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Thread: Cursive Script

  1. #51

    Re: Cursive Script

    Quote Originally Posted by secondmonkey View Post
    Ok then, why don't we teach EVERYBODY how to weld? EVERYBODY how to be a doctor? EVERYBODY how to build a house? Why do we force children to learn so many useless skills as they might find in a high school English class, but learning something that you could actually use, and maybe make a living off of, like fixing a car, is not required and mostly not even taught?

    Nobody makes a living off knowing cursive, or Shakespeare, except other people that teach that kind of crap.
    Most high schools schools teach everybody basic biology, chemistry, and physics. Those are necessary knowledge bases if you go into medicine or a science field, but not if you want to be, say, a musician or a lawyer. We have everybody do phys. ed. Welding and construction work require strength and physical dexterity. English classes are useful if you want to go into law, a business field, journalism, or the arts. I think history is important for everyone to know, just to understand the world we live in.

    There used to be more vocational training in high schools where they had shop class, and home economics requirements, where you could learn trade skills and things more relevant to day-to-day life. I think in Maryland, they even had driver's ed. at the actual school, instead of at independent schools. I agree that it would be useful to bring those back. That was before my time, though, lol.

  2. #52
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    Re: Cursive Script

    Quote Originally Posted by BrimstoneAndTreacle View Post
    Most high schools schools teach everybody basic biology, chemistry, and physics. Those are necessary knowledge bases if you go into medicine or a science field, but not if you want to be, say, a musician or a lawyer. We have everybody do phys. ed. Welding and construction work require strength and physical dexterity. English classes are useful if you want to go into law, a business field, journalism, or the arts. I think history is important for everyone to know, just to understand the world we live in.

    There used to be more vocational training in high schools where they had shop class, and home economics requirements, where you could learn trade skills and things more relevant to day-to-day life. I think in Maryland, they even had driver's ed. at the actual school, instead of at independent schools. I agree that it would be useful to bring those back. That was before my time, though, lol.
    Huh? Vocational classes are still available to most high schools these days I believe. They are probably not nearly as widespread as in the past (or have more selection of those kind of classes)..but they are still around. Wood shop and auto shop were available when I was in high school (only a few years ago).

  3. #53

    Re: Cursive Script

    Quote Originally Posted by dereperez View Post
    Huh? Vocational classes are still available to most high schools these days I believe. They are probably not nearly as widespread as in the past (or have more selection of those kind of classes)..but they are still around. Wood shop and auto shop were available when I was in high school (only a few years ago).
    Weird. We had none of those at my high school (graduated 2005). I guess it varies by school district. The impression I get that it's less than most high schools, though, because I've only seen them offered at a handful of schools.

    Edit: Actually, now that I think about it, you could take those classes at the county's community college. I guess they felt like it would be more cost-effective to have them there, than at each high school.
    Last edited by BrimstoneAndTreacle; May 8th, 2013 at 07:36 PM.

  4. #54
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    Re: Cursive Script

    i can write in cursive. i still do on occasion.
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    Re: Cursive Script

    I still don't know how to write in script and I can not read people's crap at work with their horrible hand writing. Lawyers and doctors are worst script writers on this planet.

  6. #56
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    Re: Cursive Script

    Wow! Obviously the subject has really upset some people; are we seeing a new battle of the Luddites here?

    I accept that being my age I have a totally different outlook on joined-up writing than many of the younger members. I actually taught it when I was a teacher in Primary education, and I didn't just teach it as we worked on it being as perfect as possible.

    For me it is the only way I write, letters, notes, shopping lists, etc. I look at it as the adult means of writing and admit to thinking the person un-educated who writes to me in print. It has always been a form of politeness to write a letter in cursive, legible of course, what is the point of sending it otherwise.

    I am not going to climb on the barricades and send all the print writers to a bloody death but even so I think it is a shame if people reject it as an obsolete skill to learn. All learning is a benefit and especially if you are able to produce something of beauty with it.

    I now have trembling hands and regretfully am unable to write the italic script I used to.

    So I leave you all to your keyboards, smartphones or what ever but I assure you I will be writing cursive till the day I die.
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  7. #57

    Re: Cursive Script

    Politeness?

    Until now, I've stayed out of this conversation because it was clearly (twice, actually) not addressed to me.



    Quote Originally Posted by rareboy View Post
    I think I already know the answer to this from what I see in our offices, but how many people here under the age of 25 can write using cursive script?

    How many people under the age of 25 have no idea what I mean by cursive script?

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    Re: Cursive Script

    Here is a bit of writing I find somewhat apropos during the civil war betwixt the "Luddistic" Aestheticophiles and the "narrow-minded" Technophiles. I figured I could demonstrate how even 28 year olds can have legible, coherent penmanship or "joined-up writing" as those sexy lads across the pond would say! So here's goes nothing and everything.
    Click image for larger version. 

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  9. #59
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    Re: Cursive Script

    In France we only write in cursive and are only taught that. I don't know if it's a problem or not, but I like the different styles of writing that it's providing, even if sometimes it's hard to read.
    Magna Veritas


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    Re: Cursive Script

    EDIT: I forgot to mention I'm left-handed...so even "sinister" folks such as myself can have legible penmanship!
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    Re: Cursive Script

    Quote Originally Posted by dpnice View Post
    All learning is a benefit and especially if you are able to produce something of beauty with it.
    The problem I have is forcibly teaching anything to somebody which is not a skill they will require in life. There are many things like this taught in schools and I have a major issue with it. For example, I was forced to take 2 years of spanish classes. I never wanted to speak spanish and I still don't know more than 3 words. Even if I was fluent it would not help me in my life in any way. Teachers could have used that time to teach me useful life skills I might be grateful for instead of worthless crap. If somebody wants to learn a second language that's great, they certainly should have the option, but forcing anybody is stupid.

    Only the very basics should be FORCED in school - reading, writing, simple math, how to get a job, how to read a newspaper. Specific skills that might only fit into a few jobs should not be routinely taught to everybody regardless of what they want to do with their life.

    Spending time learning and practicing cursive is no different than learning to weld. They are both skills that most people don't need to know. They both can be considered "art". Why don't we teach welding to every student? Why is there nobody complaining about the fact that most schools don't teach welding anymore? The difference is if nobody ever learned cursive nobody would notice much. If nobody ever learned to weld, the whole fucking world would fall apart...

  12. #62
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    Re: Cursive Script

    Quote Originally Posted by dpnice View Post
    i look at it as the adult means of writing and admit to thinking the person un-educated who writes to me in print...I now have trembling hands and regretfully am unable to write the italic script I used to..
    I guess it's only fair to judge you as uneducated and/or sloppy by your writing, as well, then.

    Quote Originally Posted by secondmonkey View Post
    .Only the very basics should be FORCED in school - reading, writing, simple math, how to get a job, how to read a newspaper..
    Jesus, talk about an outdated skill. Unless you're teaching the kids to spot the lousy reporting or find the spin.

    Lex

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    Re: Cursive Script

    My this subject has been nagging me all day and after reading the last few posts I am not certain that I can control the turbulence boiling around in my head.

    Obviously in this fast changing technological world there are going to be an incredible increase in the number of people who will never be in a position where they need to put pen to paper apart from a scribbled note; even shopping lists seem out of date now that one can visit the local supermarket on-line. I accept that the majority of our younger members still in education will hand in assignments prepared on their computer and printed off when finished; so I understand you being firmly against the need to have handwriting skills.

    But to limit your knowledge and skills to only those that will be of use to you in your adult life seems completely suicidal to me.

    How, as a schoolchild, can you determine what will be relevant to you as an adult? How many will paint, visit art museums, show an interest in history or sciences in their adult life; so does that imply we erase all this from the school curriculum?

    secondmonkey is it really just all "worthless crap"?

    I have always believed that learning something was a quality everyone aspired to. No matter the subject, learning how to learn was an aim in itself and provided many possibilities in later life to apply these skills to other areas.
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  14. #64
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    Re: Cursive Script

    Quote Originally Posted by dpnice View Post
    secondmonkey is it really just all "worthless crap"?
    Yes.

    I went to a rural high school. We learned how to fix tractors. If I wanted to be ridiculous I would say that everybody should learn to fix tractors in school, because otherwise how would they know if they wanted to grow up to be a mechanic or not? I'm sure all the girly gays on this website would love learning how to get dirty and fix things, right?

    The difference is I CHOSE to learn that. I could have spent that time in other classes learning other subjects. The fact is everybody is not cut out to work on tractors, therefore, not everybody chose that class. If I decide later on that tractors aren't for me, then I have nobody else to blame for wasting that time then myself. On the other hand, every student was forced to take English through the 12th grade. Even the ones who decided they wanted to spend the rest of their life working on tractors. Even the ones with an IQ of 12 who everybody knows would never, ever, ever get a job reading or writing big words. WTF? If you don't pass English class you don't get a diploma. If you don't pass the tractor class, nothing happens.

    And yes, high school aged kids are old enough to make decisions about what they might want to do with the rest of their life. I suppose that's another problem I have with cursive, is that it's forced upon really young children who simply don't know any better.

    I, for one, am VERY HAPPY to see that cursive is mostly NOT being taught anymore in public schools. If you want to write in cursive, knock yourself out. Make up words and letters if you like. Just don't force it upon anybody else.
    Last edited by secondmonkey; May 10th, 2013 at 05:19 PM.

  15. #65
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    Re: Cursive Script

    PS - if the PARENT wants to teach their child how to write in cursive, that's great. Spend as long as you want doing it. Don't waste the publicly funded school teacher's time with your outside art projects.

  16. #66

    Re: Cursive Script

    Quote Originally Posted by secondmonkey View Post
    PS - if the PARENT wants to teach their child how to write in cursive, that's great. Spend as long as you want doing it. Don't waste the publicly funded school teacher's time with your outside art projects.
    I find your hostility toward cursive writing fascinating.
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    Re: Cursive Script

    Quote Originally Posted by borg69unimatrix View Post
    I find your hostility toward cursive writing fascinating.
    My "hostility" is towards wasting people's time, and even worse, wasting MY tax dollars on something unnecessary. It's not just cursive. Schools are always complaining that they don't have enough money. And then they waste it on stupid shit like teaching cursive.

    Why not teach how to apply clown makeup? That's as useful as learning cursive. Some kids might grow up to be clowns, right?
    Last edited by secondmonkey; May 10th, 2013 at 05:45 PM.

  18. #68

    Re: Cursive Script

    Cursive isn't just about learning an archaic method of writing. It's about manual dexterity, and perseverance. Control, following directions, seeing a project through to the end. Eye / hand coordination. Form, and function. Expression.

    Words are powerful things. How one organizes those words, and the forms they take, and the feelings and emotions behind them are just as powerful and emotive, if not more so by the shapes of the letters that make them up.

    If shape and style had no meaning, why are there hundreds - thousands of different Fonts instead of just one?

    Would the Constitution be as special if it was displayed in Times New Roman??



    I fully understand your aggravation towards the school systems abuse of funds. I blame the administration costs, and PERS programs, Not teaching someone how to write legible.
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    Re: Cursive Script

    Quote Originally Posted by secondmonkey View Post
    Yes.

    I went to a rural high school. We learned how to fix tractors. If I wanted to be ridiculous I would say that everybody should learn to fix tractors in school, because otherwise how would they know if they wanted to grow up to be a mechanic or not? I'm sure all the girly gays on this website would love learning how to get dirty and fix things, right?

    The difference is I CHOSE to learn that. I could have spent that time in other classes learning other subjects. The fact is everybody is not cut out to work on tractors, therefore, not everybody chose that class. If I decide later on that tractors aren't for me, then I have nobody else to blame for wasting that time then myself. On the other hand, every student was forced to take English through the 12th grade. Even the ones who decided they wanted to spend the rest of their life working on tractors. Even the ones with an IQ of 12 who everybody knows would never, ever, ever get a job reading or writing big words. WTF? If you don't pass English class you don't get a diploma. If you don't pass the tractor class, nothing happens.

    And yes, high school aged kids are old enough to make decisions about what they might want to do with the rest of their life. I suppose that's another problem I have with cursive, is that it's forced upon really young children who simply don't know any better.

    I, for one, am VERY HAPPY to see that cursive is mostly NOT being taught anymore in public schools. If you want to write in cursive, knock yourself out. Make up words and letters if you like. Just don't force it upon anybody else.
    I was taught basic cookery, woodwork, metalwork, working with plastic, sewing, knitting amongst some of the arts and crafts at school. I've not had to do anything with woodwork since, nor metal work, plastics or knitting. I do find cookery and sewing useful though. I have been taught french and german at school. Since leaving I've only ever used French in France once in an airport using rusty french from 25 learnt years ago. I've since had no reason to use german, so, ultimately, according to your observation the amount of money wasted in teaching these subjects seems unconscionable.

    For some people like you maybe, joined up handwriting hasn't been your forté. For some in your class, maybe it helped them with neat flowing joined up script. What I'm hinting at is, teaching our kids the range of life skills such as pen control is not a waste of money, it gives them the option of free will to choose to take up and develop their skills or not. You chose not to and are justifying your decision by the amount of money wasted. Perhaps you could refund the costs of such education back to your local education department as a sign of your fervour.


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    Re: Cursive Script

    If I'm feeling extra gay, I prefer to write in cursive.

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    Re: Cursive Script

    Quote Originally Posted by secondmonkey View Post
    My "hostility" is towards wasting people's time, and even worse, wasting MY tax dollars on something unnecessary. It's not just cursive. Schools are always complaining that they don't have enough money. And then they waste it on stupid shit like teaching cursive.

    Why not teach how to apply clown makeup? That's as useful as learning cursive. Some kids might grow up to be clowns, right?
    I'm sure tax dollars have been supporting worse causes than cursive writing.

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    Re: Cursive Script

    I write in my own type of cursive.. my cursive is absolutely sexy if I'm pissed while writing.. but I haven't written in cursive in a really long time so I wouldn't know anymore

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    Re: Cursive Script

    Quote Originally Posted by secondmonkey View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by frankfrank View Post

    Nearly all of these people send their orders written in cursive.
    Do you service a bunch of old people?
    Generally, yes. I think, in general, the Millennials have not grown up as a generation that includes a lot of "collectors" of stuff/things - I estimate that my *AVERAGE* buyer is most likely in the late Fifties, agewise. Perhaps even early sixties (but probably not, as there IS some new blood younger than 30, and one such person will "average out against" three or four people who are 68 or 74). Consider traditional collectibles - stamps, coins, records, antiques, books, sports cards, comics - I fall into such traditional offerings. All indications are that young people are NOT flocking to any of these hobbies in droves, not even those collecting hobbies which CAN bring young devotees in such as sports cards (or other collecting hobbies which involve amassing "STUFF"). That is why I am sure I will continue to encounter a lot of cursive writing, as long as I shall keep doing this.

    I won't say there is no COLLECTING going on, though. Plenty of younger people are collecting things - but, nowadays, those "things" are usually (or often) intangible software-defined things such as downloads which will fit on one or a very few hard drives as pure data. Photo ALBUMS and collections are actually far more popular than they ever were in the past, but nowadays almost always kept as data files. Heck, they don't even MAKE Kodachrome film anymore, and that was always the common household name for film branding.

    It is not at all unusual for somebody to take (and end up "collecting") 200 or 300 pictures from a vacation anymore. It used to be something which was generally reserved for people with more than average disposable income. Now a simple smart phone can take pictures which are almost indistinguishable from film, to the untrained eye, and good enough to represent the purpose of the photo.

    Even if not, I would be very glad that I learned it. Learning to read cursive is not as massive a project as learning the works of Shakespeare, or learning the streets of Cincinnati to become a taxi driver, or taking one or two astronomy courses in college. My work is NOT the only place that I encounter cursive, not at all.
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    Re: Cursive Script

    I am 31 and these days I can only sign my name in cursive. I broke my wrist when I was 24 so writing at all by hand is hard for me, but it is very painful to try and write in cursive.
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    Re: Cursive Script

    I wrote cursive for a little bit around grade school/middle school. Then when it was no longer required, I started to do a mix of cursive and printing before fully reverting back to printing.

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