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  1. #851

    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alnitak View Post
    It took some time to marinate, but this is solidly the current American jurisprudence on this issue. Of course it was inevitable because so few issues are as white and black as this one. I always knew a period of time like this would come once the veil of prejudice was lifted. We are really living in some kind of LGBT golden age in the West.
    Amen, and not just legally but culturally (Michael Sam, Jason Collins, Derrick Gordon, etc.). The next battle will be ENDA, which I predict will be law by the end of the decade.

  2. #852
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninja108 View Post
    Today in Ohio a judge has struck down part of that state's ban, ruling marriages performed in other states must be acknowledged by Ohio.
    Will Ohio recognize marriages from outside the US?

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by rareboy View Post
    Will Ohio recognize marriages from outside the US?
    What's outside the US

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Marriages from Canada, England, etc. involving an Ohio resident.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alnitak View Post
    It took some time to marinate, but this is solidly the current American jurisprudence on this issue. Of course it was inevitable because so few issues are as white and black as this one. I always knew a period of time like this would come once the veil of prejudice was lifted. We are really living in some kind of LGBT golden age in the West.
    It doesn't seem like a golden age when there are still parts of the country where it isn't exactly safe to be known as gay, or even bi.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by rareboy View Post
    Will Ohio recognize marriages from outside the US?
    I think that point will be moot before it ever reaches a court specifically.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  7. #857

    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    It doesn't seem like a golden age when there are still parts of the country where it isn't exactly safe to be known as gay, or even bi.
    Culture always takes a few years to catch up to the laws after they're passed.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by scream4ever View Post
    Culture always takes a few years to catch up to the laws after they're passed.
    In the case of gay rights, I'd say culture is light years ahead of the (chickenshit) politicians.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by scream4ever View Post
    Culture always takes a few years to catch up to the laws after they're passed.
    When culture hasn't even caught up with the laws, there's hardly any golden age.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Malta passed civil unions and same sex adoption.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    It doesn't seem like a golden age when there are still parts of the country where it isn't exactly safe to be known as gay, or even bi.
    In partial terms, but I am speaking generally.

  12. #862

    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alnitak View Post
    In partial terms, but I am speaking generally.
    I know I'm beating a dead horse, but among our generation we essentially are already at that point. Yes it's rough for many minors to be out but it's only because people at that age generally do suck and are horrible to each other. After they leave high school most who previously behaved in such a way change (I've seen it happen firsthand). It may be horrible to say, but it really will take the older generations dying off to change things.

  13. #863
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    There will always be places in the U.S. where it's not safe to be out.
    Sucks but it's the truth.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    When are the Oklahoma arguments being heard exactly? Thanks.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by JackinSea View Post
    When are the Oklahoma arguments being heard exactly? Thanks.
    Oklahoma's case Bishop v. Smith will be heard on April 17 at 1:30 p.m.

    Byron White United States Courthouse
    1823 Stout Street
    Denver, CO 80294

    http://www.ca10.uscourts.gov/calendar

    http://www.justusboys.com/forum/thre...rriage-Appeals

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    I hadn't realized there's an Arkansas hearing this afternoon.

  17. #867
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by JackinSea View Post
    I hadn't realized there's an Arkansas hearing this afternoon.
    Hearing on motions in Wright v. Arkansas

    The circuit judge is Chris Piazza, the same judge who overturned the state's adoption ban. So I fully expect him to rule in our favor. The state supreme court has also ruled in our favor in a few recent cases. We should ultimately be successful.
    Last edited by Alnitak; April 17th, 2014 at 09:41 AM.

  18. #868
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Hearings are underway in the 10th circuit as we speak.

  19. #869
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Judge Piazza will reportedly rule in two weeks on Arkansas' state case

    http://www.freedomtomarry.org/blog/e...-court-hearing

  20. #870
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    A précis of today's argument in the Tenth Circuit is at http://www.theguardian.com/world/feedarticle/11300611 (from the AP).

    A judge in Colorado who will play a pivotal role deciding whether gays should be allowed to wed in the United States asked pointed questions Thursday about whether Oklahoma can legally ban the unions.

    U.S. Circuit Judge Jerome Holmes is seen as the swing vote on the three-judge panel that heard the Oklahoma appeal and a similar case from Utah last week.
    2 to 1 is looking more likely.

  21. #871
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    ^ I'm hopeful.

    I think it gets harder and harder for States to successfully defend their homophobia as a wave of jurisprudence washes across the country.

  22. #872
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    An interesting case from the Ninth Circuit has implications for the marriage equality decision in that court.

    In SmithKline Beecham Corp. vs Abbott Laboratories, Case: 11-17357 01/21/2014 ID: 8944502, the Ninth Circuit unanimously reversed the trial court for allowing a gay juror to be excluded from the jury panel simply because of his sexual orientation. In so ruling, the Ninth Circuit abandoned a "rational basis" test and adopted "heightened scrutiny," saying that was implicit in the SCOTUS ruling in Windsor. The Ninth Court is now considering whether or not to grant an en banc rehearing; neither of the parties to the appeal has challenged "heightened scrutiny" as the standard to be applied.

    The opinion is at http://cdn.ca9.uscourts.gov/datastor...4/11-17357.pdf .

    For a discussion of the case and its implications for marriage equality, see http://www.scotusblog.com/2014/04/no...d/#more-208320 [open source].

    If en banc review were to be denied, or if granted and the panel decision were to be upheld, the more rigorous standard for gay rights cases presumably would be binding throughout the Ninth Circuit.

    “Heightened scrutiny” is considerably more difficult to satisfy than the “rational basis” test that, up to now, has been used by the Ninth Circuit in judging official actions that are challenged as biased against gays and lesbians. Only one other federal appeals court — the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit — uses the higher standard in such cases.
    A case to watch. The Nevada marriage equality case is pending in that circuit.

  23. #873
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    ^ Interesting.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Oregon will be having a hearing on their ban next Wednesday but there will be no one to defend the ban for the bigots.
    IMO, by May Oregon will be the 18th state to have full equality.

  25. #875
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    I meant to wish Sevcik v. Sandoval a happy second birthday, which was on April 10. That case at the 9th Circuit and originating from Nevada is now two years old. It is still awaiting an oral arguments date after the clerk said it would be scheduled quickly two months ago and then mistakenly scheduled a date when the bigot lawyer was supposed to be arguing Utah's defense. Other cases have already been scheduled or heard. Okay it is actually normal for two year old cases to be working their way through appellate procedure, and Sevcik has been dogged by thorny hang ups from the get go. It isn't even the oldest case; that would be Bishop v. Oklahoma. That case started in 2004 Altogether, we are also just used to speedy progress.
    Last edited by Alnitak; April 18th, 2014 at 02:01 PM.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninja108 View Post
    Oregon will be having a hearing on their ban next Wednesday but there will be no one to defend the ban for the bigots.
    IMO, by May Oregon will be the 18th state to have full equality.
    This is an interesting situation. The plaintiffs may just win right then and there by default, and that certainly will force the 9th Circuit clerk's hand to schedule a date immediately for Sevcik. I suppose Oregon will be another feather in the cap for us, which wouldn't have happened had Sevcik not been delayed so many times.
    Last edited by Alnitak; April 18th, 2014 at 02:03 PM.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninja108 View Post
    Oregon will be having a hearing on their ban next Wednesday but there will be no one to defend the ban for the bigots.
    IMO, by May Oregon will be the 18th state to have full equality.

    Some days it is like watching paint dry.

    But one state at a time, I guess.

  28. #878
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alnitak View Post
    This is an interesting situation. The plaintiffs may just win right then and there by default, and that certainly will force the 9th Circuit clerk's hand to schedule a date immediately for Sevcik. I suppose Oregon will be another feather in the cap for us, which wouldn't have happened had Sevcik not been delayed so many times.
    Unless something has changed, there aren't even any briefs filed defending the ban!

    I'm frustrated with Oregon United for Marriage, though. They were saying that the initiative to change the state constitution needs to go through regardless, because even if the court strikes down the amendment, the language will still be there; now they seem to be backing down and saying that if the court does strike it down, they'll drop the initiative and there will be no vote. They were right in the first position: the provision needs to be stripped from the constitution, not just nullified by the federal court.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  29. #879
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Read again today about the Federal Appeals Court in Denver hearing the Oklahoma case (and one other, Utah, mebbe?). The NYT says of the three judges, there is one who could go either way. He asked the OK atty general for the rationale for singling out gays to ban from marriage. This is the key question that gives us a winning hand in these cases to date. How is traditional marriage diminished or affected by same-sex couples marrying legally (vs. religiously) in their state? What is the rationale for singling gays out for prohibition to marry? The answers are clear. There is no loss to traditional marriage, and the only rationale is based on prejudice, hate and/or religious belief (which may embrace the other two). So far, no one on the other side has offered any of those arguments in opposition to same sex marriage. Ergo, they have no answer, and no case.

  30. #880
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninja108 View Post
    Oregon will be having a hearing on their ban next Wednesday but there will be no one to defend the ban for the bigots.
    IMO, by May Oregon will be the 18th state to have full equality.


    Can anyone post the time and address of where the hearing will take place? I am interested in going.
    I couldn't get my mind off you all day.
    ~~~~ ~~

  31. #881

    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    Unless something has changed, there aren't even any briefs filed defending the ban!

    I'm frustrated with Oregon United for Marriage, though. They were saying that the initiative to change the state constitution needs to go through regardless, because even if the court strikes down the amendment, the language will still be there; now they seem to be backing down and saying that if the court does strike it down, they'll drop the initiative and there will be no vote. They were right in the first position: the provision needs to be stripped from the constitution, not just nullified by the federal court.
    The language would still be there, but unenforceable. Prop 8 is still in the California Constitution, though it will likely be removed via referendum this November.

    Given that no briefs have been in support of the ban in Oregon, I wouldn't be surprised if McShane issues his ruling from the bench. Also, this one will be permanent at #18 since no one is defending it at all (let alone with standing to appeal), so no appeal will happen.

  32. #882
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Since Oregon currently recognizes out-of-state marriages, heterosexual relationships are ALREADY doomed! So, why defend this? That and the NOMmies would rather this (lose on an activist judge's say-so) than have a nasty result for them in November.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by palbert View Post
    A précis of today's argument in the Tenth Circuit is at http://www.theguardian.com/world/feedarticle/11300611 (from the AP).

    2 to 1 is looking more likely.
    At this point, every judge is keenly aware which way the arc of history is going. The question they have to ask themselves is, do they want to be boldly leading or dragged kicking and screaming?

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    Unless something has changed, there aren't even any briefs filed defending the ban!

    I'm frustrated with Oregon United for Marriage, though. They were saying that the initiative to change the state constitution needs to go through regardless, because even if the court strikes down the amendment, the language will still be there; now they seem to be backing down and saying that if the court does strike it down, they'll drop the initiative and there will be no vote. They were right in the first position: the provision needs to be stripped from the constitution, not just nullified by the federal court.
    "The harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly; it is dearness only that gives everything its value. I love the man that can smile in trouble, that can gather strength from distress and grow brave by reflection. 'Tis the business of little minds to shrink; but he whose heart is firm, and whose conscience approves his conduct, will pursue his principles unto death."

    -Thomas Paine

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by JackinSea View Post
    Since Oregon currently recognizes out-of-state marriages, heterosexual relationships are ALREADY doomed! So, why defend this? That and the NOMmies would rather this (lose on an activist judge's say-so) than have a nasty result for them in November.
    "heterosexual relationships are ALREADY doomed" -- are they all going to vanish???

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    "heterosexual relationships are ALREADY doomed" -- are they all going to vanish???
    The conservative theory is that marriage increases libido, but common wisdom says otherwise Or my favorite version, which is that excluding gays from marriage makes heterosexuals hornier and make more kids.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    ORAL ARGUMENTS

    Set for Ballen v. Corbett on June 18, 2014

    Commonwealth Court of Pennsylvania
    Pennsylvania Judicial Center
    601 Commonwealth Ave
    Harrisburg, PA 17120

    The clerk will assign a docket number and a time.

    http://www.pacourts.us/assets/files/....pdf?cb=b3f973

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alnitak View Post
    The conservative theory is that marriage increases libido, but common wisdom says otherwise Or my favorite version, which is that excluding gays from marriage makes heterosexuals hornier and make more kids.
    At the end of the day, the whole conservative movement is afraid that all the closeted homos and bi's who married the ugliest girl in the class in order to have a beard and fucked her just often enough to produce more stupid children, are going to realize that they could have a full, emotional and sexual relationship with another guy...this would lead to the conservative churches losing about 1/2 of their fearfully 'praying-to-be-straight members.

    Why else are they so insecure with their own emotional and sexual identity.

    The fact that some straight guy wants to get married and bang a vagina all the time doesn't threaten me as a homo....why does it work the other way around?

  39. #889
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    As Molly Ivins said, "You gotta dance with the one that brung ya!" They were on the upswing for the previous decade with their position, and now they (the pols, many of whom don't care) have to play out their hand, or risk pissing off their base. The NOMmies are just plain batshit insane.

  40. #890
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    A class action lawsuit against the gay marriage ban has been filed in Georgia.

    A new class-action lawsuit has been filed seeking marriage rights for same-sex couples, this time in Georgia. Lambda Legal filed the lawsuit in the Northern District of Georgia on behalf of seven named plaintiffs who will represent a class consisting of “all Georgia residents who are unmarried same-sex couples and all Georgia residents.”

    equalityontrial.com
    The case is Inniss v. Aderhold. Complaint at http://www.scribd.com/doc/219617699/Complaint .

  41. #891
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by palbert View Post
    A class action lawsuit against the gay marriage ban has been filed in Georgia.



    The case is Inniss v. Aderhold. Complaint at http://www.scribd.com/doc/219617699/Complaint .
    ..."and all Georgia residents".

    Kinda ballsy, there.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  42. #892
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    ..."and all Georgia residents".

    Kinda ballsy, there.
    That's what a class action is.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    http://www.lgbtqnation.com/2014/04/s...-marriage-ban/
    This will scratch South Dakota off the list of states with no lawsuits.
    Only Alaska, MOntana and North Dakota remain.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    http://www.joemygod.blogspot.com/201...#disqus_thread
    Breaking news out of Alaska. The State Supreme Court has just ruled that it's unconstituional to deny property tax exemptions to same sex couples.
    Since Alaska is in the 9th Circuit, that bodes well for us in the lawsuit pending there.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninja108 View Post
    http://www.lgbtqnation.com/2014/04/s...-marriage-ban/
    This will scratch South Dakota off the list of states with no lawsuits.
    Only Alaska, MOntana and North Dakota remain.
    Twelve states lack lawsuits asking for the right to a license, and eight of those are asking only for recognition of an out of state one. Even if we win those lawsuits, you still won't be able to marry in those states. I really don't know why they bother though if will be helpful for some.
    Last edited by Alnitak; April 25th, 2014 at 01:29 PM.

  46. #896
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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninja108 View Post
    http://www.joemygod.blogspot.com/201...#disqus_thread
    Breaking news out of Alaska. The State Supreme Court has just ruled that it's unconstituional to deny property tax exemptions to same sex couples.
    Since Alaska is in the 9th Circuit, that bodes well for us in the lawsuit pending there.
    Alaska once had a little known state court case Brause v. Bureau of Vital Statistics that challenged its DOMA law. The plaintiffs won. As could be expected, the state appealed and quickly passed a constitutional DOMA amendment, in 1998, and the state supreme court had no choice. If they challenged it now based on the federal constitution, or sued in federal court itself, they just might win.
    Last edited by Alnitak; April 25th, 2014 at 01:54 PM.

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alnitak View Post
    That's what a class action is.
    A class action usually has a defined class united by having suffered damages from something. I doubt all Georgia citizens would agree they've been damaged.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alnitak View Post
    Twelve states lack lawsuits asking for the right to a license, and eight of those are asking only for recognition of an out of state one. Even if we win those lawsuits, you still won't be able to marry in those states. I really don't know why they bother though if will be helpful for some.
    Brick by brick . . . .

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    A class action usually has a defined class united by having suffered damages from something. I doubt all Georgia citizens would agree they've been damaged.
    Class action is open to all citizens, but not all citizens may have a claim.

  50. #900

    Re: What is new on the Gay Marriage front?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alnitak View Post
    Twelve states lack lawsuits asking for the right to a license, and eight of those are asking only for recognition of an out of state one. Even if we win those lawsuits, you still won't be able to marry in those states. I really don't know why they bother though if will be helpful for some.
    It doesn't really matter at this point as the whole issue likely will be settled by the Supreme Court within the next 14 months.

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