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  1. #51
    Execuvette Rolyo85's Avatar
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    Re: Bad Bet: Why Republicans Can't Win With Whites Alone

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    If there had been a real conservative running against Obama, he/she would have gotten my vote.
    Too bad, considering the menagerie of lunatics ANY person - no matter how competent - drags behind them if they come from the right. Sadly, most people don't seem to get that they don't vote just for a president, they vote for an ADMINISTRATION.
    That we are capable only of being what we are, remains our unforgivable sin.
    - Gene Wolfe

  2. #52
    CE&P Secret Police xbuzzerx's Avatar
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    Re: Bad Bet: Why Republicans Can't Win With Whites Alone

    Quote Originally Posted by Rolyo85 View Post
    Too bad, considering the menagerie of lunatics ANY person - no matter how competent - drags behind them if they come from the right. Sadly, most people don't seem to get that they don't vote just for a president, they vote for an ADMINISTRATION.
    I strongly suspect that at least comparatively speaking, Jack would consider any Republican or GOP candidate to be a "true conservative" vis-a-vis someone like Obama. But when Republicans say things like "I am a true conservative" they are more often than not trying to make being Republican sound like something different, at this point today, from being a neocon/Tea Party enabler/supporter of the nutjob far right. At this point, a vote cast for the GOP is no different than active support for all of those things, none of which are anywhere near true conservativism. Or at the very least, I consider them guilty as such when they wax poetic about how they want "true conservativism" so much, yet continue to vote GOP, a political entity driven by anything but old-school conservative philosophy.

  3. #53

    Re: Bad Bet: Why Republicans Can't Win With Whites Alone

    I'm anxious to vote for a real conservative for POTUS in 2016. I'll continue to vote that way in the primary and hope I have the opportunity to vote for one in the general election.

  4. #54
    CE&P Secret Police xbuzzerx's Avatar
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    Re: Bad Bet: Why Republicans Can't Win With Whites Alone

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Springer View Post
    I'm anxious to vote for a real conservative for POTUS in 2016. I'll continue to vote that way in the primary and hope I have the opportunity to vote for one in the general election.
    I take this to mean, Jack, that you have not voted for any Republicans for the last 30 or so years? Surely, you didn't vote for George W Bush in either election right?

  5. #55
    Bammer's Papa
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    Re: Bad Bet: Why Republicans Can't Win With Whites Alone

    Quote Originally Posted by Rolyo85 View Post
    Too bad, considering the menagerie of lunatics ANY person - no matter how competent - drags behind them if they come from the right. Sadly, most people don't seem to get that they don't vote just for a president, they vote for an ADMINISTRATION.
    If an actual conservative got elected president somehow, we wouldn't see yet another re-tread cabinet made of all the old reactionaries from the previous GOP administration who are still ambulatory, and we certainly wouldn't see any of today's religious freaks nominated.

    Though I'm not certain an actual conservative would be able to find enough other actual conservatives in the country to fill a cabinet roster.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  6. #56
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    Re: Bad Bet: Why Republicans Can't Win With Whites Alone

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Springer View Post
    I'm anxious to vote for a real conservative for POTUS in 2016. I'll continue to vote that way in the primary and hope I have the opportunity to vote for one in the general election.
    I'm not aware of any actual conservatives on the horizon, or even close to it, who have any hopes of even running in a primary in 2016.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  7. #57
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    Re: Bad Bet: Why Republicans Can't Win With Whites Alone

    Quote Originally Posted by xbuzzerx View Post
    I take this to mean, Jack, that you have not voted for any Republicans for the last 30 or so years? Surely, you didn't vote for George W Bush in either election right?
    You misread him -- he didn't say he wouldn't vote for anyone not a real conservative, just that he'd love to vote for a real one.

    For that matter, I'd love the chance to vote for a real liberal, but we're about as short of those as of real conservatives.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  8. #58
    Execuvette Rolyo85's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xbuzzerx View Post

    I strongly suspect that at least comparatively speaking, Jack would consider any Republican or GOP candidate to be a "true conservative" vis-a-vis someone like Obama. But when Republicans say things like "I am a true conservative" they are more often than not trying to make being Republican sound like something different, at this point today, from being a neocon/Tea Party enabler/supporter of the nutjob far right. At this point, a vote cast for the GOP is no different than active support for all of those things, none of which are anywhere near true conservativism. Or at the very least, I consider them guilty as such when they wax poetic about how they want "true conservativism" so much, yet continue to vote GOP, a political entity driven by anything but old-school conservative philosophy.
    There was an awesome line from the season finale of The Newsroom, where Will Macavoy is explaining how he is a republican because *insert republican real values* but "I have to hate gays now. I have to have so low self-esteem that I hate education. I have to hate Chris Christie for not spitting on Obama when he got off the chopper. And I have to hate democrats". It was a great line.
    That we are capable only of being what we are, remains our unforgivable sin.
    - Gene Wolfe

  9. #59
    CE&P Secret Police xbuzzerx's Avatar
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    Re: Bad Bet: Why Republicans Can't Win With Whites Alone

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    You misread him -- he didn't say he wouldn't vote for anyone not a real conservative, just that he'd love to vote for a real one.

    For that matter, I'd love the chance to vote for a real liberal, but we're about as short of those as of real conservatives.
    I figured more or less. But my point is that people who wax poetic about wanting true conservatives while voting for GOP are like people who wish for a slim body while eating cheesecake.

  10. #60
    Bammer's Papa
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    Re: Bad Bet: Why Republicans Can't Win With Whites Alone

    Quote Originally Posted by xbuzzerx View Post
    I figured more or less. But my point is that people who wax poetic about wanting true conservatives while voting for GOP are like people who wish for a slim body while eating cheesecake.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  11. #61
    JUB Addict MystikWizard's Avatar
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    Re: Bad Bet: Why Republicans Can't Win With Whites Alone

    Quote Originally Posted by maxpowr9 View Post
    Actually I think it will be likely that it will be another Dem in 2016.

    Any person who has some understanding of US politics know the Democrats got fucked over for the 2010s due to their radical push to the left that opened wide the GOP to redistrict much of the country in its favor. It explains why the GOP still manages to hold onto Congress but will not likely get the Senate majority or White House.
    I agree that a Democrat will likely win the White House in 2016, as well. It just goes to show how much damage Bush and the Republicans in office during his time did to the Republican Party. And they still don't seem like they got the message, either ... which is why they will continue to lose.
    Telling it like it is.

  12. #62
    Bammer's Papa
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    Re: Bad Bet: Why Republicans Can't Win With Whites Alone

    Quote Originally Posted by MystikWizard View Post
    I agree that a Democrat will likely win the White House in 2016, as well. It just goes to show how much damage Bush and the Republicans in office during his time did to the Republican Party. And they still don't seem like they got the message, either ... which is why they will continue to lose.
    I don't think it's so much Bush at this point; rather it's the Tea Partites who think Bush wasn't "pure" enough and have taken over the party's course.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  13. #63
    CE&P Secret Police xbuzzerx's Avatar
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    Re: Bad Bet: Why Republicans Can't Win With Whites Alone

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    I don't think it's so much Bush at this point; rather it's the Tea Partites who think Bush wasn't "pure" enough and have taken over the party's course.
    I think that's true but at the same time I think the whole Tea Party mindset was born out of the same general thought process in the whole right side of the aisle; that any Republican policy that appeared to fail or flop was a result of not being far enough to the right, or not enough like what Reagan would have done. It is never because something their party did was simply a bad policy.

  14. #64
    FEAR THE LIBERAL DETENTE! TX-Beau's Avatar
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    Re: Bad Bet: Why Republicans Can't Win With Whites Alone

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    I'm not aware of any actual conservatives on the horizon, or even close to it, who have any hopes of even running in a primary in 2016.


    Obama WAS the Conservative.
    ATTACK OF THE LIBERAL ELITE

  15. #65
    FEAR THE LIBERAL DETENTE! TX-Beau's Avatar
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    Re: Bad Bet: Why Republicans Can't Win With Whites Alone

    Quote Originally Posted by xbuzzerx View Post
    I think that's true but at the same time I think the whole Tea Party mindset was born out of the same general thought process in the whole right side of the aisle; that any Republican policy that appeared to fail or flop was a result of not being far enough to the right, or not enough like what Reagan would have done. It is never because something their party did was simply a bad policy.
    Around here you've got a whole bunch of racism mixed with irrational "hate the Commie Liberal" (ask me why I think the left is responsible for that sometime,) manufactured fear of "gubment," and horrible, silent fears that they have been had, which only makes them more intractable.

    The whole Tea party thingy is the above rolled into non-specific but very deeply felt fears that "they" are taking "my" country away.

    It's the death of the old (white) boy and the fear of what comes after. An America that looks nothing like the one on which they've built their whole identity.

    In 20 years they will be gone.

    I also blame the left for Texas being red, Texas should be blue, corruption and gerrymandering and dirty politics aside.
    ATTACK OF THE LIBERAL ELITE

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