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    Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    http://mediamatters.org/blog/2013/06...rnalism/194574

    Major newspapers and cable and broadcast media have ignored Louisiana's passage of a law that makes it a crime for journalists to publicly identify concealed handgun permit holders or applicants.

    On June 19, Gov. Bobby Jindal (R-LA) signed a bill that sets penalties of up to six months in jail and $10,000 for those who publish "any information regarding the identity of any person who applied for or received a concealed handgun permit." The law includes exceptions for cases in which the concealed handgun holder is charged with a felony offense involving the use of a handgun.
    This is such an obvious and blatant violation of the right to free speech, that it makes me wish Governors could be fired for criminal incompetence...
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    .
    Obviously, this move is Jindal "throwing his hat in the ring" for 2016.



    In your dreams, Bobby.
    Last edited by chrisrobin; June 24th, 2013 at 09:51 PM.

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  3. #3

    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Well, since they love their precious guns so much , why is it such a big deal who knows it ? You'd think they'd be rootin' and tootin' to their hearts content about their "right" and such and not givin' a damn who knows it....!!! Gun owners got something to hide ??? hmmmmm

  4. #4

    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by chrisrobin View Post
    .
    Obviously, this move is Jindal "throwing his hat in the ring" for 2016.



    In your dreams, Bobby.
    How racist can you be...........you don't want an Indian American man to be elected President??

  5. #5
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by JayQueer View Post
    How racist can you be...........you don't want an Indian American man to be elected President??
    Not racist at all. I just don't want a Republicon to be elected president. I'd vote for an indigenous American, though... Elizabeth Warren.

    Have you ever tried pemmican?
    Last edited by chrisrobin; June 24th, 2013 at 10:38 PM.

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by JayQueer View Post
    How racist can you be...........you don't want an Indian American man to be elected President??
    There is nothing in his post that singles Jindal out based on his race. Your statement is a bizarre expression of reverse-racism. [Text: Removed] False outrage, indeed.

    It's a terrible law and opens up the state for lawsuits.
    Last edited by opinterph; June 25th, 2013 at 07:45 PM. Reason: removed interpersonal remarks expanding disagreement from one discussion to another; Refer to CE&P Posting Guidelines
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by JayQueer View Post
    How racist can you be...........you don't want an Indian American man to be elected President??

    Are you for real? No. don't bother to answer that.

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Just out of curiosity, where does the right to free speech end and the right to privacy begin? Does my right to free speech allow me to tell the world how many inches you have between your legs? Or, would that be a violation of your right to privacy?

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by JordanFrank View Post
    Well, since they love their precious guns so much , why is it such a big deal who knows it ? You'd think they'd be rootin' and tootin' to their hearts content about their "right" and such and not givin' a damn who knows it....!!! Gun owners got something to hide ??? hmmmmm
    I'm a pretty big proponent of gun control, but I actually like this.

    it seems like a bad idea to give criminals a map of houses to rob when they need a gun, and there's the whole right to privacy thing.

  10. #10

    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Another right wing republican rips the Constitution apart.


    Quote Originally Posted by JayQueer View Post
    How racist can you be...........you don't want an Indian American man to be elected President??
    Are you for real? No one gives a rats ass about this anchor baby's race. America doesn't want another idiot as President.....like we suffered with Bush.

    Like Piyush Jindal even has a chance in Hell in getting elected.
    Last edited by CowboyBob; June 25th, 2013 at 06:50 AM.

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Whatever one thinks of Bobby Jindal, he is absolutely correct in this case. Journalists are supposed to be foremost responsible and apolitical in their coverage... not push their own agenda. Why would they publish names of gun owners, the vast majority being responsible people who have committed no crimes? Irresponsible political agenda disguised as legitimate journalism. Plus the criminals also know where NOT to go, and hit the people who aren't protected. Ideology trumping common sense is hardly limited to the hard right.
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Who said that politics had anything to do with it? It doesn't have to be political.

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by Sausy View Post
    Whatever one thinks of Bobby Jindal, he is absolutely correct in this case. Journalists are supposed to be foremost responsible and apolitical in their coverage... not push their own agenda. Why would they publish names of gun owners, the vast majority being responsible people who have committed no crimes? Irresponsible political agenda disguised as legitimate journalism. Plus the criminals also know where NOT to go, and hit the people who aren't protected. Ideology trumping common sense is hardly limited to the hard right.
    Freedom of the Press. You may disagree with what a journalist publishes, but you do not make it illegal. What should be weighted in this debate is journalistic integrity. What is their intention of publishing these names? If it's not for the good of the community, then people should write letters to the editor and put pressure on the newspaper/station to chastise the reporter.

    What you don't do is have the state government step in and censor the press with expensive fines and even jail time. Seriously, jail time for publishing names? That's big government right there, Sausy.
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  14. #14
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    The operative word here is "publish". Just another victory for the NRA in that state. Jindal is in bed with them so this is no surprise.

  15. #15

    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Why does everyone call him "Bobby", when his real name is Piyush? Is that to Americanize his name so he doesn't sound so foreign?

  16. #16
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by CowboyBob View Post
    Why does everyone call him "Bobby", when his real name is Piyush? Is that to Americanize his name so he doesn't sound so foreign?
    because it's easier for Westerns to pronounce? it's the same reason my Korean friend Seok goes by the name "Erik" and my Indian coworker Mrityunjay goes by the name "Jay," I'd guess.

  17. #17

    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by darden View Post
    because it's easier for Westerns to pronounce? it's the same reason my Korean friend Seok goes by the name "Erik" and my Indian coworker Mrityunjay goes by the name "Jay," I'd guess.
    Of course that's why. But look at what the republicans have said about Barack Obama...... his name is foreign sounding. He wasn't born in the USA. Piyush & Supriya Jindal are even more foreign sounding. Republicans are against immigrants and his parents are immigrants (not to mention Florida's Marco Rubio's parents). They've been referring to an immigrant's first born as "anchor babies" and condemn them. Jindal and Rubio are then anchor babies. [Text: Removed]

    The GOP will never accept Piyush & Supriya Jindal as a President and First Lady. Republicans always nominate the next person who's "turn" it is to run, and it's always a white man. They're too racist to nominate anyone out of their own skin color.
    Last edited by opinterph; June 25th, 2013 at 07:44 PM. Reason: removed baiting remark

  18. #18

    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by JayQueer View Post
    How racist can you be...........you don't want an Indian American man to be elected President??
    Your accusation is the racist comment. chrisrobin made no disparaging remark. You should apologize.

  19. #19

    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by cm98059 View Post
    Just out of curiosity, where does the right to free speech end and the right to privacy begin? Does my right to free speech allow me to tell the world how many inches you have between your legs? Or, would that be a violation of your right to privacy?
    I like your question because it is, imo, difficult to answer. But consider that the rights that you mention are general concepts and, as general concepts, don't easily translate to specific and simplified examples such as you telling how many inches I've got. Are you telling it as a joke? Are you printing it in a newspaper? Are you testifying in court? You certainly do have the right to tell how many inches I've got unless you lying and that lie hurts my reputation or could be perceived to hurt my reputation. Slander is almost never considered anymore.

  20. #20
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by darden View Post
    I'm a pretty big proponent of gun control, but I actually like this.

    it seems like a bad idea to give criminals a map of houses to rob when they need a gun, and there's the whole right to privacy thing.
    Your post reminds me of a sign I saw. don't know if it is true, but....
    This domicile is protected by a double barrel shotgun and a colt 45. 7 days a week with one day off.
    You figure out what is the day I take off.
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  21. #21
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Jindal wants the GOP to stop being "the party of stupid."

    Then, he does his best to reinforce that notion.

  22. #22
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by Just_Believe18 View Post
    Freedom of the Press. You may disagree with what a journalist publishes, but you do not make it illegal. What should be weighted in this debate is journalistic integrity. What is their intention of publishing these names? If it's not for the good of the community, then people should write letters to the editor and put pressure on the newspaper/station to chastise the reporter.

    What you don't do is have the state government step in and censor the press with expensive fines and even jail time. Seriously, jail time for publishing names? That's big government right there, Sausy.
    Yes, the punishment IS excessive. Reading more about Bobby Jindal's approach here I do find it overreaching, and chilling in its own way. I just wish liberals would get equally upset with the excesses of journalists who push policy themselves, and the kind of press action like this has been done to shame gun owners, treat them like criminals.. telling the public they have horrible gun owners in their midst... they must be shamed and brought to light even though the vast majority are very responsible people who never would act against the law. If it's a liberal based paper, I really don't think some negative reactions from readers or anyone will do much to keep them from promoting their own particular agenda.
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  23. #23
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by cockbrain View Post
    I like your question because it is, imo, difficult to answer. But consider that the rights that you mention are general concepts and, as general concepts, don't easily translate to specific and simplified examples such as you telling how many inches I've got. Are you telling it as a joke? Are you printing it in a newspaper? Are you testifying in court? You certainly do have the right to tell how many inches I've got unless you lying and that lie hurts my reputation or could be perceived to hurt my reputation. Slander is almost never considered anymore.
    In effect, what the article says is that journalists are being forbidden from posting the names and addresses of people who have applied for Concealed Weapons Permits in the news paper. First of all, there is no need for the information to be posted. Secondly, the fact that you, me, or anyone else has applied for a concealed weapons permit is nobody's business unless the applicant has been convicted of a gun crime in the past, and there are exceptions to the law in those instances.

    There is no right to know this information. The public has the right to know that you have a concealed weapons permit to the same extent that the public has the right to know that my cock is 19 inches long and 9 inches in diameter.

  24. #24
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by darden View Post
    I'm a pretty big proponent of gun control, but I actually like this.

    it seems like a bad idea to give criminals a map of houses to rob when they need a gun
    , and there's the whole right to privacy thing.
    Exactly. This is a law that will make it harder for actual criminals to get firearms.

    But it is also a privacy matter -- it's no more the public's business to know who owns a gun than it is to know who engages in anal sex or buys fruit-flavored lube.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by Just_Believe18 View Post
    Freedom of the Press. You may disagree with what a journalist publishes, but you do not make it illegal. What should be weighted in this debate is journalistic integrity. What is their intention of publishing these names? If it's not for the good of the community, then people should write letters to the editor and put pressure on the newspaper/station to chastise the reporter.

    What you don't do is have the state government step in and censor the press with expensive fines and even jail time. Seriously, jail time for publishing names? That's big government right there, Sausy.
    No, it's not big government. Government's primary job is to protect the rights of the people, and privacy is a big one.

    And when essentially giving criminals information on where to get guns for free, thus making the owners victims by invitation, yes -- there should be criminal penalties for such actions, because it's aiding and abetting.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by JayQueer View Post
    How racist can you be...........you don't want an Indian American man to be elected President??
    Quote Originally Posted by cockbrain View Post
    Your accusation is the racist comment. chrisrobin made no disparaging remark. You should apologize.
    Absolutely.
    Last edited by Kulindahr; June 25th, 2013 at 10:19 PM.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  27. #27
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    .
    My original post (#2) is about politicians sucking up to the NRA, and that's all there was to it.

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by cockbrain View Post
    Your accusation is the racist comment. chrisrobin made no disparaging remark. You should apologize.
    You should apologize.

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  29. #29
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by mitchymo View Post
    I don't see any immediate purpose for releasing names of gun owners. It does depend on what is being reported and the relevance etc. It doesn't change the fact however, that this bill is an afront to the freedom of the press.
    Like you said, it's about freedom of the press. Whether there is immediate purpose or not, is utterly irrelevant.
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Kuli, I find it amazing that you are suddenly all for the tyranny of the majority (government) and censorship in the name of "good". That's how fascism worked too, correct? It was all to benefit the people.
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by Rolyo85 View Post
    Kuli, I find it amazing that you are suddenly all for the tyranny of the majority (government) and censorship in the name of "good". That's how fascism worked too, correct? It was all to benefit the people.
    How is the right to privacy "tyranny of the majority"?

    What I am and what I do belong to me, and to me alone. If the press wants to publish something about me, they owe me payment for that. The higher the potential risk, the higher the payment for that publication ought to be.

    If they want to publish lists of people with guns, they should be obliged to post a bond in the sum of all the possible payouts of wrongful death suits for not merely anyone who might get killed because suddenly a criminal had been handed the information as to who to attack to get that gun from, but all the possible deaths a criminal might cause by use of that gun -- for starters. And they should write a check to each ad every one whose privacy they are violating, in the sum of at least $10k -- not precluding the possibility of suit for emotional distress.

    The tyranny here is that anyone would endorse the violation of inalienable rights by persons hiding behind the facade of standing up for rights. It's the tyrants who invoke "good of the people" -- after all, it must be for the good of the people to make others second-class citizens, to round up entire groups of people depending on their ethnicity, to exclude spome people from voting.

    Do you realize that your arguments sound like the fan statements from John Boehner's office? It isn't all that surprising, because you share with the House Republicans a basic belief: that those in power can tell the rest what to do because they -- the PTBs -- say it's to "benefit the people".

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Yeah, frankly what you are and do is totally public domain if it is potentially threatening to others.
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    No, it's not big government. Government's primary job is to protect the rights of the people, and privacy is a big one.

    And when essentially giving criminals information on where to get guns for free, thus making the owners victims by invitation, yes -- there should be criminal penalties for such actions, because it's aiding and abetting.
    Plus you're also giving the criminals a great open invitation to raid where the guns AREN'T. It's the left wing version of "yellow journalism" and it's wrong no matter whatever the source, populist right OR left.
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    No, it's not big government. Government's primary job is to protect the rights of the people, and privacy is a big one.

    And when essentially giving criminals information on where to get guns for free, thus making the owners victims by invitation, yes -- there should be criminal penalties for such actions, because it's aiding and abetting.
    What about freedom of the press? What about freedom of speech? Those are big ones as well (hint: they're in the FIRST amendment.) This information is public domain information (i.e. not private, no reasonable expectation of privacy, etc.) and so a journalist has every right under their freedom of speech and freedom of the press, to publish this information. Your rights extend only so far as to not violate the rights of others. Thus, your right to privacy doesn't preclude a journalists' right to free speech and freedom of the press. Since a right to privacy is not violated here (this information is in the public record) and since the right to free speech and freedom of the press is being violated here (telling journalists what they can and cannot print when there is no infringing on another's rights) then the law is unconstitutional.

    On a side note, you rail against the government until it comes time when they support something you agree with and then you're all for them.

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by Rolyo85 View Post
    Yeah, frankly what you are and do is totally public domain if it is potentially threatening to others.
    These people aren't doing anything potentially threatening to others. Statistically, they're less of a threat than the rest of the population.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    He jests.
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by T-Rexx View Post
    Jindal wants the GOP to stop being "the party of stupid."

    Then, he does his best to reinforce that notion.


    With that comment, did Piyush Jindal call himself stupid since he's in the GOP?

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by CowboyBob View Post


    With that comment, did Piyush Jindal call himself stupid since he's in the GOP?
    Anyone who would allow so-called creationism to be taught in public schools, other than as a representative of a religious view with no science behind it, is stupid.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  39. #39

    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    Anyone who would allow so-called creationism to be taught in public schools, other than as a representative of a religious view with no science behind it, is stupid.
    Agreed, but what God created everything? Elohim? Ahura Mazda? Allah? And who's the prophet? Siddharta? Confucius? Muhammad? Jesus? Joseph Smith?

    And if Piyush Jindal's parents are from India, are they Sikhs? If not, they the millions of Indians who practice that religion must be wrong according to those who preach christianity.

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by tigerfan482 View Post
    What about freedom of the press? What about freedom of speech?
    In this same post, you yourself said:

    Your rights extend only so far as to not violate the rights of others. Thus, your right to privacy doesn't preclude a journalists' right to free speech and freedom of the press.
    Wouldn't the opposite also be true, that the freedom of the press also does not have the right to infringe upon my right to privacy? Also, Why would anyone have a right to know whether or not I have a concealed weapons permit.

    Since a right to privacy is not violated here (this information is in the public record) and since the right to free speech and freedom of the press is being violated here (telling journalists what they can and cannot print when there is no infringing on another's rights) then the law is unconstitutional.
    There is not a violation of the freedom of the press in this instance. Freedom of the press is a protection from the media becoming a propaganda tool of the government. And there is infringement upon the rights of others. Some concealed weapons permit holders are victims of abuse that need to protect their own and their families safety. Publishing their information in the local newspaper would give their abuser there addresses and allow the abuser to begin abusing his victims again.

    [QUOTE}On a side note, you rail against the government until it comes time when they support something you agree with and then you're all for them.[/QUOTE]

    The same thing could be said about your position. In the threads about the NSA, you are one of the parties saying that the government is protecting the rights of the people. Now, in this instance, you want the government to allow information to be collected and given without any oversight as to who is receiving the information.

    Because of the possible safety issues for victims of abuse, and the possible violations of the rights to privacy that I see being a possibility, I feel that there is no reason for this to be allowed. The possible damages that may occur outweigh any possible benefit from this process.

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    Anyone who would allow so-called creationism to be taught in public schools, other than as a representative of a religious view with no science behind it, is stupid.

    No one can make you feel inferior without your consent. - Eleanor Roosevelt

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by mitchymo View Post
    Like people with NRA stickers on their doors or windows aren't essentially doing the same thing? You live in the USA for goodness sake, if a criminal wants to get a gun, he don't blooming well need to look for clues in the tabloids, geez.
    I see what you are saying, but many people who are applying for a concealed weapons permit do not advertise that there is a weapon around. some applicant are domestic violence survivors who need a weapon for their personal safety. I am sure that you can see where posting these people's names and addresses may not be a good idea.

  43. #43

    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Who says a list of registered gun owners has to be pulbic information? There's no reason the state can't seal the records and refuse to realese them.

    It's by far more effective to prevent people from doing stupid things by denying them the opportunity then punishing them for it after the fact.

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by mitchymo View Post
    Like people with NRA stickers on their doors or windows aren't essentially doing the same thing? You live in the USA for goodness sake, if a criminal wants to get a gun, he don't blooming well need to look for clues in the tabloids, geez.
    Ah. So you think that if some people choose to do a thing subtly of their own free will, it's then legitimate to coerce everyone?

    Nice philosophy.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by Vitamin View Post
    Who says a list of registered gun owners has to be pulbic information? There's no reason the state can't seal the records and refuse to realese them.

    It's by far more effective to prevent people from doing stupid things by denying them the opportunity then punishing them for it after the fact.
    The question here is why it should be public information at all.

    All of us who are able-bodied are members of the militia. Who of the militia is going armed is a militia matter. Letting criminals know which members of the militia may be armed, or which have weapons that could potentially be stolen, is contrary to good functioning of the militia -- one may as well inform a nation's enemies the codes for access to the nation's arsenals, with maps to the locations.

    If we would just get back to the militia concept -- i.e. if we would just take the Constitution seriously -- a lot of these issues would go away.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by mitchymo View Post
    I'm afraid that i don't see that.

    I agree fully that any paper publishing names and addresses should have a reason for doing so, associated to a related news report, rather than just because they can, but there is no ethical reason why public information should not be publicly available to read in the press. What Mr Jindal is seeking to do, is restrict the freedom of the press in tackling what he perhaps feels is an infringement on the right to privacy. That is a worthy reason, but ill thought through. He needs to be addressing why the names and addresses of such individuals are public information in the first place.
    Trying to mute the press on the off chance that the information may be abused by criminals is a flimsy reason for intruding on that freedom, particularly when the whole point of having weapons is a deterrent. Such a proliferation of guns certainly hasn't got Mr Jindal wound up about the possibility that someone may get hold of one of them from a relative or friend or neighbour before going out and causing mayhem, so why on Earth should that excuse be used to justify this bill he has in mind, infringing upon the press (who i'm sure the average criminal doesn't even read their papers).
    Many states seal the records of who has applied for concealed weapons permits. They are not public record in many states. In Florida, the law that has been proposed DOES have exceptions in the event a crime has been committed, OR I there is public right to know. But for a paper to just decide that they want to publish this information just because, that is off limits. In 99.9% of concealed weapons permit applications, there is no public right to know.

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by cm98059 View Post
    In this same post, you yourself said:



    Wouldn't the opposite also be true, that the freedom of the press also does not have the right to infringe upon my right to privacy? Also, Why would anyone have a right to know whether or not I have a concealed weapons permit.



    There is not a violation of the freedom of the press in this instance. Freedom of the press is a protection from the media becoming a propaganda tool of the government. And there is infringement upon the rights of others. Some concealed weapons permit holders are victims of abuse that need to protect their own and their families safety. Publishing their information in the local newspaper would give their abuser there addresses and allow the abuser to begin abusing his victims again.

    The same thing could be said about your position. In the threads about the NSA, you are one of the parties saying that the government is protecting the rights of the people. Now, in this instance, you want the government to allow information to be collected and given without any oversight as to who is receiving the information.

    Because of the possible safety issues for victims of abuse, and the possible violations of the rights to privacy that I see being a possibility, I feel that there is no reason for this to be allowed. The possible damages that may occur outweigh any possible benefit from this process.
    All of your argument would be valid, were the information not public domain. When information is public domain, you have no right to privacy. In fact, the Constitution makes no specific mention of a right to privacy. So no, your "right" to privacy is not being violated when public domain information is printed in a newspaper under the auspices of freedom of speech and freedom of the press. It doesn't get much easier to understand than that.

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by tigerfan482 View Post
    When information is public domain, you have no right to privacy.

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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by mitchymo View Post
    Like people with NRA stickers on their doors or windows aren't essentially doing the same thing? You live in the USA for goodness sake, if a criminal wants to get a gun, he don't blooming well need to look for clues in the tabloids, geez.
    How can these two things possibly be equated...AT ALL?

    If somebody puts an NRA sticker (or for that matter an ADT alarm system, etc.) sticker on their residence, it is purely their choice to do so. I am willing to bet there are a lot of NRA or Gun Owners... (or similar organizations, too) members who would not put such a sticker on display under any circumstances. A newspaper which publishes the locations of all registered weapons makes it entirely impossible for a gun owner to make his or her own determination whether to keep the knowledge private.

    Other posters have brought up issues such as abuse-victims-in-hiding, etc. It can become life-threatening if the information becomes public. Even the Drivers License search (for which Opinterph gave the wonderful spoof site, which I have seen before, cool), to whatever extent is exists, is something which a person must PROACTIVELY interact with. It is simply wrong to force such information into a situation where everybody has complete access to it, without even trying.

    It used to be that a criminal in Putnam County, New York had to SERIOUSLY dig deep and canvass public records, if they were trying to find a dwelling to rob which probably didn't have guns there or in the possession of neighbors; now they can just wait for that person to leave by casing the place, because they know there aren't guns there. (MORE SO RURAL THAN IN THE CITY: Rural dwellers are, I think, FAR less likely to have unregistered guns.) Conversely, they now know where exactly to go, if they want to try to steal a weapon.

    The NRA member who puts the NRA sticker on his home...OK, if somebody wants to know that there's a gun in that home to steal, they have to ACTUALLY GO TO THAT PHYSICAL LOCATION and find the sticker. Publishing it in a newspaper means that somebody four thousand miles away can do nothing more than some keyboard and mouse work, leading to the newspaper article, and find out where ALL of the "known" guns reside.

    How can anybody even think of equating these?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    The question here is why it should be public information at all.

    All of us who are able-bodied are members of the militia. Who of the militia is going armed is a militia matter. Letting criminals know which members of the militia may be armed, or which have weapons that could potentially be stolen, is contrary to good functioning of the militia -- one may as well inform a nation's enemies the codes for access to the nation's arsenals, with maps to the locations.
    I agree so entirely with this. He knows what he speaks.
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    Re: Bobby Jindal Signs Bill Banning Journalists From Identifying Gun Owners

    Quote Originally Posted by mitchymo View Post
    The issue here is about the infringement upon the right to privacy. The argument being used thus far, to establish the negative consequence of that information being published in the papers, boils down to a security threat to those who posess a firearm. Such an argument becomes an hypocrisy when citizens freely advertise their own liklihood to be in possession of arms on their property, in the first instant, and contradictory to the traditional argument of gun supporters, that guns are in fact a deterrent. You can't start citing security risks to gun owners from criminals, when the whole purpose of having them to begin with, is to do the opposite function.
    This is laughable unless you seriously think that gun owners carry ALL their firearms on their persons ALL the time. It's also laughable unless you maintain that criminals will purposely wait until they know a gun owner is home before they attempt to steal said weapon.
    Last edited by Kulindahr; July 5th, 2013 at 09:23 AM.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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