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  1. #1
    Virgin ricardomon's Avatar
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    Should I Feel Guilty About Not Intending to Come Out?

    A few weeks ago I was having my yearly check-up at the doctor and found myself, for the first time in my life, admit to someone that I was gay. Then, as I explained why I was still closeted, I began to feel borderline guilt and shame. Was it right that I felt this way or should I embrace my hesitation?

    Some background info, I am in my mid-20s, gay (as I said), and live in a large midwestern city. I have an openly gay uncle and brother, so it is not as if I live in an unaccepting family. Also, none of my friends are anti-gay. Still, I am hesitant to come out because I don't want people to think of me any differently just because I am gay; and when I say differently I don't mean that they would think any less of me, I mean different. There is also the fact that I don't foresee being in any type of relationship any time soon, for two reasons...

    First off, I have social anxiety disorder, as in diagnosed by a psychiatrist and on medicine anxiety. This limits occasions for meeting anyone as I really don't find it very enjoyable. I can be very sociable with a small group of friends, but I am not a big fan of parties and bars and clubs are even less appealing as I don't drink. This is more of a minor hurdle (in comparison to reason #2) as it is possible that I could meet someone who I could hate going to parties with together.

    My main trait that leads me to believe I will likely never be in a relationship is that I also have obsessive compulsive disorder (OCD). Part of my OCD is that I have a fear of germs, germphobia is the completely unscientific term for it. So, for example, I don't like to shake peoples hands or open door, but I can deal with it. However, there are tons of things that I won't do because they are "germy."

    So do to the combination of these two disorders I have never even kissed a guy (or girl for that matter.) I could though, the thought of making out doesn't bother me, and I think I'd be fine with blow jobs. Anything further though is basically out of the picture. The only real way to overcome OCD is through desensitization; working your way up to facing the thing you fear through gradual steps, but I don't really see how it is possible to gradually work your way up to anything anal when you don't even like to shake people's hands. So this rules out sex, and while a sexless relationship may be possible for some people, I don't think it is very realistic.

    So even though I don't think I will ever actually be in a relationship with another man, is it wrong not to want to come out?

  2. #2
    Exactly what on a chain? TopherGF's Avatar
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    Re: Should I Feel Guilty About Not Intending to Come Out?

    I think that your hurdles are not as steep as they seem. I have similar issues, though not professionally diagnosed and I'm not as fastidious about germs. I don't like crowds, I can't stand bars or clubbing. There are plenty of people out there who would be receptive to what you have to offer. I myself could be very happy in a relationship without anal sex. It's not the end-all-be-all of a relationship.

    I would say that it doesn't matter whether or not you intend to have a relationship with another man, your family can be very supportive, and they might well be hurt, if they ever found out, that you never told them. The same thing happened with my brother. He waited years after I came out to tell them. None of us really understood why. But it's an irrational fear, really. Just like germs. If nothing else, I would say discuss the issue with your therapist.

  3. #3
    JUB Addict Georgiadude's Avatar
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    Re: Should I Feel Guilty About Not Intending to Come Out?

    I think you're setting yourself up for a long, lonely, miserable life. You can't do this because of that. You can't do that because of this. It sounds like you have a good support network but you don't want to take the chance and open the door. I'm not saying you have to come out. That's your decision but I think the reasons you've posted for not doing it sound more like excuses or rationalizations. Just step back and look at it for a while. There are many gay guys with ocd or not into anal. Just be honest with the guys you're with. Why live a long lonely life. Be who you are and be happy.

    Steven

  4. #4

    Re: Should I Feel Guilty About Not Intending to Come Out?

    The main reason remaining for me to not coming out to people is that at the moment i don't have any reason to, but i have no doubt "everyone knows"..... 44, never been married or had a g/f....i like to knit !

    But if i ever find myself in a meaningful relationship with another man, it would probably be no problem then at that point to "come out".

    In other words, do what feels right for you, now and in the future. Unless somebody else is paying your bills, don't worry about it .

    Good luck !

  5. #5
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    Re: Should I Feel Guilty About Not Intending to Come Out?

    Don't come out if you're not ready. It's that simple. Don't force it just because everybody is doing it or that it's in fashion.

    You remind me of an ex. Honestly, learn to drink once in a while. Be a social drinker - not a drunk (two very different qualities). Social drinking lowers inhibitions and loosens you up. Trust me, it works. It can even get you promoted, lol and get along better with people.

    Go on grindr and give a cute guy a handjob while slightly tipsy. Kiss. Suck his dick. It's all downhill from there baby
    Last edited by bruce379; October 12th, 2013 at 02:13 AM.

  6. #6
    I'm now a grandfather! JUB Moderator Seasoned's Avatar
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    Re: Should I Feel Guilty About Not Intending to Come Out?

    You did come out, to your doctor and that's a tremendously good thing in case some type of sexual activity is in your future. Congrats on facing that hurdle, which, by the way, can be very difficult to do.

    Life is about choice and freedom to do or not do and then we live with the consequences. My feeling is that when we don't come out we make being gay a burden because that's what secrets are. Having a secret and then hiding it 24/7 becomes a greater weight day by day. I think your focus ought to be working with an excellent psychiatrist to find the correct medication(s) and dosage that will work for you and a good therapist to help with the social issues.

    You're also free to define sex anyway you wish. I define it as having an orgasm, not how I have one.

    I'm 67 and I think it's a huge mistake to rule things out in life by assuming outcomes and consequences. No matter what you think now, life moves like wildfire. We are not here a lot longer than we are here. Take advantage of all life has to offer and that, my friend, is regret prevention.
    Last edited by Seasoned; October 12th, 2013 at 03:43 AM.
    "Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."--Dr. Seuss

  7. #7
    Slut Special K's Avatar
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    Re: Should I Feel Guilty About Not Intending to Come Out?

    Well if it's any consolation, I think you and I would make the perfect couple, we have so many things in common (i.e. the social anxiety, the OCD, the germphobia, the fear of anal sex etc...). It just goes to show that you are not alone and there is no reason why you can't have a meaningful relationship with someone else, in spite of your issues, because there are others out there just like you in the gay community (me and TopherGF being two such examples). And yes we have issues, but who doesn't, we can work through those issues (or around them if need be) and still have a loving relationship, because love prevails above all else.

  8. #8
    nerd of prey hylas's Avatar
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    Re: Should I Feel Guilty About Not Intending to Come Out?

    I generally think people should be out. The more visibility, the better. Yes, it's not just a personal matter, but a wider, political one.

    Some people have perfectly good reasons to not be out. Do you? I don't know. I admit I know little about the disorders you have.

    But you have an out gay brother? Come on, man, just come out already.

    Whether ot not you're ever going to have sex or find love isn't even relevant. You have to live your life as yourself. Closetted life is hell, and by staying in it, you're just heaping more misery on yourself.

  9. #9
    JUB Addict journo25's Avatar
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    Re: Should I Feel Guilty About Not Intending to Come Out?

    You are luckier than most in having a gay brother and uncle, and a supportive, non-judgmental family. If you felt relieved sharing the news with your doctor, act on the momentum and tell your family. As others have said, I don't believe your issues are insurmountable.

  10. #10
    Virgin ricardomon's Avatar
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    Re: Should I Feel Guilty About Not Intending to Come Out?

    Thanks for all the replies! I really appreciate you sharing your thoughts and experience, they have given me a lot to think over. I am actually really glad that there is a mix of opinions. It forces me to really think through my situation, which can only stand to help me grow as a person.

    Special thanks to TopherGF and Special K! I don't know why I didn't give much consideration to the possibility that there would be others that would either be averse to anal or that would actually have OCD with germphobia. It has given me hope that I won't have to resign to what Gerogiadude very bluntly (but not necessarily inaccurately) referred to as a "long, lonely, miserable life."

  11. #11
    PerScientiam AdJustitiam bankside's Avatar
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    Re: Should I Feel Guilty About Not Intending to Come Out?

    Quote Originally Posted by ricardomon View Post
    This is more of a minor hurdle (in comparison to reason #2) as it is possible that I could meet someone who I could hate going to parties with together.
    This was funny. Your sense of humour will be charming to someone.

    I'm sure you will find someone who does not enjoy going out. I was just visiting friends in another city. We talked about another couple, mutual friends. They just don't go out very much. To my knowledge, neither of them has anxiety issues, they just prefer a quiet evening at home. So the most anyone sees them is every six months out for dinner at a quiet restaurant or preferably just a casual evening at a friend's for dinner. You'd never see them at a dance club or something like that. And no one objects to that. Everyone just enjoys catching up since the last time. No one is offended that their social life is at a slower pace.

    Also, there are lots of guys who don't enjoy anal sex, most of whom do not have OCD. I love it. I love the sensations for me and my guy.

    I also think I have a rational and healthy approach to hygiene. In that way it is possible to see problems and opportunities with each of our sexual organs.

    Thus the mouth and tongue can be a great opportunity for pleasure, either in making out or for a blow job. There is no problem with the natural flora in the mouth of someone healthy, who practices good basic hygiene. But the mouth can also be unpleasant, and there are obviously wrong times to do something. Obviously, I couldn't enjoy making out with, or getting a blowjob from, someone who just threw up. That is just common sense. Even though his mouth is normally fresh and hygienic and healthy, timing is everything.

    It is the same with a penis. If my guy had not showered for two days, I would not be giving him a blowjob. There are obvious times when the penis can be a source of mutual pleasure, but obviously other times which are not suitable. It has pleasurable functions (ejaculation) and waste functions (urination).

    That brings us to anal sex. I understand its pleasurable functions, but I also am aware of its less pleasant duties. It can be a source of thrilling sexual sensations and intimacy. But it can also be a source of hydrogen sulfide and fecal bacteria, and the unpleasant and unerotic consequences of having sex at the wrong time in the digestive cycle. Again, these things are just factors of the anatomical function to be addressed. Eat a healthy diet and pick the right time and many of the issues go away. And while the bacterial environment of the mouth is healthy, and the bacterial environment of the anus is healthy, it's not healthy for the two to interact. So basically, don't have the two interact during anal sex. My guy and I pick a time when we can shower afterward, and urination is also a good idea. It cleans the area just as you would expect to do by washing your hands after using the toilet. Of course the whole rimming thing is out, on grounds of hygiene (and I just don't consider it erotic). Just everyday hygiene takes care of the issues in this area as with any other part of the sexual anatomy.

    So if you find it erotic, consider that, and try not to let OCD stand in your way when ordinary hygiene can open the doors to great pleasure. If you don't find it erotic, don't worry about it. Lots of guys like different things, and not everyone needs to have anal sex in his life.

    As for coming out, the idea is that so their family will change their views of you. Right now they maybe assume you are straight. Or they assume you are aloof and remote because beyond just an adult level of privacy, you never share any details of your personal life. It's normal to be able to tell your family that you've met a great person. Or that you're looking for one. This means coming out, and changing their views of you. But it gives them a chance to change their views for the better as they know you better.
    Last edited by bankside; October 14th, 2013 at 09:39 AM.
    Americans need to keep their guns so they can protect themselves from gun violence just like Nancy Lanza did. And like Chris Kyle did. And like Gabby Giffords did. And like Tom Clements did. And like Michael Piemonte. And Joseph Wilcox.

  12. #12
    Execuvette Rolyo85's Avatar
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    Re: Should I Feel Guilty About Not Intending to Come Out?

    To answer the original question - no, you should not feel guilty for being in the closet. Because here's the thing. While I agree with hylas that being out is in a way also political, and that people SHOULD be out, in the end coming out is not for somebody else, it's not for "when you're in a relationship" or whatever. It's for you and how you choose to see yourself.

    Living the Big Lie is a burden, and one that we carry for so long that it becomes an indistinguishable part of who we are and we aren't aware of how much it was affecting us until it goes away. On that note, I believe being closeted adds to your other issues, clinically diagnosed or not, and that being out would in fact help you in a major way with the rest of your life.

    People see you differently NOW, because they see the Big Lie instead of you. And considering the support base you describe, I'd say they think less of you NOW than they will if you come out. I can't know this, of course, but maybe it's worth thinking about.

    As for sex, as others said, there are plenty of guys who aren't into anal, even if they don't share your phobias. A very close friend of mine was a total party bottom/bathhouse slut in college, and then he completely lost his sex drive. Now he doesn't have any penetrative sex whatsoever and his physical interaction with guys is just making out with the occasional head (which is a shame cause he's really hot...). Point being, they're out there. There are even those who will not just accommodate your anxiety and OCD but find it a bit of a turn on to take care of you. Not in a fetishizing kind of way, just people with caring personalities.


    The moral of the story is this: you have it better than many, and you could have it better still. You shouldn't feel pressured to come out, but you have many reasons to do it (the chief one being your peace of mind and self-awareness) and practically NONE not to. So just never say never
    Last edited by Rolyo85; October 14th, 2013 at 10:22 AM.

  13. #13

    Re: Should I Feel Guilty About Not Intending to Come Out?

    I don't understand the need for people to "come out" unless they are coming out to a potential mate. Who else cares? Why should they care? People don't come out and say they are straight! lol

  14. #14
    Execuvette Rolyo85's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lodeus369 View Post
    I don't understand the need for people to "come out" unless they are coming out to a potential mate. Who else cares? Why should they care? People don't come out and say they are straight! lol
    Yes, because they're assumed to be straight already. And the above can only be written by someone who's closeted. Being out is an entire new life. It's indescribably better than the closet, infinitely empowering and a major step forward in one's growth as a human being. There is absolutely no way to describe the feeling to a closeted person - it's like describing colors to a blind man.
    That we are capable only of being what we are, remains our unforgivable sin.
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  15. #15
    Booyah! Callum's Avatar
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    Re: Should I Feel Guilty About Not Intending to Come Out?

    Sorry, I think your reasoning for not coming out is invalid. I'm going to compare you and me...we're similar, but different (please don't edit this, dear moderators):

    Firstly, I have severe clinical OCD -- with a twist. I have minimal compulsions. I have to do certain tasks five times, I have to wear a plaid piece of clothing at all times (unless nude), I have to have collared shirts/dress shirts/long-sleeves so I can touch railings, doors, shopping carts etc.

    I displayed OCD symptoms in my youth (such as intense magical thinking); it snowballed at about 15 (dropped out of high school). I then developed psychotic symptoms. Lived like that until 19. I was exhausted with living that way, so I just spilled it all out to my family doctor. Came out to him. First person, ever! Went to his therapist-in-practice. Went on a couple antidepressants. Went to a psychiatrist specializing in mood disorders. Went to outpatient group CBT at Canada's premier mental health hospital. Exposure and prevention therapy did/does not work for me. Attempted suicide, was hospitalized, forcibly admitted to a psychiatric ward. Went back to therapist. Saw a different therapist. Then a psychologist. Tried more antidepressants (I cannot do SSRIs at all). Then a disability counsellor. Then a psychiatrist. Now at another psychologist. I'm 23.

    You probably went through a lot of shit. I went through a lot of medical shit and personal trauma with my OCD. I don't doubt for a second that you don't. I still am, and I always will. In certain aspects, it controls my life. I have other illnesses too. But I have the reins now, a team that works for/with me. It is manageable.

    Secondly, I come from an extremely religious family. I have a lesbian aunt that was diagnosed with breast cancer. No one talked to her because she's a lesbian. She's developed lung cancer now...still no one talking to her. I came out to my family and the purse-strings were snipped on my education. Immediately. Defaulted on a payment the next day (poor timing on my end). I am out to my friends, I've happily been with other guys. YOU have a family that is accepting and willing to love/embrace you for who you are, and you're aware of this. Your family is not an obstacle, and with a lot of people struggling to coming out, it definitely is a primary obstacle.

    But, to toss you some genuinely helpful advice: I had a wicked fear of anal sex. The idea of faecal matter just repulsed me. What about the seemingly endless list of STDs? What about 'HIV/AIDS', which is constantly thrown around as a scare-tactic to LGBT people (I mean, we arguably even actively shun HIV+ people)? I wanted to be a functional, sexually active guy, right? I'm pretty romantic, so just making out and blow jobs and all that jazz excited me...but I wanted to do it all, like engage in fetishes. But I couldn't get over how disgusting it all seemed on a cellular level. So, I started studying microbiology in university and I loved it. I learned that cells are just naturally-absolutely-wonderfully-fabulous things. Sure, some are bad (ex. STDs), but with protection it strips the worry for me. Why not engage in what we're biologically entitled to?! I conceptualized/rationalized that my beliefs about sex were so unreasonable that I would never be able to score a relationship. That's obviously untrue, as others have mentioned here...but I wanted to be able to do it all. So I did, and guess what? Nothing happened! Nothing to stress over! Ironically I can't do that with my purely obsessional components, ha...but all will be well!

    The sun also rises, right?!
    blacksyringe

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