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  1. #51
    JUB Addict Ninja108's Avatar
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    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it. I'm glad so many are shining a light on this horror,because it's only a matter of time before gays and lesbians in Russa will be targeted for extremination.

  2. #52
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    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    Quote Originally Posted by chrisrobin View Post
    How 'bout pink triangles?
    I'd be tickled pink if Secretary Kerry ordered all diplomatic staff in Russia to wear those, and tell Putin "We're just trying to be helpful".

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  3. #53
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    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    Quote Originally Posted by chrisrobin View Post
    How 'bout pink triangles?
    Yes, probably even better, because it forces some people to remember history as well.
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  4. #54

    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninja108 View Post
    Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it. I'm glad so many are shining a light on this horror,because it's only a matter of time before gays and lesbians in Russa will be targeted for extremination.

  5. #55

    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    Telstra, Kraseviya

    Thank you very much for your kind words.

    Kulindahr

    Russians supported Putin after the period of Boris Yelsin. The period which for most Russians means the anarchy, gangsters and criminal capitalism, not the democracy.

    You can't force people to accept Western values in a day.

    Stephen Fry compared Putin with Hitler. I think that it's an overstatement, but even so, we can enlarge this comparision.

    Before Hitler there was a period of Weimar Republic. Lots of Germans associated Weimar Republic not with democracy, but with national humiliation.

    Even after 1945 lots of Germans were nostalgic about the Third Reich and the Second Empire, but hated Weimar Republic.

    So. you can't change people's mind in a day.

    Besides, our liberal reformators wasn't democratic at all. Some of them were big fans of Augusto Pinochet.

    Late Soviet era was quite vegetarian (certainly, not for gay and dissenters). But in 1990s people lost the social stability, lost their jobs during the total deindustrialisation, etc.
    Last edited by Russian Bottom Slut; August 13th, 2013 at 01:02 AM.

  6. #56

    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    Besides, where Stephen Fry was when Russian people in Sochi lost their real estate property without fair compenstations?

    Where were the members of WOC? Again and again: people who live near Sochi lost their real estate property during the "preparation" for the Olympic games? Why no ne paid any attention to that fact?

    I think that this Olypmpic Games are total sh**t. Government should have spent more money on social programs instead of them.

    I think that WOC should have choosen Vancouver or Seuol instead of Sochi.

    BUT NOT NOW. They should have done it several years ago.

    But to change this decision now would be a a slap in the face.

    Not a slap in Putin's face. But the slap in the faces of Russian taxpayers, the slap in the faces of Sochi's inhibitants who already lost their property.

    Russian taxpayers already lost their money. People in Sochi already lost their property. WOC put a blind eye on it. Stephen Fry said nothing about in also, as far as I know.

    So,even if I believe that this Olympic Games are total sh**t, I think it's bad to change the decision NOW.
    Last edited by Russian Bottom Slut; August 13th, 2013 at 02:25 AM.

  7. #57

    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    I also hope that Stephen Fry or the members of WOC will visit someday Russia. Not only Moscow bars and rich hotels.

    People who were labour workers and worked for the Soviet industry lost anything.

    We have lots of places that are in the same condition or even worser than Detroit. I hope Stephen Fry will visit such places someday. A writer should see, how ordinary people struggle for life.

    When Margaret Thatcher died I was shocked that many British people especially from the industrail North hate her so much. And England is a country of long history of capitalism and individualism.

    For lots of Russians 1990s were much more shocking than 1980s for British labour workers.

    So, our nation is very polarised, people hate each other, have lots of phobies. It's very bad, but this boycott will not solve these problems.
    Last edited by Russian Bottom Slut; August 13th, 2013 at 02:42 AM.

  8. #58
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    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    Quote Originally Posted by Russian Bottom Slut View Post
    I think that WOC should have choosen Vancouver or Seuol instead of Sochi.
    Anywhere with mountains and snow would have been a better choice.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  9. #59

    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    They should have choosen Vancouver several years ago. Not now. No one in the West protested than people lost their property in Sochi during the preparation to this games. WOC put a blind eye on it.

  10. #60

    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    I found an excellent quotation for this topic, written in much better English than mine:
    The IOC couldn’t “take a stand” with two crutches and hydraulic lift. It was a flawed body during the Cold War. Now it’s a corporate piranha masquerading as Nemo the Clown Fish, tearing countries to pieces under a miasma of soft-headed hooey about “bringing the world together through sports.” Asking the IOC to be an ally in the fight against oppression is like asking a scorpion not to sting. The mere fact that the Winter Games are in Putin’s Sochi—where the disappearance of $30 billion in Olympic construction costs has elicited barely a pip from the IOC—only shows who they are and where they stand.
    http://www.thenation.com/blog/175695...very-bad-idea#

    I must correct only one thing in this article. The slogan on the photo should be translated from Russian language as "Homophobia is the religion of rednecks".

    Redneck is more adequate translation of Russian (originally Polish) word "bydlo".

  11. #61
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    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    Quote Originally Posted by Rolyo85 View Post
    Wow. Fry is one of the smartest, talented and eloquent humans on modern Earth. I already knew that, but this letter cemented it for me.

  12. #62

    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    No one boycotted Olympic Gmes in China in 2008. China is much more autoritarian country than Russia, They have death penalty/ We don't.

    Besides, as the author of oen of the comments to the article in The Nation put it:
    http://www.thenation.com/blog/175695...very-bad-idea#

    The last thing Russian queers need is to have gay acceptance imposed upon all Russians by their historical enemy the USA. The most effective gay liberation movements require such movements to be homespun. Embracing homosexuality must be seen as a Russian value, not a...
    I am seriously afraid that this boycott will only produce much more hate against gays.

    And I AM LIVING IN RUSSIA! Not Stephen Fry or other honorable people.

    I am afraid that this boycott only will make Russian gays' life more hard. Our government will use it to make more anti-Western hysteria.

    Again, Stephen Fry is an honorable person, but his is not from Russia.

    I am afraid that he cares about Russian gays no more than Bernard Show cared for Russian peasants.

    Bernard Show supported Stalin. Fry opposed Putin. But the same thing is that they are both non-Russians. So they both hav abstract view on Russia.

    And I LIVE here.

  13. #63
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    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    No country threatened to boycott the 2002 Salt Lake City Olympics because of GWB's anti-human rights policies.

    Bush established extrajudicial prisons (beginning in January 2002) in which he imprisoned people without charge or trial indefinitely. He spied on Americans without warrants. He abducted foreign nationals from foreign soil without the permission of the home countries or the involvement of their judicial systems. He launched a campaign of intolerance toward homosexuals, and managed to influence 35 states into enacting anti-gay laws (including 29 states which codified anti-gay bigotry into their constitutions).

    Yet, not a peep from anyone about boycotting (or protesting) the Salt Lake City Olympics, or boycotting American products.
    Last edited by T-Rexx; August 15th, 2013 at 11:49 PM.

  14. #64

    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    The boycott of the Olympics in Sochi, without the boycott of the Games in China will only add arquments to Russian hawks.

    Our hawks will say:

    "You see China doesn't care about human rights. It's more authoritarian than Russia. But Russia is weak and China is economically strong. So China can do anything because it's strong".

    So, or hawks wil accuse the USA and Europe of double-standarts.

  15. #65

    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    There is a certain hypocrisy in the US that I find galling. We have yet to pass ENDA, which means it is lawful in most states in this country (except the few that have extended employment anti-discrimination rights to gays) to fire someone because they are gay (or believed to be gay). There are also many countries in the Middle-East, Asia and Africa that have far worse laws than Russia. Westerners love to go to Dubai, but the United Arab Emirates has a horrible record. Qatar has been awarded the World Cup, yet homosexual acts between men are illegal and prosecuted. Russian doesn't go that far.

  16. #66
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    Re: RUSSIA: Co-Sponsor Of Anti-Gay Bill Says Government Cannot Selectively Suspend Enforcement During The Sochi Olympics

    Quote Originally Posted by Russian Bottom Slut View Post
    I found an excellent quotation for this topic, written in much better English than mine:


    http://www.thenation.com/blog/175695...very-bad-idea#
    That's a good article -- thanks.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  17. #67

    Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    I just read this article and thought it was stupid that so many gay people were sending this gay Olympic skater nasty messages for not boycotting the Olympics which is probably a once in a lifetime shot at his dream that he worked his entire life for. If gay athletes decide and are expected to not show up then they're giving Russia exactly what they wanted and it's the same thing as banning gays from the Olympics and their country. They don't care if gay athletes and their supporters don't participate in the Olympics that's exactly what they want and they're going to have it with or without them. They should really come up with another more effective way to protest.

    Thoughts?

    http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/olympi...194036219.html
    Last edited by pineapple; January 17th, 2014 at 03:24 AM.

  18. #68
    Dejavudoo
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    It was debated in Hot Topics when the idea first surfaced after Putin's laws were proposed. The consensus was pretty much not to cave and give them a no-gays-showing Olympics.

    That said, it wasn't unanimous, but was already discussed.

    Find the threads here: http://www.justusboys.com/forum/thre...ighlight=Sochi

    and here: http://www.justusboys.com/forum/thre...ighlight=sochi
    Last edited by Dejavudoo; January 17th, 2014 at 03:37 AM.

  19. #69
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    There's an argument either way, and I can't decide which is the best, I'm in two minds.

    FOR: Having as many gay athletes as possible, open, out, and proud, competing, participating, winning medals, showing themselves to be uncowed, unintimidated, perfectly capable, and (we hope) winning a gold.

    AGAINST: By going to the event, you are in some way legitimising and endorsing the regime, and its views, and are providing a degree of moral equivalence and succour and standing to their violently homophobic culture.

    However....

    I think I'm tending to go FOR - because of the chance to in effect turn Russia's own propaganda against them. Remember how Jesse Owens took the limelight and upstaged the Nazis in 1936 Berlin?

    And so nothing in my view would be better than if we see an out, proud gay man, standing on the podium, a medal round his neck, and them having to play his national anthem - and everyone (Russians included) KNOWING that he's gay, and even better if he beat his Russian competitors doing it. In a country that has been run and ruled by propaganda for a century, I think that opportunity is too good to miss.

  20. #70
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    All things considered, had I worked that hard to get there... I would go, come Hell, high water or Putin.

    -d-
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    Comments welcome.

  21. #71
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    No i think not, Mainly for the reasons you put forward.

  22. #72
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    Weeeeeellllllllllllllllllllllll.....

    My self righteous answer is NO...how could they support such bigotry?....

    ...but on a personal level...I know a professional skater who DID work really hard to get to the Olympics and he didn't make it but almost...he was a still a pro on the circuit and just got inducted into the Hall of Fame this past year....I saw how hard he worked and just knowing what these athletes go through I have to respect their decision.

    This will be the first Olympics I miss though....I cannot stomach Russia and I would rather not take a trip there at the moment. I used to want to visit...not anymore.

  23. #73
    Dejavudoo
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    It's a good moment to show support, and we'll likely see it erupt a few times, but may get upstaged if a bomb finds its way in.

  24. #74
    JUB Addict mikey3000's Avatar
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    I think all the gays and their supporters should go, work hard and achieve their dreams, then waive rainbow flags at the closing ceremony. No one would do anything to them then.
    Inspired - but too tired.

  25. #75
    veni, vidi, reliqui
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    I think that all athletes should boycott the Olympics and the companies that sponsor them.

    But that ain't gonna happen.

    That being said, the US is making about the best statement that can be made with the delegation they are sending.

    A big 'Fuck You' to the Russian Orthodox Church who are actually behind this nonsense.

  26. #76
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    You have to show up to change things--there will always be the ridiculous PC gays who want it their way or the highway---but I think it's more powerful to show up skate and give Putin the finger.

  27. #77
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    Quote Originally Posted by rareboy View Post
    I think that all athletes should boycott the Olympics and the companies that sponsor them.

    But that ain't gonna happen.

    That being said, the US is making about the best statement that can be made with the delegation they are sending.

    A big 'Fuck You' to the Russian Orthodox Church who are actually behind this nonsense.
    Funny how the Russian Orthodox Church had no official standing for decades in this this former communist state, yet are now able to dictate morality to the rest of the world. Laughable really.
    Inspired - but too tired.

  28. #78
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    I don't think pressure should be put on individuals to boycott because they are gay, but as a whole. No one should go, fuck it they are the ones that lose out then. If just gay athletes boycott it Russia and bigotry win. If everyone boycotts it then the message might be heard as well as putting light on the fact that this is a huge ego trip for Putin - they are spending more on this Olympics than the cost of all Olympics in the past!

  29. #79
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    Quote Originally Posted by rareboy View Post
    I think that all athletes should boycott the Olympics and the companies that sponsor them.

    But that ain't gonna happen.

    That being said, the US is making about the best statement that can be made with the delegation they are sending.

    A big 'Fuck You' to the Russian Orthodox Church who are actually behind this nonsense.
    Agreed with this.

  30. #80
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    It was interesting to hear Johnny Weir address the subject on a talk show earlier in the week. He is certainly very proud of telling the world about his husband... and I gather he will be doing color commentary, along with Tara Lapinsky.

    He said he is all about the Olympics, is supportive of the games in every way possible, and doesn't believe gay athletes should boycott, after all their hard work to get there. I was surprised by his tepid response to the US delegation. Maybe he doesn't want to jeopardize his TV commentating gig.

  31. #81
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    The only people the boycott will hurt will be the athletes. They should play to win and have a greater platform afterwards.
    Everyone wants to be heard. No one wants to listen.

  32. #82
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    Quote Originally Posted by mikey3000 View Post
    Funny how the Russian Orthodox Church had no official standing for decades in this this former communist state, yet are now able to dictate morality to the rest of the world. Laughable really.
    And trust me...when we were in St. Petersburg....the Russian Orthodox Church has regained a tremendous hold over the population.
    The less educated and poor are increasingly under the sway of the stern and autocratic patriarchy.

  33. #83
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    I'm in the FOR going group.
    Go, be proud and win medals. That's the biggest statement possible.
    Then do a victory lap in your rainbow flag before snogging your husband/wife on camera.

    I don't think the Russian Orthodox church is much to blame. Rather it seems the country has a relatively low level of societal development and sophistication. The church has just managed to latch on to widespread prejudices. Their government would probably get an equally enthusiastic response banning black people, or Jews, or punk rockers.
    Blah blah blah, something enigmatic sounding...

  34. #84

    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    Not to be pessimistic..but I think we aren't strong enough for this

    They need to have the movement inside of them first- I mean: gay russians

  35. #85
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kabluey View Post
    I'm in the FOR going group.
    Go, be proud and win medals. That's the biggest statement possible.
    Then do a victory lap in your rainbow flag before snogging your husband/wife on camera.

    I don't think the Russian Orthodox church is much to blame. Rather it seems the country has a relatively low level of societal development and sophistication. The church has just managed to latch on to widespread prejudices. Their government would probably get an equally enthusiastic response banning black people, or Jews, or punk rockers.
    Trust me. It is the Orthodox Church that is behind this. and odd that you mention Jews. The Orthodox Church was the driver behind the Pogroms against the Jews. And Punk Rockers. It wasn't Putin that put Pussy riot in jail. It was the patriarchs of the Church who insisted on this sentencing. And Putin Co. is understandably tied to and scared to death of the Orthodox mullahs. They are an ultra-conservative sect that is the first cousin to the evangelicals in America. I would also note that the Evangelical movements in Russia...largely supported by Americans are also partly responsible for this pogrom against homos.

  36. #86
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    It should be a decision the athlete themselves must face. Personally, I would want my athletics team to feel fully protected, and if they went, they should have body guards from their home country just in case some extremist gets to them.


  37. #87
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    Re: Should Gay Athletes Boycott The Olympics In Russia?

    Yes they should. Sometimes you have to sacrifice yourself for the greater good.

    make a statement and tell the press why you are not going.




  38. #88
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    Putin: Gays Are Welcome at Olympics as Long as They "Leave Kids Alone"

    At a question-and answer session on Friday, Vladimir Putin was asked how Russia's anti-gay laws would affect visitors to the Sochi Olympics. Putin answered “One can feel calm and at ease. Just leave kids alone, please.”


    “We have no ban on the nontraditional forms of sexual intercourse among people… We have the ban on the propaganda of homosexuality and pedophilia. I want to stress this: propaganda among minors. These are two absolutely different things: a ban on certain relations or the propaganda of such relations.”


    http://www.mediaite.com/online/putin...ve-kids-alone/

  39. #89

    Re: Putin: Gays Are Welcome at Olympics as Long as They "Leave Kids Alone"

    Quote Originally Posted by geloge View Post
    He wants all the dicks for himself not for teenagers, obvioulsly

    Never. Never in a million years.

  40. #90
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    Re: Putin: Gays Are Welcome at Olympics as Long as They "Leave Kids Alone"

    He wants all the dicks for himself not for teenagers, obvioulsly

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails STR2502PIC1A_365158k.jpg  

    ^Another kicking English grammar post

  41. #91

    Re: Putin: Gays Are Welcome at Olympics as Long as They "Leave Kids Alone"

    Last edited by Vitamin; January 17th, 2014 at 06:30 PM.

  42. #92
    Lions&Tigers&Bears Oh My!
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    Re: Putin: Gays Are Welcome at Olympics as Long as They "Leave Kids Alone"

    I don't believe a word he says.

  43. #93
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    Re: Putin: Gays Are Welcome at Olympics as Long as They "Leave Kids Alone"

    I am not watching any of this horseshit.

    and if some of the athletes had balls they would refuse to go.




  44. #94
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    Re: Putin: Gays Are Welcome at Olympics as Long as They "Leave Kids Alone"

    He's a fucking cunt.

    I don't watch the Winter Olympics as they're shit.

  45. #95
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    Re: Putin: Gays Are Welcome at Olympics as Long as They "Leave Kids Alone"

    I can't wait until I'm fluent in Russian...
    blacksyringe

  46. #96
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    Re: Putin: Gays Are Welcome at Olympics as Long as They "Leave Kids Alone"

    in Canada we do it right and make sure everyone is included.





  47. #97
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    Re: Putin: Gays Are Welcome at Olympics as Long as They "Leave Kids Alone"

    Quote Originally Posted by T-Rexx View Post
    At a question-and answer session on Friday, Vladimir Putin was asked how Russia's anti-gay laws would affect visitors to the Sochi Olympics. Putin answered “One can feel calm and at ease. Just leave kids alone, please.”






    http://www.mediaite.com/online/putin...ve-kids-alone/
    Does he also welcome black athletes as long as they don't take anything that doesn't belong to them?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by PreTTy PeTe View Post
    in Canada we do it right and make sure everyone is included.
    Your Natives wouldn't widely agree, imo.

  48. #98
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    Re: Putin: Gays Are Welcome at Olympics as Long as They "Leave Kids Alone"

    Quote Originally Posted by xbuzzerx View Post



    Your Natives wouldn't widely agree, imo.
    one day they will grow up and decide if they want to be part of the future or just remain in past.
    Last edited by PreTTy PeTe; January 17th, 2014 at 08:21 PM.




  49. #99
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    Re: Putin: Gays Are Welcome at Olympics as Long as They "Leave Kids Alone"

    Quote Originally Posted by PreTTy PeTe View Post
    one day they will grow up and decide if they want to be part of the future or just remain in past.
    These aren't much the words of someone embracing "all inclusiveness" for everyone. Kinda sounds like a Canadian version of Putin, actually.
    Last edited by xbuzzerx; January 17th, 2014 at 08:30 PM.

  50. #100
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    Re: Putin: Gays Are Welcome at Olympics as Long as They "Leave Kids Alone"

    Never mind the natives, Canada had/has one of the most damaging and blatantly racist immigration policies in contrast to pretty much every other western nation. But, I guess we can make a second thread about it.
    blacksyringe

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