks about something you said that ended up in newspapers or gossip, or anywhere since the beginning.

    Maher above is just pushing his own particular brand of PC, there is absolutely no invasion of anything here. He said it, she talked, this has never been different, and you have no right to say she can't. If you can talk, so can she.

    There is only violation when there is legal compulsion to speak, or not speak, or act, or not act.
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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by Sausy View Post
    He might have meant those politicians who have been hypocritical family / traditional values zealots in the past, but who have been exposed doing things contrary to their support for morality and purity.
    I would say that I consider profiting in the form of votes on a moral purity platform while leading a very immoral personal life is analagous to profiting off a business frequently populated by and patronized by urban minority people while spouting racist attitudes in your personal life. In both cases you're a hypocrite and in both cases you are gaining a tangible advantage from your dishonesty. And in both cases there'd be social fallout and possibly career fallout for having the hypocrisy exposed. And I don't really see a problem with that so long as it's not a government agency sending out people to arrest you or confiscate your property because you deviated from their strain of acceptable opinion.

    Right wingers in the U.S. rely on the faulty notion that freedom of speech is, or should be, or ought to be freedom and protection from any form of conseqeunce for any kind of speech... and very often it is because they are the ones saying things that the lionshare of reasonable people in America would find unacceptable and offensive.

    It wouldn't be a violation of Constitutional liberties if a woman's health organization refused to have anything to do with the Tea Party politicians who have made comments to the effects that women bring rape on themselves or can control rape pregnancies. Yet right wingers have reacted as though it would be, in cases like Duck Dynasty and similar when networks with sponsor dollars to worry about consider dropping people with these kinds of socially unacceptable viewpoints.
    Last edited by xbuzzerx; May 12th, 2014 at 01:26 PM.

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by Sausy View Post
    He might have meant those politicians who have been hypocritical family / traditional values zealots in the past, but who have been exposed doing things contrary to their support for morality and purity. I would ask him about the context before interpreting it as hypocritical. His message is essentially correct, many progressives buy into that self censorship ( or speech codes, or right speech) crap that would restrict speech or expression...
    How may is "many"? And are you talking about political correctness, or what?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sausy View Post
    even hate crimes legislation is troubling because it quantifies a crime motivated by alleged be given more weight in sentencing than a conventional crime. Punish criminality, don't add points because of supposed intent.
    Juries have to consider intent quite frequently. Pointing that out was even part of the jury instructions we got at jury orientation two weeks ago.

    Which reminds me -- time to call in and see if I have to show up tomorrow.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Essentially Donald Sterling is being pushed out because of his speech... he deserves it as he's a first class jerk but he engaged in something substantially worse, housing discrimination, a few years back in a very high profile case. Nothing happened to him with the NBA there. No sustained howls of protest, no threat to take control of the team away from him... no push to rid the league of his sorry ass. He makes a truly stupid, bigoted set of statements to his mistress, who is recording their conversations and he's toast. Even Kareem Abdul-Jabbar while hailing the punishment was also critical of this sudden rush to get Sterling when his pas offenses garnered no such intense righteous reaction.

    Progressives do tend to favor their own authoritarian, I should say paternalistic, attitude towards freedom of expression. Not just obvious racism but anything they deem culturally "insensitive". Of course intent matters in a criminal case, but a crime is neither worse or should be met with further punishment if someone commits it with some kind of personal bias... robbery or assault or murder is serious enough without adding points of punishment in regards to whether the crime was at least partly based on a bias against something about the person. Hate crimes legislation, or speech codes punish thought and that's a slippery slope... if my family member was targeted for a crime simply because of being there, it's just as bad as if someone added a slur,whether it was because of race or sexuality or whatever... crimes shouldn't get brownie points just because of a politically correct notion of "punishing the thought".

    It's not a popular point of view here, and I understand that but I don't just post to go along with the herd, as much as we basically do agree on gay rights issues. Anyway served on a jury myself about a year back and it was my first case I was ever selected for.... both other times I actually had to attend was dismissed from consideration once on each case, and when calling in that evening for further instructions my jury group was no longer needed. Actually wasn't that bad at all an experience.
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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    I really don't think you understand "progressive." You seem to be operating from some kind of right wing definition and talking points.

    1. "Progressive" is a blanket term that covers a range of political thought, there is no "many progressives" want to police your speech. In fact most "progressives" think just the opposite - which is why people like the ACLU take flak for defending Neo-Nazis. PC is PC left, right, center, only idiots on the right think it's some kind of "liberal agenda," just about everyone has things you can't say in front of them, left, right, center. If you don't like it, that someone expects you to be sensitive to their issues, don't associate with them - a very "progressive" attitude.

    2. Hate crimes do not occur when the motive is theft, they occur when the motive is hate. Murder does not occur when there is only negligence, that is manslaughter, murder occurs when you hire Big Sal to make your wife swim with the fishes. Yet apparently there is no difference here?.

    It may be true that if you get murdered in the course of a robbery you are just as dead - but then the thieves didn't specifically single you out BECAUSE you are gay, then crucify you to a fence post. These things are not same. If you also live in a culture where it is considered perfectly normal to beat a faggot because he looked at your junk, there is a problem that needs addressing, criminal deterrents for that kind of crime are absolutely no different from any other kind of criminal deterrents.

    3. Hate crimes, what the fuck ever else he did wrong, your displeasure about how it was handled, hate speech laws - none of these are the point, he lost his team because he signed a contract giving the league the right to take it (or make him sell it - not sure of the exact legalism.) They exercised that authority. End. of. tale. There is absolutely no "rights" issue anywhere in all of this. It may have been rude for her to talk, but then it was rude of him to say what he did.

    3.a. His other offences were brought to court and apparently settled with the people he apparently fucked over - this has nothing whatsoever to do with basketball, there MIGHT HAVE BEEN (depending on how his contract read) more of an argument to make on his behalf, if the NBA had attempted to get rid of him over something that had nothing whatsoever to do with them.

    4. Where exactly in the U.S. does there exist some kind of criminal "speech codes?"
    ATTACK OF THE LIBERAL ELITE

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Look at it this way, the NBA didn't tell him to shut up, they told him they didn't want to play with him anymore, they didn't tell him he couldn't be a loathsome bigot, they told him they weren't going to lose any more money because of it.
    ATTACK OF THE LIBERAL ELITE

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by TX-Beau View Post
    2. Hate crimes do not occur when the motive is theft, they occur when the motive is hate. Murder does not occur when there is only negligence, that is manslaughter, murder occurs when you hire Big Sal to make your wife swim with the fishes. Yet apparently there is no difference here?.

    It may be true that if you get murdered in the course of a robbery you are just as dead - but then the thieves didn't specifically single you out BECAUSE you are gay, then crucify you to a fence post. These things are not same. If you also live in a culture where it is considered perfectly normal to beat a faggot because he looked at your junk, there is a problem that needs addressing, criminal deterrents for that kind of crime are absolutely no different from any other kind of criminal deterrents.

    3. Hate crimes, what the fuck ever else he did wrong, your displeasure about how it was handled, hate speech laws - none of these are the point, he lost his team because he signed a contract giving the league the right to take it (or make him sell it - not sure of the exact legalism.) They exercised that authority. End. of. tale. There is absolutely no "rights" issue anywhere in all of this. It may have been rude for her to talk, but then it was rude of him to say what he did.
    Hate crime is a legitimate category for the same reason that courts consider the intent of a law when deciding if it is legitimate. Marriage discrimination laws get judged not on the alleged merit of some state interest in procreation, but on the fact that they target a minority with the express purpose of treating them differently. Intent (motive) is an essential part of the law, so any claim that a law is illegitimate because it requires determining intent is specious on the face of it.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    A few years ago I was trying to talk to somebody about why there should be hate-crimes laws...not face to face, but in an email...and I was very surprised when I actually found me talking myself AWAY from that opinion.

    Crime IS crime, assault is assault, murder is murder...no matter what its origin.
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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by frankfrank View Post
    … I actually found me talking myself AWAY from that opinion.

    Crime IS crime, assault is assault, murder is murder...no matter what its origin.
    I disagree with the way hate crime laws are formulated, but that’s more discussion than my time currently allows.

    One point though – If a perpetrator sets out to find a random person of specific characterization/demographics to harm, because the perpetrator dislikes persons who can be thus characterized, then regardless of the specific harm inflicted – the primary motivation for the crime is indeed hatred.

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by frankfrank View Post
    ....Crime IS crime, assault is assault, murder is murder...no matter what its origin.
    This is exactly backwards from the way our criminal law works, there are legal distinctions based on intent and kinds of actions, presence of this or that, location, context, etc, that make one theft not another and one killing capital murder and one justifiable homicide.

    And in fact, murder isn't always just murder.

    I can't think of anything more frightening than living under a criminal system that ignores intent and context and uses the idea that all thefts are equal, all murders are equal, if you get a speeding ticket, that's no different from vehicular manslaughter - a moving violation is a moving violation - execute!
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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by opinterph View Post
    I disagree with the way hate crime laws are formulated, but that’s more discussion than my time currently allows.

    One point though – If a perpetrator sets out to find a random person of specific characterization/demographics to harm, because the perpetrator dislikes persons who can be thus characterized, then regardless of the specific harm inflicted – the primary motivation for the crime is indeed hatred.
    Additionally, persecuting such offenses only in the ordinary way that any people commit them under any and all circumstances means that certain demographics remain consistently higher targets of specific types of assaults or crimes simply because of what kind of people they are. It's a passive lack of equal protection.

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by frankfrank View Post
    A few years ago I was trying to talk to somebody about why there should be hate-crimes laws...not face to face, but in an email...and I was very surprised when I actually found me talking myself AWAY from that opinion.

    Crime IS crime, assault is assault, murder is murder...no matter what its origin.
    Except it isn't. Yes, the death itself, or the assault itself, is the same, but we punish intent all the time, in fact our system of laws depends on it. For an interesting window into that, there's a movie called Absence of Malice, which does a decent job of illustrating how the concept of malice is integral to a lot of law -- it's a concept that predates the Magna Carta, in fact, if you want to look at it historically.

    The interesting thing is that the more I look at all law, the more hate crimes laws are no big deal. Of course from a libertarian point of view, a hate crime isn't just another crime because it's taking the concept of denying another person their very humanity into practice -- and individual humanity is the essence of libertarianism. Hate crime is really just a small conceptual step away from slavery.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by opinterph View Post
    I disagree with the way hate crime laws are formulated, but that’s more discussion than my time currently allows.

    One point though – If a perpetrator sets out to find a random person of specific characterization/demographics to harm, because the perpetrator dislikes persons who can be thus characterized, then regardless of the specific harm inflicted – the primary motivation for the crime is indeed hatred.
    Ah, intent -- which reminds me, I have to call in for jury duty. As the orientation set out, determining intent is an essential part of judging the facts.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by xbuzzerx View Post
    Additionally, persecuting such offenses only in the ordinary way that any people commit them under any and all circumstances means that certain demographics remain consistently higher targets of specific types of assaults or crimes simply because of what kind of people they are. It's a passive lack of equal protection.
    Yep -- and that's an excellent point!. Under such a system, it would be possible to organize a pogrom or even genocide within a country, and no one would ever get charged with anything more than murder.

    It's really, when you think about it, why "conspiracy to commit" is a distinct crime.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    deplore what Sterling said, but it was in the privacy of his home- person who recorded and made it public is scum...are we all going to have to watch every word we say....forget about the Government being Big Brother...our friends and neighbors are!

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    Rambunctiously Pugnacious JayHawk's Avatar
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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by alxwhtmr95 View Post
    deplore what Sterling said, but it was in the privacy of his home- person who recorded and made it public is scum...are we all going to have to watch every word we say....forget about the Government being Big Brother...our friends and neighbors are!
    Not just our friends. Just consider that our bought and sold personal information, that was already being collected by large internet corporations, is the exact thing we are pissed the government has access to but do not say a word about the massive collection by folks for profit.
    Everyone can be great, because everyone can serve.
    ~ Martin Luther King, Jr.


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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by JayHawk View Post
    Not just our friends. Just consider that our bought and sold personal information, that was already being collected by large internet corporations, is the exact thing we are pissed the government has access to but do not say a word about the massive collection by folks for profit.
    The two are linked -- it's the government that tells us that all our personal information belongs to others.

    In a just world, every time a bit of information about us is used or passed around, we'd get paid for it.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    JUB Addict maxpowr9's Avatar
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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by alxwhtmr95 View Post
    deplore what Sterling said, but it was in the privacy of his home- person who recorded and made it public is scum...are we all going to have to watch every word we say....forget about the Government being Big Brother...our friends and neighbors are!
    That's always how it's been. How many times have neighbors called the police because someone was having a loud party late at night?

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by maxpowr9 View Post
    That's always how it's been. How many times have neighbors called the police because someone was having a loud party late at night?
    That's a bit different than exposing someone's 'private' thoughts to the world.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    I had a thought on this and wondered your opinion as I try to put it in context. How does this story play out any differently if instead of a recording the person submitted a sworn affidavit? The only real difference I see is the recording makes it harder for him to refute.
    Under democracy one party always devotes its chief energies to trying to prove that the other party is unfit to rule - and both commonly succeed, and are right. H. L. Mencken US editor (1880 - 1956)

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    Re: Bill Maher talks sense about Sterling

    Quote Originally Posted by Stardreamer View Post
    I had a thought on this and wondered your opinion as I try to put it in context. How does this story play out any differently if instead of a recording the person submitted a sworn affidavit? The only real difference I see is the recording makes it harder for him to refute.
    I think a sworn affidavit only counts if you're an expert in something. A recording is presumed to be the real goods.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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