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  1. #1
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    "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    The Family Research Council (Tony Perkins, President) is now using the phrase "Natural Marriage" instead of "Traditional Marriage." A clever PR ploy.

    ... the culture warriors at the Family Research Council have been hawking their National Campaign in Defense of Natural Marriage. In multiple email calls to arms, FRC president Tony Perkins is urging people of “character and values” to “take a stand” by signing an on-line petition and, while they’re at it, donating a little something to this “counteroffensive.”
    ....
    As political rhetoric goes, “natural marriage” is ever so much more evocative—and, better yet, provocative—than the more commonly employed term “traditional marriage.” After all, plenty of folks would be amenable to, or perhaps even charmed by, the idea of an untraditional marriage. An unnatural marriage, by contrast, brings to mind all manner of unsavory couplings—like, for instance, the man-on-dog action that keeps Rick Santorum up at night. And, indeed, defenders of “natural marriage” talk a lot about how gay marriage is an affront to God’s “natural law.”

    http://news.yahoo.com/frc-natural-ma...-politics.html [The Daily Beast]
    Well, if you're losing, alter the definition to make it sound better.

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Doesn't matter because the underlying reasons are the same. It's the lipstick-on-a-pig mentality that the GOP thinks works but doesn't in actuality.

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    mmmm "Natural"
    These ass holes have too much time on their hands thinking about other people's marriage.


    NEVER LISTEN TO A ONE SIDED STORY AND JUDGE.

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by palbert View Post
    The Family Research Council (Tony Perkins, President) is now using the phrase "Natural Marriage" instead of "Traditional Marriage." A clever PR ploy.



    Well, if you're losing, alter the definition to make it sound better.
    Yes but that description doesn't really sound any better if you think of it. The bigoted thinking behind it is too obvious when you think about it to much. For that matter, the Human social custom called marriage is not natural in any way shape or form, animals don't have marriages even in the cases where they mate for life.
    Under democracy one party always devotes its chief energies to trying to prove that the other party is unfit to rule - and both commonly succeed, and are right. H. L. Mencken US editor (1880 - 1956)

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Lipstick on a pig still makes it a pig. This will fool no one.

  6. #6
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    I would like to turn the tables on them and demand to know why they insist on defining anything for everyone else? I don't even understand why they insist on defining the conversation. So far...it has been a fail....and another fail...and another fail.

    Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results = insanity according to Albert Einstein. I agree with him.

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    I think the thing to do is to start referring to homo marriage as 'cultivated' marriage.

    There's more than one antonym for natural.

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    I'm quite happy to be the exception to Tony Perkins' rules.

    I quite like "exceptional" marriage.

  9. #9
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by maxpowr9 View Post
    Doesn't matter because the underlying reasons are the same. It's the lipstick-on-a-pig mentality that the GOP thinks works but doesn't in actuality.
    This........

  10. #10
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by rareboy View Post
    I think the thing to do is to start referring to homo marriage as 'cultivated' marriage.

    There's more than one antonym for natural.
    We don't need an antonym. As strategies go, I think it is easier just for us to own the word "natural."

    The tradition of heterosexual marriage is relatively well grounded in fact. They can have that word. We've mocked it to death already by talking about all the great traditions of marriage: women as property; no interracial marriage; getting to marry your slave, etc. Most people have woken up to the fact that they don't really want a traditional marriage.

    But natural marriage is already ours, and I can easily picture the ad campaign that would demolish their stupidity. I hope they invest the last of their savings in it.

    All we need to do is tell the stories of people falling for each other in the same way that any couple does and each ad would end with a proposal and "Naturally, I said yes."

    We are naturally gay. We naturally want to get married. Their word-smithing will drive their titanic of a campaign into an iceberg.

    In fact you don't even have to focus too closely on the gay couple, which might be smart in some ad markets. You could have the straight guy narrating. "My brother asked me to stand up at his wedding. Naturally, I said yes."

    By the end of this campaign, gay people will so totally own the word "naturally" that these bigots won't know what hit them.
    Last edited by bankside; March 28th, 2014 at 07:45 AM.
    Americans need to keep their guns so they can protect themselves from gun violence just like Nancy Lanza did. And like Chris Kyle did. And like Gabby Giffords did. And like Tom Clements did. And like Michael Piemonte. And Joseph Wilcox.

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    .
    Translation of the main idea of this thread:
    With all the states sanctioning equality of marriage, the Bible wankers are scared shitless. Think of a drowning man grasping for straws.

    Why should anyone have to know anything? - Sheldon Cooper

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by bankside View Post
    Their word-smithing will drive their titanic of a campaign into an iceberg.
    Using the Titanic as metaphor intrigues me. The hymn that was being played while the Titanic was sinking was "Nearer My God to Thee."

    Why should anyone have to know anything? - Sheldon Cooper

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"


    Why should anyone have to know anything? - Sheldon Cooper

  14. #14
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by Stardreamer View Post
    animals don't have marriages even in the cases where they mate for life.
    DUH!!!! clearly you've never heard of ANIMAL HUSBANDRY!!

  15. #15
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by LuvFindsAndyHardy View Post
    DUH!!!! clearly you've never heard of ANIMAL HUSBANDRY!!
    Both husband and husbandry descend from a German word meaning manager.

  16. #16
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by Alnitak View Post
    Both husband and husbandry descend from a German word meaning manager.
    I now pronounce you manager and subordinate

  17. #17
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by palbert View Post
    The Family Research Council (Tony Perkins, President) is now using the phrase "Natural Marriage" instead of "Traditional Marriage." A clever PR ploy.



    Well, if you're losing, alter the definition to make it sound better.
    To quote Dr. Elizabeth Vandiver on her Great Courses lecture on Classical Mythology. There is nothing natural about marriage. It is completely a human construct that varies in different cultures and in fact it is probably the most unnatural thing in humans.

    As for traditional marriage their own Bible promotes polygyny as natural and traditional and in fact there were some cultures that actually had gay marriage. So again they do not know what they are talking about.

  18. #18
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    These bigots can try their scheming all they want, but they've lost.
    #439th oldest member on JUB.

  19. #19
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by andysayshi View Post
    I'm quite happy to be the exception to Tony Perkins' rules.

    I quite like "exceptional" marriage.
    I like this as well.

  20. #20
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by rareboy View Post
    I think the thing to do is to start referring to homo marriage as 'cultivated' marriage.

    There's more than one antonym for natural.
    How about "loving marriage".


    I saw this new term in an email I got from Perkins asking me to support "natural marriage". I emailed back that changing the term doesn't make a difference, he's still arguing about government marriage, which according to Jesus we're supposed to leave alone, since government = Caesar and we're to let Caesar take care of Caesar's stuff -- and Christians are supposed to take care of God's stuff. I tried to word it to indicate that he isn't doing his job.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    ^Why are you signed up for the FRC's newsletter?

  22. #22
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by mightbe View Post
    ^Why are you signed up for the FRC's newsletter?
    Keep you friend's newlsetter close, keep you enemy's newsletter closer

  23. #23
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    How about "loving marriage".


    I saw this new term in an email I got from Perkins asking me to support "natural marriage". I emailed back that changing the term doesn't make a difference, he's still arguing about government marriage, which according to Jesus we're supposed to leave alone, since government = Caesar and we're to let Caesar take care of Caesar's stuff -- and Christians are supposed to take care of God's stuff. I tried to word it to indicate that he isn't doing his job.
    Even though it will likely fall on deaf ears it's still good that you try to challenge his perspective with a much more Christlike one. Maybe someday some of these people will finally get it, though I'm not betting any ranches .
    unofficial official mini meet Friday- Saturday April 11-12, 2014

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by bort138 View Post
    I now pronounce you manager and subordinate
    This was pretty much the idea of marriage since the dawn of civilization until the 1960s.

    Quote Originally Posted by bort138 View Post
    Keep you friend's newlsetter close, keep you enemy's newsletter closer
    Exactly.

  25. #25
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by Sausy View Post
    Even though it will likely fall on deaf ears it's still good that you try to challenge his perspective with a much more Christlike one. Maybe someday some of these people will finally get it, though I'm not betting any ranches .
    Agreed.
    That said I think gay marriages in traditional attire are really beautiful

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Traditional japanese marriage..jpg 
Views:	23 
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    Last edited by Scealle; March 30th, 2014 at 05:59 AM.

  26. #26
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by bort138 View Post
    Keep you friend's newlsetter close, keep you enemy's newsletter closer
    Hah!
    .
    .
    .
    .
    Americans need to keep their guns so they can protect themselves from gun violence just like Nancy Lanza did. And like Chris Kyle did. And like Gabby Giffords did. And like Tom Clements did. And like Michael Piemonte. And Joseph Wilcox.

  27. #27

    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by eastofeden View Post
    I would like to turn the tables on them and demand to know why they insist on defining anything for everyone else? I don't even understand why they insist on defining the conversation. So far...it has been a fail....and another fail...and another fail.
    Simple. Follow the money.

  28. #28
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by mightbe View Post
    ^Why are you signed up for the FRC's newsletter?
    It's a good way to know what they're up to.

    It's also frequently good for laughs.

    Once, in about five years, they actually had a valid point to make.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  29. #29
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by bort138 View Post
    Keep you friend's newlsetter close, keep you enemy's newsletter closer
    Good way to put it.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  30. #30
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by Keeland View Post
    Simple. Follow the money.
    Not really.

    They have a view of God that says He'll always bring them "victory". Now, while that can be argued from the Bible, what can't be argued is their understanding of the word "victory". They forget that by the Bible's view, this is victory:

    WARNING: Image linked below contains content some viewers may find disturbing.
    http://churchreflections.com/blog/wp...he_christ1.jpg

    They want God to make them "winners", but they want it to be on the terms of human success -- coming out on top in their undertakings. And since one of their core beliefs is that He will do so, when that doesn't happen they have to look around and try to find another strategy, because obviously they didn't do something right, and they just have to find the right formula and then God will "bless" their efforts. They're like drowning men grasping at what they can in a flood, trying one thing after another to keep themselves afloat.

    What they don't realize is that they've fallen to the level of the gods the Old Testament denounces -- gods who can, to put it bluntly, be bought or bought off, for whom you just have to have the right formula or the right ritual, and the god will do your bidding.

    As the Bible itself says, they have the form of godliness, but not the substance. If they had the substance, they wouldn't ever think in terms of battle in the first place, unless they went into it intending to lose everything they have for the sake of someone else. Since they don't, they pedal furiously and get nowhere.
    Last edited by opinterph; March 31st, 2014 at 03:12 PM. Reason: changed linked image to clickable link; added content warning

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by Alnitak View Post
    Both husband and husbandry descend from a German word meaning manager.
    It was a joke, son.

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by LuvFindsAndyHardy View Post
    It was a joke, son.
    And etymology is fascinating.

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by Alnitak View Post
    And etymology is fascinating.
    What do bugs have to do with anything?

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by LuvFindsAndyHardy View Post
    What do bugs have to do with anything?
    One made you misread the big word?

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by LuvFindsAndyHardy View Post
    What do bugs have to do with anything?
    That's entomology, or are you just jerking my chain?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    One made you misread the big word?
    Stephen Hawking does not do make up.

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by Alnitak View Post
    That's entomology, or are you just jerking my chain?
    Yes, I'm jerking your chain

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    entomology: the study of Ents

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Aristotle coined the term εντομον - entomon - from tome the Greek word for 'cut', referring to the cut or pinched look of an insect's segmented body.
    Last edited by Alnitak; April 2nd, 2014 at 01:34 PM.

  39. #39

    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    The entombment of ologys.

  40. #40
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Natural marriage....

    would be marriage that comes from people doing what they do naturally.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  41. #41
    JUB Addict bort138's Avatar
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    Natural marriage....

    would be marriage that comes from people doing what they do naturally.
    It's still trading one fallacy for another. First it was "appeal to tradition" and now they're trying "appeal to nature". Even if they accepted that homosexuality was a natural trait, this would be a very weak argument in favor of same sex marriages.

  42. #42
    Oranje rareboy's Avatar
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    ^ I think this was/is their tactical error.

    Marriage is not a 'natural' state.

    Homosexuality is recognized by most intelligent and educated people now as a natural state. Even the Catholic Church does...they just tell us that we can't act on it.

  43. #43
    Bammer's Papa
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by bort138 View Post
    It's still trading one fallacy for another. First it was "appeal to tradition" and now they're trying "appeal to nature". Even if they accepted that homosexuality was a natural trait, this would be a very weak argument in favor of same sex marriages.
    You missed the point.

    Natural marriage would be what comes from people doing what they do naturally. Over history, people have joined themselves together in a variety of forms. People naturally join together. Whatever form they do so in is therefore natural.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  44. #44
    Bammer's Papa
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    Re: "Natural Marriage" Replaces "Traditional Marriage"

    Quote Originally Posted by rareboy View Post
    ^ I think this was/is their tactical error.

    Marriage is not a 'natural' state.
    Of course it is, unless you want to maintain that all the long-term joining of people in commitment to each other of whatever level they choose/chose has been due to coercion.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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