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Thread: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

      
   
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    2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    I voted for Obama both times, although in truth I contributed more to Hillary that Obama, so my asking the title question indicates a certain disaffection.

    ACA:He seems to have been clueless - or at least moribund - about the impending debacle that was the implementation of the ACA.

    NSA:He seems to have been clueless - or moribund - about the implications of the NSA reach and consequences. To examine the situation he names a non-reformist bent panel.

    Syria: Having drawn a colorful line he dithered -- and let Putin and Syria steal the march. (And why didn't he steal the march if NSA is able to learn so much?)

    Keystone: An other dither. Decide something, anything, but decide.

    Larry Summers: Completely unaware of the consensus tidal wave.

    So, I wonder if he has a clue about his administrations activities.

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    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    Depends on who you ask. To some he is clueless, to others he is diabolical and behind everything. You will never know the truth, only what others think is the truth. I don't believe for one minute the POTUS see's everything that is going on, that is why you have "people" and advisors, that is their job. Its like at a job, you have a manager who manages the employees, then you have a Sr Manager who manages the manager but doesn't know what the employees are always doing unless the manager tells them and the General Manager doesn't know what employees are doing unless they are told by the Sr/Managers. You just have to hope the people you chose to look over projects are doing the job and reporting relevant information to you, at least that is my take. But in the end, no matter the endgame, the GM (POTUS) is responsible for how everything pans out in the end...but still in the position to hold the Sr/Managers accountable.
    He got that thickness, the kind that make you get up makin' biscuits with breakfast, so gone - Jill Scott - So Gone

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    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    Now with this just breaking Iran deal, which he and Kerry seem to want... more than the Iranians,if that's possible... an utter disgrace meant to be a community organizer, or tenured college professor. Not a president of the US. Certainly NOT A Washington, Lincoln, Roosevelt(EITHER) or a Truman. Not even a Clinton.
    unofficial official mini meet Friday- Saturday April 11-12, 2014

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    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    Quote Originally Posted by justdra View Post
    Depends on who you ask. To some he is clueless, to others he is diabolical and behind everything. You will never know the truth, only what others think is the truth. I don't believe for one minute the POTUS see's everything that is going on, that is why you have "people" and advisors, that is their job. Its like at a job, you have a manager who manages the employees, then you have a Sr Manager who manages the manager but doesn't know what the employees are always doing unless the manager tells them and the General Manager doesn't know what employees are doing unless they are told by the Sr/Managers. You just have to hope the people you chose to look over projects are doing the job and reporting relevant information to you, at least that is my take. But in the end, no matter the endgame, the GM (POTUS) is responsible for how everything pans out in the end...but still in the position to hold the Sr/Managers accountable.
    As Kennedy learned to his regret at the time of the Bay of Pigs, the POTUS who fails to ask the hard questions also fails to get the needed answers. A manager in a bubble surrounded by yes men fools no one but himself. I suspect Obama has let himself become a prisoner of that bubble - and needs to run down the hallway shouting "what the hell is going on around here?" much more frequently. He seems content to "swell a progress" but hesitant to probe the bottom line.

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    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    Quote Originally Posted by palbert View Post
    I voted for Obama both times, although in truth I contributed more to Hillary that Obama, so my asking the title question indicates a certain disaffection.

    ACA:He seems to have been clueless - or at least moribund - about the impending debacle that was the implementation of the ACA.

    NSA:He seems to have been clueless - or moribund - about the implications of the NSA reach and consequences. To examine the situation he names a non-reformist bent panel.

    Syria: Having drawn a colorful line he dithered -- and let Putin and Syria steal the march. (And why didn't he steal the march if NSA is able to learn so much?)

    Keystone: An other dither. Decide something, anything, but decide.

    Larry Summers: Completely unaware of the consensus tidal wave.

    So, I wonder if he has a clue about his administrations activities.
    you are one tough cookie, hes juggling knives you know.

    I never doubt the president, we still have him for 3.5 years -thank god, the best is yet to come.

    Every one of his strategies worked to his benefit.

    Republican attacks strengthen the president, they despise him because hes effective and have ruined themselves in the process.

    He beat Hillary.

    He won re-election, got Osama, passed healthcare reform- arguably the biggest accomplishment in many peoples lifetime, Dodd-Frank, no terror attacks, avoided default.

    These are not small accomplishments, they are huge and and hard won victories for the American people.

    Democrats sacrificed their careers to pass these bills, republicans were busy getting drunk and doing cocaine to notice 9-11 and the catastrophe in Iraq, the housing bubble, the biggest tax brake to the 1% ever recorded.

    Obama has always known, hes a man of great moral character.

    Romney had no conscience, McCain sold his own soul.

    America is better off with Obama, no matter how hard the establishment tries to make him something hes not he has been there for us. He is keenly aware of what is at stake in our lives.

    Even republicans support his positions more than their own party, what does that tell you?

    Bush got a C and ditched the national guard. Obama was president of the harvard law review and in the senate for less than 4 years before he became pres. This man is an amazing figure.
    Last edited by evanrick; November 24th, 2013 at 08:06 PM.
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    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    "That’s the good thing about being president. I can do whatever I want.” Barack Obama, 2-10-14

  7. #7

    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    Under our system, the talents to get elected, looking good, reading well from the teleprompter, and having no history to explain, are not the talents needed to be a President.
    For instance, he did not lead on health care. He campaigned on the promise then left it entirely up to Congress to design the system, with his promise to make speeches for it and sign it. As far as we know, he had little to do with the actual design of the system.

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    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    Quote Originally Posted by Benvolio View Post
    Under our system, the talents to get elected, looking good, reading well from the teleprompter, and having no history to explain, are not the talents needed to be a President.
    For instance, he did not lead on health care. He campaigned on the promise then left it entirely up to Congress to design the system, with his promise to make speeches for it and sign it. As far as we know, he had little to do with the actual design of the system.
    Based on those criteria, do you believe Mitt Romney was running on a more concrete base?
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    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    Know? He didn't know because the top staff kept those things from him.

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    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    Alnitak, in an other thread, has favored us with a list Politico submits (with reasons) should be fired over ACA implementation: http://www.politico.com/magazine/sto...ov-100080.html.

    Now for the life of me I cannot deem competent - or present even - a chief executive who has not lopped off some heads. This administration demonstrates that in a bureaucracy one rises to the highest level of one's incompetence.

    The only person in this administration who has demonstrated the slightest competence and integrity is the Solicitor General, who has had to wring the neck of NSA and Justice for letting him mislead the Supreme Court. http://www.techdirt.com/articles/201...mericans.shtml (for SG's past and current problem).

    Revisiting the opening post I defy even Obama's staunchest defender to say anything other that "he was better than both of the other guys."

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    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    Developing:

    The WSJournal reports Gen. Alexander offered to resign. He was refused so as not to hand Snowden a victory. (!!)

    One of the really big questions many of us have had throughout the revelations of the NSA's scandals is how the hell have Director of National Intelligence James Clapper and NSA boss Keith Alexander kept their jobs through all of this. ... So now it's come out, via a report by Siobhan Gorman in the Wall Street Journal, that Alexander did, in fact, offer to resign but that the White House rejected the request, because they didn't want to hand Snowden a victory.

    http://www.techdirt.com/articles/201...n-to-win.shtml
    An endorsement of the Peter Principle AND Hanlon's Razor at the same time.

  12. #12

    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alnitak View Post
    Know? He didn't know because the top staff kept those things from him.
    If my top staff continually kept things from me and made me look like an idiot -- I think I'd fire my staff. Unless I was lying and fully knew what was going on.

    Saying 'I'd didn't know' can't work forever.
    "That’s the good thing about being president. I can do whatever I want.” Barack Obama, 2-10-14

  13. #13

    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alnitak View Post
    Know? He didn't know because the top staff kept those things from him.
    I would agree that his appointments have been poorly chosen, usually by affirmative action, but he has refused to fire people even when he learns of their incompetence. No one has been fired for the Obamacare computer debacle, for example.

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    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    Absolutely, yes men need to go.

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    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    Quote Originally Posted by Benvolio View Post
    I would agree that his appointments have been poorly chosen, usually by affirmative action, but he has refused to fire people even when he learns of their incompetence. No one has been fired for the Obamacare computer debacle, for example.
    Aaaand, another racist post by Benvolio. "Usually by affirmative action"? I'm not even gonna ask for source on this one, as it's impossible for you to prove it. So I'm just gonna report you.
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    Re: 2nd Term Thoughts: What Did Obama Know and When Did He Know It?

    Quote Originally Posted by palbert View Post
    Alnitak, in an other thread, has favored us with a list Politico submits (with reasons) should be fired over ACA implementation: http://www.politico.com/magazine/sto...ov-100080.html.

    Now for the life of me I cannot deem competent - or present even - a chief executive who has not lopped off some heads. This administration demonstrates that in a bureaucracy one rises to the highest level of one's incompetence.

    The only person in this administration who has demonstrated the slightest competence and integrity is the Solicitor General, who has had to wring the neck of NSA and Justice for letting him mislead the Supreme Court. http://www.techdirt.com/articles/201...mericans.shtml (for SG's past and current problem).

    Revisiting the opening post I defy even Obama's staunchest defender to say anything other that "he was better than both of the other guys."
    Neither Parkinson's Law and the Peter Principle have ever had finer examples.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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