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  1. #1
    stop the bullshit rareboy's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    I am on the edge of my seat with all of this. It is making me crazy to have to wait through all of this, particularly from the perspective of a Canadian with these rights.

    I think that the Prop 8 decision is going to be as narrow and focussed on the points of law as it can get instead of being about whether homos can get married. This could make it a wild card ruling.

    DOMA? I can't see how the SC could help but tell the Feds that they have no justification for this law.

  2. #2
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Thanks for all the info, JB! I knew the hearings for the cases were starting soon. I'll be following all this very closely and will be sure to stick to this thread and update it as necessary. Let's make this a repeat of November!!!
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Will be landmark case and hope and pray the vote goes for our community.

  4. #4

    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Foamy the Squirrel explains it all.


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    Execuvette Rolyo85's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    The weird part is:

    1. Both sides - ours and the haters - talk about these two cases as if they're the new Roe V Wade. They expect historic decisions, not just narrow ones.

    2. Hate groups already have the preemptive sadz, as if they've already lost. Their entire rhetoric is "even if the court overrules it, we will never stop!" (which they will, because they're broke) instead of "the court will never overrule it".

    It's kinda funny to see how hard the blow from November 6 was to their bigoted cause.
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    JUB Addict Ninja108's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Gay marriage will be settled long before abortion is IMO.

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    PerScientiam AdJustitiam bankside's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by rareboy View Post
    I am on the edge of my seat with all of this. It is making me crazy to have to wait through all of this, particularly from the perspective of a Canadian with these rights.
    I know, eh? First healthcare, now equality….they just need to do something about guns and we can basically start calling them the United Provinces of America!

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    JUB Addict Ninja108's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    By the way, there could be no ruling at all in either case if the court rules that appellants have no standing to appeal.

    http://www.lgbtqnation.com/2013/03/s...marriage-case/
    Very well could be the case but I don't see that happening only because they know it would simply be kicking the can down the road.

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    JUB Addict Ninja108's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    John Roberts is a hard core conservative but he knows that the scenario above would reach his court again,something many say he loathes.

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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    The best outcome, a narrower one than any outright legalization of marriage equality, is one that overturns DOMA by stating those who live in states where civil unions or marriage equality outright have been legalized have full federal recognition under the law. My view of the court is that except in the most extreme cases it should not determine policy, but create the conditions that the actual law and spirit of the Constitution be fully applied to all. Narrow but important victories in the process is far more important than sweeping dictates that instead of deciding things create nothing but bitterness...it's the court's role to interpret legality of constitutional issues, not legislate from upon high. It irritates me no end to see every court vacancy used by right(yes, Benvolio... judicial activism is NOT limited o the left)or left to push social engineering agendas... the only thing a justice on the Court owes is trying to do what is right under the law, and striking down what goes beyond the scope of the law.

    The outcome I hope for and think will happen will go a long way in fracturing the hold of the hard religious right on the GOP...No elitist decisions from on high for them to rally conservatives around, but hard cold matter of fact.
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    JUB Addict Ninja108's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    I sadly think there will be the nine state solution. WHich is dumb for several reasons including the fact there really would be no way to spin the fact a couple is married in one state but not another. The lawsuits will fly and the Supreme Court knows that.

  12. #12
    stop the bullshit rareboy's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Doesn't surprise me at all, given the source.

    Sadly though, I believe the decision will be so narrow on Prop 8 as to not even seem to deal with the issue of homo marriage at all, while the DOMA case will embolden Scalia and Thomas to trample all over the constitution in order to deliver a hate filled diatribe against homos.

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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    The direct Facebook links to a rally in your city.

    http://purpleunions.com/blog/2013/03...medium=twitter
    Thank you, thank you, thank you JB for posting this!!! I'll be going to the one in Gulfport, MS tomorrow night and I will try to remember to take lots of pictures and post some of them to this thread. I'm surprised at the number of events there are around the nation.
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  14. #14

    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    I tried to organize one for Duluth, but we're swamped with it being spring break for the legislature so we need to concentrate our efforts on lobbying!

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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    The only reason I could see a broader ruling is because there will be more lawsuits against state's marriage laws and the Supreme Court knows it.

  16. #16
    PerScientiam AdJustitiam bankside's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    What would stop a state from reinstating the provision in its own constitution that a black person is 3/5ths of a human for government purposes?

  17. #17
    PerScientiam AdJustitiam bankside's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post


    A state can pass any language it wants to. The 14th Amendment would make it unenforceable though.
    Ahh! Excellent. Thank you for that. This is where I was trying to go the other day corresponding with you about how this could play out. It's been a long time since my US Government class.

    Okay, so Equal Protection Clause - that really does limit what a state can declare to be "constitutional" within the provisions of its own constitution" Or at least what it can make operative.

    If that is the case, then equal marriage really can't be subject to different interpretations of "what is a right?" from one state to another; the Supreme Court will have to find whether marriage is a right under the national constitution, and thus whether each state will have to implement it pursuant to the Equal Protection Clause. I don't think it matters that marriage is performed under state jurisdiction when the issue gets raised to the level of "rights" because then equality matters.

    The other day I was arguing that if homophobic states had just had the good sense to shut up and make their arguments about procedure, they might have been able to withstand a challenge. But by naming marriage as a right to which gay people are not entitled, they open themselves to Equal Protection arguments, which I think are likely to be the strongest arguments against their position.

  18. #18
    PerScientiam AdJustitiam bankside's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by loki81 View Post
    er, who would even benefit from that? it would destroy southern states congressional representation. (one of the great misconceptions of the three-fifths compromise... abolitionists didn't want to count slaves at all, while southerns wanted to count them as individuals to boost their power in Congress)

    in any event, slavery is illegal so that could never happen (Article 1, Section 2, Paragraph 3 defines them as slaves, not "black people")
    I don' think anyone would, either for ruthless political interests or for any other reason. I just wanted to pick a horrifying outcome in law to understand whether states had sufficient sovereignty to bring it about for all purposes of law within that state, if they were so inclined. They cannot. I think that is useful to know for our own legal fight.

  19. #19
    Virtus in medio stat JUB Admin
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    Neither the federal government nor states may discriminate based on sexual orientation.
    Can you explain the context/meaning of this statement in a little more detail?

  20. #20
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    In addition to the obvious equality and due process protections in the US Constitution, the idea of heightened scrutiny, used to protect classes with a history of persecution, which hopefully will be established in these two cases, means that the government must have a better reason than a simply plausible explanation for a discriminatory law that targets gays and lesbians.
    So you are speculating that the Court will apply heightened scrutiny in this week's cases and that will limit discrimination by the federal government or states by subjecting new laws to the test of heightened scrutiny?

  21. #21
    JUB Addict maxpowr9's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    I agree. Constitutional equality is too obvious. Neither the federal government nor states may discriminate based on sexual orientation.

    Although, a ruling on states' rights will not depend on whether couples can get federal benefits.
    That's the real kicker to that and it would fuck up the tax code completely if they made DOMA a "state's rights issue". I think that is something the court has to take into consideration. That's kind of why it's an "all-or-nothing" situation for DOMA but Prop 8 could just as easily be upheld.
    Last edited by maxpowr9; March 25th, 2013 at 08:52 PM.

  22. #22
    PerScientiam AdJustitiam bankside's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    Okay hold on, I think you are confusing the jurisdiction of state and federal constitutions, and the concept of federal question.

    State courts get to decide what is permissible under their own constitutions, and no federal court can decide otherwise, because it is not federal question unless it violates the US Constitution. How this applies is that states are allowed to decide which marriage laws are constitutional under its own constitution, until the federal courts intervene under the federal one.

    Still, an unconstitutional state's decision remains relevant within state common law. In fact, if a federal decision is later overturned, then the state's formerly unconstitutional decision is reactivated. We could actually see this happen in Alaska, if its constitutional amendment is overturned, because that would reactivate a dormant state court case that became moot in 1998.

    A matter of nuance that can complicate things, some state courts do decide matters of federal question, as Minnesota did in 1971, and in that case the federal courts may want to intervene and make an even standard.
    I think I follow all that but the part I'm emphasizing is the "unless it violates the US Constitution" bit. I don't see how a state law, or provision of any state constitution, that makes marriage unequal can be found to be compliant with the US Constitution.

    I mean I'm almost not even saying anything novel here. It is obvious the US Supreme Court has standing to review whether California has made an acceptable amendment to its state constitution; it did not say "Sorry; this matter concerns Californians and therefore we say nothing."

    SCOTUS has the authority to determine whether California's constitutional provisions are permissible, and it will use the US Constitution as its measuring stick. I don't see how it can avoid measuring Proposition 8 against the Equal Protection Clause; if so Prop 8 is doomed.
    Last edited by bankside; March 25th, 2013 at 09:04 PM.

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    PerScientiam AdJustitiam bankside's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Once SCOTUS makes a determination that California's constitution fails by the standard of the Equal Protection Clause, they're also making a statement about the meaning of the Equal Protection Clause which will be applicable to all states and the national government. If the US Constitution obliges California to provide equal marriage then it obliges everyone.

    That's how an "expansive" ruling would work, is it not?

  24. #24

    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    I agree with everything you said. It will be obvious to future generations of jurists, that without question, a summary judgment may be made that invalidates such laws.

    Actually, I think the plaintiffs in Strauss v. Horton (2009) should have asked the California Supreme Court to rule on the US Constitution, although I am not sure if the court had the ability to do so.
    State courts do have the ability to do that, however it opens up a possible appeal to the Supreme Court.

  25. #25

    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    All 50 states? Cool.

    At least there is no longer mandatory review.
    Such was the case with the BSA litigation in 2000.

  26. #26
    PerScientiam AdJustitiam bankside's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    It's January like weather outside, since a recent storm decided to sweep down some Canada air for us. How nice
    You're welcome… :P

  27. #27
    stop the bullshit rareboy's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    Gonna make my way down to the Supreme Court now.

    It's January like weather outside, since a recent storm decided to sweep down some Canada air for us. How nice

    Hopefully my partner can join. He's getting some car repairs Nevermind, I'll drag his ass to the metro XD
    The best part?

    We're missing it all here in Ontario.

    It is actually 5C and sunny today.

    Raise hell. I wish we were there to show our support.

  28. #28
    stop the bullshit rareboy's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    The California case is being argued 10 years to the day after the court took up a challenge to Texas's anti-sodomy statute. That case ended with a forceful ruling prohibiting states from criminalizing sexual relations between consenting adults.

    Supporters of Proposition 8 say the court should respect the verdict of California voters who approved the ban in 2008 and let the fast-changing politics of gay marriage evolve on their own.

    Justice Anthony Kennedy was the author of the decision in Lawrence v. Texas in 2003, and he is being closely watched for how he might vote on the California ban. He cautioned in the Lawrence case that it had nothing to do with gay marriage, but dissenting Justice Antonin Scalia predicted the decision would lead to the invalidation of state laws against same-sex marriage.
    http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2...-marriage.html

  29. #29
    stop the bullshit rareboy's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    From Reuters:
    Two members of the U.S. Supreme Court, both viewed as potential swing votes on the right of gay couples to marry, raised doubts about California's gay marriage ban on Tuesday as they questioned a lawyer defending the ban.

    During the first half of oral argument, Chief Justice John Roberts pressed lawyer Charles Cooper on whether Cooper's clients had a legal right to appeal in federal court in favor of California's Proposition 8.

    "I don't think we've ever allowed anything like that," Roberts said. If the clients lack that right, the Supreme Court may not reach the central question of gay marriage rights.

    Justice Anthony Kennedy used one of his questions to focus on the "imminent legal injury" facing 40,000 California children being raised by gay and lesbian couples. "They want their parents to have full recognition and full status," he said.
    As some have cautioned though, beware of Kennedy. He wrote the dissenting opinion on Obamacare after everyone thought that he would be neutral.

  30. #30

    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by rareboy View Post
    From Reuters:


    As some have cautioned though, beware of Kennedy. He wrote the dissenting opinion on Obamacare after everyone thought that he would be neutral.
    Totally different issue. He's always been very supportive of gay cases.

  31. #31
    Execuvette Rolyo85's Avatar
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    And yet it seems he will chicken out of Prop 8 and they won't rule on it at all. Which is great for California but sad for the rest of us, as this case could have achieved so much more...
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  32. #32

    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by Rolyo85 View Post
    And yet it seems he will chicken out of Prop 8 and they won't rule on it at all. Which is great for California but sad for the rest of us, as this case could have achieved so much more...
    A broad ruling was never likely. There are already cases working their way up through the courts which will get proper rulings in our favor.

  33. #33

    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Will anyone remind Clarence Thomas his marriage used to be illegal too?

  34. #34
    stop the bullshit rareboy's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    I'll bet there are at least 3 judges who have done so behind closed doors.

  35. #35
    JUB Addict Ninja108's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    I could be wrong but I sadly feel what will happen is the can will get kicked down the road. Marriage will be legal in California and that will be it.

  36. #36
    Sex God AstareGod's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Nice pics, JB! I was tempted to drive up to DC to be part of this historic occasion, but it's just too hard to swing that kind of thing financially. I'll be hobnobbing with all the Mississippi southerners tonight, though. Will post a few pics from that. Keep up the great work!
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  37. #37
    JUB Addict T-Rexx's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    Okay here are some of the pictures I took. I'll post some more of the signs later

    West end of the Supreme Court building.



    Equality Across America banner. They organized the 2009 march with the Courage Campaign.



    The first West Point cadet to marry in the cadel chapel. The speakers is either Penelope Gnesin or Brenda Fulton.



    Tom from the opposition. I spoke with him for 20 minutes. He was actually a nice guy. I think he came away with a better understanding.



    Interracial couple with a powerful message.



    Respondents leaving after oral arguments. Sorry I was kinda far away

    None of the pics are showing up for me. All blanks.

    I can't even copy and paste the urls to open a pic.

    Anyone else having this problem?

  38. #38
    JUB Addict T-Rexx's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    Ok all Ohioans should be proud


    I don't get it.

    Is there something about Ohio in the pic (it doesn't display for me)?
    Last edited by T-Rexx; March 26th, 2013 at 12:22 PM.

  39. #39

    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Your pics disappeared.

  40. #40
    JUB Addict T-Rexx's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by CowboyBob View Post
    Your pics disappeared.
    Thanks.

    I thought it was me.

  41. #41
    Sex God AstareGod's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    I see them logged in, but not logged out

    Well I'm sure there is no shortage on the blogosphere...
    Attachments uploaded via JUB won't show up for people who are not logged in. So that behavior is, I believe, intentional.

    I opened this thread using the Opera web browser, which I hardly use, and the pictures show up there, too, so JUB is still delivering them OK. T-Rexx, I'm not sure why you can't see them. PM me your email address and I'd be happy to send them over if JB is OK with that.
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  42. #42
    Bammer's Papa
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    Editor of lawyers.com thinks the ruling will strike down all bans.
    That's a good read.

    Quote Originally Posted by RazorzEdge88 View Post
    It's so wrong on so many levels.

    But just to squash this notion of a possible "backlash of bitterness" - most people don't care anymore. There would be a very small minority of Americans who will get worked up over this, but most people will get on with their lives.

    There are two reasons I reach this conclusion:

    1. The bevy of recent polls showing majority support for marriage equality across the United States
    2. The fact that most Repubs seem to be giving up/in on this issue; an apples-to-apples comparison of values voters polling at CPAC in recent years has shown that ssm is now a low priority issue even for the conservative base

    People just don't care these days. Sitting and biting one's nails over some huge "backlash" seems laughably pointless.
    Thank the bankers. The people who might otherwise get out and really scream about the issue are too busy trying to just keep a roof over their heads and food on the table.

    Quote Originally Posted by bankside View Post
    Once SCOTUS makes a determination that California's constitution fails by the standard of the Equal Protection Clause, they're also making a statement about the meaning of the Equal Protection Clause which will be applicable to all states and the national government. If the US Constitution obliges California to provide equal marriage then it obliges everyone.

    That's how an "expansive" ruling would work, is it not?
    Right -- if they agree that the EPC applies, this will hit the whole country. I don't see how they can avoid it, unless they either deny standing or decide after the fact that they shouldn't have heard the case, and just dismiss it (that's re the Prop 8 case).

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  43. #43
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by RazorzEdge88 View Post
    Lame. Justice delayed is justice denied.

    Sorry, people in ~40 states, you're still second-class citizens!

    Why the FUCK didn't SCOTUS save everyone time a year ago by denying standing when this was before the 9th Circuit!!?!??!
    Because the State of California, through its Supreme Court, said that the proponents did have standing to defend California law, and that makes this a very tricky issue because in effect California decided that because of the way their laws work, the proponents in this situation can act as official defenders of the issue. The flip side is that if, as I think they should, SCOTUS acknowledges standing because California said the proponents have it, that won't apply to any other state of even broadly to California, because California's laws are unique and so is the situation. So there's no danger in acknowledging standing; it won't be a precedent for much at all except possibly another unique case from California (or possibly some other sate with very similar initiative proposition laws).

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  44. #44
    JubberClubber White Eagle's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    I see the pix just fine, but then I'm logged in.
    My favorites from 60 best signs.

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/mjs538/the-a...8-at-the-supre


    I like #42:
    If you're so worried about the sancity of traditional marriage.
    Protest Divorce!

    #13
    Jesus had 2 Dads and He turned out fine.
    BEWARE! Harassing the Indian may result in sudden and severe hair loss.

  45. #45
    JUB Addict maxpowr9's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by White Eagle View Post
    I see the pix just fine, but then I'm logged in.
    My favorites from 60 best signs.

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/mjs538/the-a...8-at-the-supre


    I like #42:
    If you're so worried about the sancity of traditional marriage.
    Protest Divorce!

    #13
    Jesus had 2 Dads and He turned out fine.
    #4.
    I'd fuck equality.

  46. #46
    PerScientiam AdJustitiam bankside's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by JockBoy87 View Post
    I agree with everything you said. It will be obvious to future generations of jurists, that without question, a summary judgment may be made that invalidates such laws.

    Actually, I think the plaintiffs in Strauss v. Horton (2009) should have asked the California Supreme Court to rule on the US Constitution, although I am not sure if the court had the ability to do so.
    Okay further to that, probably even Scalia would hold that the US Constitution permits to legalise equal marriage, would he not? If some liberally-easterny-elitist-socialist state passed Proposition 666 instead, writing equal marriage into their state constitution, Scalia would not be able to say the US Constitution has measures which would preclude the change.

    To me its clear that the US Constitution considers equal marriage to be permissible, where it is so established by the state. The only question is whether it is obligatory.

    And that's why I think the homophobic states have shot themselves in their collective foot through "taking a stand" and amending their own constitutions in a fit of hand-wringing piety.

    If they had left well enough alone, there would have been plenty of room for a "narrow" decision in their favour by a court with a hostile conservative majority. They might have even got away with the disfigurement of their own state constitutions had other states said nothing. BUT some states approved equality measures. And they did it in a variety of compelling ways: through court decision; through legislative action; through referenda.

    So now you have a direct contest between states saying "this is a right here, and the US Constitution permits us to say so" and other states saying "this is not a right, and we hope the US Constitution permits us to get away with it."

    I think the only way to leave Prop 8 standing and make any sense of Equal Protection is to show that the US Constitution actually precludes equal marriage. There will be no possibility of that, not even in Scalia's most twisted and impassioned fantasies.

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    JUB Addict Ninja108's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    It'll be in their court again. There are anti-gay marriage lawsuits pending in other states and those are being defended by the state.

  48. #48
    stop the bullshit rareboy's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Okay....

    What's the word on the street after today?

    http://tv.msnbc.com/2013/03/27/5-tak...doma-hearings/

    I can't tell whether it is a done deal or not. It certainly seems that the conservative judges are grumpy, while the liberal judges are going to speak out on behalf of the homos.

  49. #49
    Wildly Inappropriate SonOfSlobone's Avatar
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    ^^^Yeah, I think that's about right. There seemed to be a consensus among the judges, even the conservative ones, that DOMA was a bad law, because it interfered with state control over marriage, and the requirement that the federal government respect state marriage laws. I agree that Part 3 of DOMA is going to be overturned on that basis. Section 2, which says that states don't have to honor other states' same sex marriages, wasn't addressed today, so most likely it will stand.

    What I thought was interesting was that the anti-DOMA lawyers kept trying to bring up equal protection, and the justices kept steering them back to the question of whether the federal government should even have its own definition of marriage (apart from that definition being "whatever each state says it is".) So I think it's going to be a narrow decision. But hey, for married couples living in states that have gay marriage, this will have a lot of practical consequences, especially for taxes. By no means a minor victory.

  50. #50
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    Re: Supreme Court to Hear Marriage Equality Cases

    Quote Originally Posted by SonOfSlobone View Post
    ^^^Yeah, I think that's about right. There seemed to be a consensus among the judges, even the conservative ones, that DOMA was a bad law, because it interfered with state control over marriage, and the requirement that the federal government respect state marriage laws. I agree that Part 3 of DOMA is going to be overturned on that basis. Section 2, which says that states don't have to honor other states' same sex marriages, wasn't addressed today, so most likely it will stand.

    What I thought was interesting was that the anti-DOMA lawyers kept trying to bring up equal protection, and the justices kept steering them back to the question of whether the federal government should even have its own definition of marriage (apart from that definition being "whatever each state says it is".) So I think it's going to be a narrow decision. But hey, for married couples living in states that have gay marriage, this will have a lot of practical consequences, especially for taxes. By no means a minor victory.
    That is my sentiment, also.

    But it means that it will be another century or more before all of America has marriage equality.

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