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  1. #1
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    The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    I know this is an Alternet link, however if you go to the Think Progress site it will direct you to this URL.
    These cuts are absurd. They are cutting things the GOP has been trying to get passed. Education, Obamacare, Homeless Assistance Grants, World Trade Center Health Program Fund, World Trade Center Health Program Fund. These are most needed programs and they are going to cut funds.

    http://www.alternet.org/economy/32-d...tter803596&t=6

    Think Progress / By Igor Volsky

    The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts
    As Obama said during a press conference, "This is not going to be a apocalypse. It's just dumb. And it's going to hurt."
    March 3, 2013 |

    With Congress unable to reach a deal to avert the indiscriminate spending cuts put in place in the Budget Control Act of 2011, President Obama on Friday signed an order authorizing the government to begin canceling $85 billion from federal accounts for this fiscal year.

    [Quoted Text: Truncated: © 2005-2013 Center for American Progress Action Fund]

    Original Source Link: http://thinkprogress.org/politics/20...uts/?mobile=nc
    Last edited by opinterph; March 4th, 2013 at 09:00 AM. Reason: truncated excessive quote from copyrighted source; added quote tags & source link; strikeout of incorrect notation
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  2. #2
    ecce homo rareboy's Avatar
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Most of these cuts will never occur. They will get funded through the back door in different bills.

    It is what makes coming up with a real fiscal plan just impossible in the US.

  3. #3
    loki81
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    they're already talking about pushing a new bill to restore "defense" spending, which is funny given that those are the cuts most justified in the sequester.

    ever since the Secretary of Education outright lied about teachers already getting fired because of the sequester, I'm side-eying any dire predictions coming from the White House.
    Last edited by loki81; March 4th, 2013 at 10:52 AM.

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    rareboy I sure hope you are right about that. Am just listening to a Dem congress critter saying how inexcusable cutting that Trade center health is.
    loki81 I wish all the lies in DC would just stop. I don't see any reason for them in the first place. Let's just keep on going I guess.
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  5. #5
    GiancarloC
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Significant education funding is being cut and many teachers will be fired now. California itself is seeing educational programs cut, so is Texas. So republican voters are going to experience the pain too. Everyone can thank the assholes in the Congress.

    I guess creating a society full of morons is optimal for the GOP. It creates more potential voters.

  6. #6

    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    170 million people will lose their jobs as a result of sequestration.

    On a side note we just gave Egypt $250 million and millions to the Syrians to buy war materials.
    Last edited by Jack Springer; March 4th, 2013 at 12:36 PM.

  7. #7
    GiancarloC
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Nobody in this thread is claiming 170 million people will lose their jobs. Have anymore strawmans?

    And $250 million won't buy anyone squat for war materials. And where is the source? US-Egypt relations are ice cold right now. And there is nothing going on with the Syrians.
    Last edited by GiancarloC; March 4th, 2013 at 12:39 PM.

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Springer View Post
    170 million people will lose their jobs as a result of sequestration.

    On a side note we just gave Egypt $250 million and millions to the Syrians to buy war materials.

    D'uh Jack.

    You do realize don't you, that the aid to these countries is to buy the US munitions that the military industrial complex in the Us has to clear out of their inventory.

    These countries just don't get a wheelbarrow full of cash to spend just anywhere.

    Or do you not understand how US foreign aid works?

  9. #9
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by GiancarloC View Post
    Nobody in this thread is claiming 170 million people will lose their jobs. Have anymore strawmans?

    And $250 million won't buy anyone squat for war materials. And where is the source? US-Egypt relations are ice cold right now. And there is nothing going on with the Syrians.
    Regarding Egypt...it's all over the news networks. Apparently, Kerry released funds to Egypt (where he is visiting today)but the figure being used is $180 million.

  10. #10
    GiancarloC
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Maybe we should cancel the F-35... it's full of problems (recently grounded for test flights) and cost hundreds of billions. Of course republicans would never touch it. $85 billion? That's just a fraction of what that jet fighter cost this country.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Orlandude View Post
    Regarding Egypt...it's all over the news networks. Apparently, Kerry released funds to Egypt (where he is visiting today)but the figure being used is $180 million.
    Source? And that figure isn't even close to enough to cover anything. Certainly not their military.

  11. #11
    loki81
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    CAIRO — Secretary of State John F. Kerry released $250 million in badly needed economic assistance for Egypt on Sunday, telling the country’s divided political classes that they must make economic and political reforms to qualify for additional U.S. support...

    Amid questioning from Congress about Egypt’s political instability and the U.S. budget crunch, some $450 million in U.S. aid to Egypt has been frozen on Capitol Hill. . In addition, the International Monetary Fund has held off on loans and debt relief worth more than $4 billion.

    Kerry’s announcement of aid includes $190 million from the frozen $450 million, following discussions with congressional Republicans who have objected to several of Morsi’s policy moves and past statements offensive to Jews. The remaining $260 million from that pot could be freed if Morsi follows through on promised reforms, a U.S. official said on condition of anonymity to describe the sensitive diplomacy.

    Separately, Kerry pledged $60 million for a program to boost economic development. That could increase to $300 million in coming years, Kerry said.
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/...586_story.html

  12. #12
    GiancarloC
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Economic assistance, and not military aid.

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    ^ It would be interesting to see how much of this comes back to the US in purchases of US weapons.

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    We spend way more military than it's necessary. If the administration want stop the it. They would claim it is a threat to national security.

  15. #15

    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by GiancarloC View Post
    Nobody in this thread is claiming 170 million people will lose their jobs. Have anymore strawmans?

    And $250 million won't buy anyone squat for war materials. And where is the source? US-Egypt relations are ice cold right now. And there is nothing going on with the Syrians.
    Maxine Water, dumb congressman, seems to think so ....



    Keep up with the news man.

    The administration is still giving away free money.

    ... and last week they released 2000 criminal illegal aliens -- murderers, rapists, thieves into the US.

  16. #16
    GiancarloC
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    NOBODY FUCKING CARES about that youtube video. People on here can fucking speak for themselves. And it's not about giving away free money. Oh and this administrations have seen record deportations and arrests of undocumented people.

    What a fucking crock.

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    JubberClubber White Eagle's Avatar
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    opinterph Thank you for fixing that link. When I clicked on Think Progress it sent me to the same Alternet link.
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    Virtus in medio stat JUB Admin opinterph's Avatar
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Springer View Post
    170 million people will lose their jobs as a result of sequestration.
    Wow, thatís scary. The unemployment rate will be higher than 100%.

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Springer View Post
    170 million people will lose their jobs as a result of sequestration.

    On a side note we just gave Egypt $250 million and millions to the Syrians to buy war materials.
    What's wrong with you? Do you even think about some of the things you type? The population of the United States is only 310+ million people.
    #439th oldest member on JUB.

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Just_Believe18 View Post
    What's wrong with you? Do you even think about some of the things you type? The population of the United States is only 310+ million people.
    (see the video above)

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by GiancarloC View Post
    Significant education funding is being cut and many teachers will be fired now. California itself is seeing educational programs cut, so is Texas. So republican voters are going to experience the pain too. Everyone can thank the assholes in the Congress.

    I guess creating a society full of morons is optimal for the GOP. It creates more potential voters.
    There is no evidence of that. Even if there was, it would be impossible to claim they were connected to the sequester since the effects of it haven't been felt at all yet.

  22. #22
    GiancarloC
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by JB3 View Post
    There is no evidence of that. Even if there was, it would be impossible to claim they were connected to the sequester since the effects of it haven't been felt at all yet.
    There is plenty of evidence. Many states will see major cuts to federal funding for schools, and that is the case here in California.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jennif...b_2804221.html

    To claim there is no evidence of that is just silly. Many of these school systems already have problems with funding. California has issues with Prop 13 which still has a negative impact on our schools. Programs will be cut. There is no two ways around this.

    Low income areas will be hit very hard because many of those schools rely on federal funding. Period. This is FACT.

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by GiancarloC View Post
    There is plenty of evidence. Many states will see major cuts to federal funding for schools, and that is the case here in California.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jennif...b_2804221.html

    To claim there is no evidence of that is just silly. Many of these school systems already have problems with funding. California has issues with Prop 13 which still has a negative impact on our schools. Programs will be cut. There is no two ways around this.

    Low income areas will be hit very hard because many of those schools rely on federal funding. Period. This is FACT.
    There is absolutely NO evidence that any of the cuts that have already occurred, or cuts that are occurring as we sit here going back and forth, are related to the sequester. It is impossible for them to be related because the effects of the sequester will not be felt for some time to come.

  24. #24
    GiancarloC
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by JB3 View Post
    There is absolutely NO evidence that any of the cuts that have already occurred, or cuts that are occurring as we sit here going back and forth, are related to the sequester. It is impossible for them to be related because the effects of the sequester will not be felt for some time to come.
    Bullshit. There is plenty of evidence. Keep skirting the reality. Such cuts will lead to layoffs to school systems already teetering on financial trouble. The sequestration will hurt these school systems even further (particularly LAUSD) and lead to layoffs. And I'm not talking about immediate layoffs, but in the near term its effects will be felt. As soon as this upcoming summer. Read the article please.

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by JB3 View Post
    (see the video above)
    Ah, I see. So it was a comment of satire to what could have easily been Waters confusing 170,000 jobs to all of the other "million" statistics she was citing in the cuts. Everything else in the video was spot on with the terrible cuts that are going to happen to the bottom Americans.
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    Virtus in medio stat JUB Admin opinterph's Avatar
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by JB3 View Post
    There is absolutely NO evidence that any of the cuts that have already occurred, or cuts that are occurring as we sit here going back and forth, are related to the sequester. It is impossible for them to be related because the effects of the sequester will not be felt for some time to come.
    Your statement is perfectly logical and reasonable; however, the state agency with which I interact most frequently has announced a 2-week delay in the processing of all documents, reports, licenses, etc. The state is claiming that the delay is a result of sequestration.

    (It’s a red state, btw.)

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by JB3 View Post
    There is absolutely NO evidence that any of the cuts that have already occurred, or cuts that are occurring as we sit here going back and forth, are related to the sequester. It is impossible for them to be related because the effects of the sequester will not be felt for some time to come.
    Not sure what you mean by "some time to come." Medicare payments to doctors and hospitals get cut effective April 1 (in 27 days) - specifically because of the sequester.

  28. #28

    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by opinterph View Post
    Your statement is perfectly logical and reasonable; however, the state agency with which I interact most frequently has announced a 2-week delay in the processing of all documents, reports, licenses, etc. The state is claiming that the delay is a result of sequestration.

    (It’s a red state, btw.)
    What sort of agency is it? Why should a state agency be dependent upon Federal funds to operate?
    Lets remember, that all the sequestration money is money the Federal government would have to borrow, since it is part of the deficit.
    Last edited by Benvolio; March 5th, 2013 at 05:52 AM.

  29. #29
    loki81
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by opinterph View Post
    Your statement is perfectly logical and reasonable; however, the state agency with which I interact most frequently has announced a 2-week delay in the processing of all documents, reports, licenses, etc. The state is claiming that the delay is a result of sequestration.

    (It’s a red state, btw.)
    do we believe them? or is it just Washington Monument Syndrome, like the illegal alien dump last week?

    The Washington Monument syndrome, also known as the Mount Rushmore Syndrome, or the firemen first principle, is a political tactic used in the United States by government agencies when faced with budget cuts. The tactic entails cutting the most visible or appreciated service provided by the government, from popular services such as national parks and libraries to valued public employees such as teachers and firefighters.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washing...ument_Syndrome

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by JB3 View Post
    There is absolutely NO evidence that any of the cuts that have already occurred, or cuts that are occurring as we sit here going back and forth, are related to the sequester. It is impossible for them to be related because the effects of the sequester will not be felt for some time to come.
    Quote Originally Posted by T-Rexx View Post
    Not sure what you mean by "some time to come." Medicare payments to doctors and hospitals get cut effective April 1 (in 27 days) - specifically because of the sequester.
    It now appears that a significant number of doctors have already stopped accepting Medicare. It's already difficult for Medicare patients to find a doctor, and it just became more so.

    http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/healt...are_03-04.html

    While it is true that most of the effects of the sequester are yet to come, the consequences have already begun.

  31. #31
    GiancarloC
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Benvolio View Post
    What sort of agency is it? Why should a state agency be dependent upon Federal funds to operate?
    Lets remember, that all the sequestration money is money the Federal government would have to borrow, since it is part of the deficit.
    Not paying attention. Many of these state agencies are low on money and have programs operating in low income areas. I guess right wingers want more uninformed voters.

    BTW, lets cancel the F-35. It has cost $400 billion. It's been a complete waste of money. Should have put that towards education and health care.

  32. #32
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    What if Education was fully funded and the Pentagon had to hold a bake sale to buy an F35?

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    I've seen this AM that Yellowstone National Park is setting the opening back from 1 or 2 weeks due to cuts.
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  34. #34
    loki81
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by rareboy View Post
    What if Education was fully funded and the Pentagon had to hold a bake sale to buy an F35?
    is money the problem? we're already spending more per student than many other countries and seeing poorer results.

    maybe I'm jaded growing up next to Newark, NJ where the school district spends more per student than I paid for college and yet is amongst the worst in the state.

    (that aside, I'd love to see DoD funding cut... but that's not going to happen until we clean house in DC. it doesn't seem like either party is particularly interested in cutting military budgets. of course, it's not exactly money getting thrown into a shredder either. the project is presumably employing American engineers, factory workers, etc)

  35. #35
    GiancarloC
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Actually we're not spending enough. And I'm jaded enough to see what the lack of funding has done to school systems here in California, in particular with regards to the LAUSD which has a severe lack of funding (thanks to prop 13). Lets just be real. Less funding won't make our school systems better. A combination of better administration and better funding well.

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    You are right...it must be skewed by private school tuition is all I can imagine.


  37. #37
    GiancarloC
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    The problem in the US is much of the funding is lopsided... a great deal of it is directed to richer areas, while poor areas still suffer from a serious lack of funding. Many high schools in LAUSD can't even afford to buy new books and computers. There is severe disparity in this system. If the money was spread out more evenly and in a fair manner, test scores could be better.

  38. #38
    loki81
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    what's the number, though?

    Newark, NJ averages like $20,000/student per year. that's more than most private schools charge and pretty comparable to what I paid for college... will we see better results at $30,000/student? $40,000?

    Saddle River, one of the wealthiest town in the state, averages about $12,000/student (which is lower, but still higher than, say, South Korea or Japan)

  39. #39
    GiancarloC
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Don't dodge. Cutting funding isn't going to somehow solve the problems.

  40. #40
    loki81
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    cutting funding certainly won't help the problem, I just question how much it will actually hurt in a broad sense.

    like TSA lines increasing from an eternity wait to an eternity and 15 minute wait.

    I thought (and this could totally be wrong, feel free to correct me) that most of the education department cuts were from scaling back the Head Start stimulus money, which was intended to be temporary to begin with.

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    I would hazard a guess that the US needs to go through the same restructuring exercise that Ontario went through in the late 1990's and amalgamate a lot of schools and school boards in order to reduce the overhead costs of teaching and get more dollars into the classroom.

    I would also note that US schools having to have security guards present probably isn't the most effective way to spend education dollars either.

    The other thing that I couldn't find is whether there was a capital cost component to the expenditures. That could make a substantial difference.

    Because given the outcomes of education in the US, I'm having a hard time taking the numbers at face value.

  42. #42
    loki81
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    New Jersey may be a bad state to hold up as an example, it just happens to be the one I'm most familiar with (between living here and having lots of family/friends who work as teachers in the state).

    fun fact: NJ has 565 municipalities (compared to California, which only has 482 despite having almost 5 times the population)... there's a lot of overhead.

  43. #43

    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by White Eagle View Post
    I know this is an Alternet link, however if you go to the Think Progress site it will direct you to this URL.
    These cuts are absurd. They are cutting things the GOP has been trying to get passed. Education, Obamacare, Homeless Assistance Grants, World Trade Center Health Program Fund, World Trade Center Health Program Fund. These are most needed programs and they are going to cut funds.
    The sequestration was an agreement both parties disliked on the theory that they would then be forced to compromise to prevent it from happening. Obviously, it has not worked.
    It illustrates the bigger problem that our budget is largely consumed by spending over which the Congress little control, including interest on the debt, social security etc. The discretionary part of the spending is an increasingly small part of the budget.

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    Virtus in medio stat JUB Admin opinterph's Avatar
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Benvolio View Post
    What sort of agency is it? Why should a state agency be dependent upon Federal funds to operate?
    Lets remember, that all the sequestration money is money the Federal government would have to borrow, since it is part of the deficit.
    Ironically, it is the Department of Revenue and I have no idea how they justify the sequester as somehow to blame for their sudden gridlock.

    Quote Originally Posted by loki81 View Post
    do we believe them? or is it just Washington Monument Syndrome, like the illegal alien dump last week?
    What’s odd is that a state controlled by the Party demonstrating a strong desire to cut federal spending would squeal so quickly when a reduction of that spending appears to be forthcoming. Perhaps the sequester is merely an excuse they are using to explain an unrelated problem.

  45. #45
    GiancarloC
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Benvolio View Post
    It illustrates the bigger problem that our budget is largely consumed by spending over which the Congress little control, including interest on the debt, social security etc. The discretionary part of the spending is an increasingly small part of the budget.
    There are projects like the F-35 that could have simply been cancelled by Congress and the Pentagon. Lets be real here.

  46. #46
    Rambunctiously Pugnacious JayHawk's Avatar
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by opinterph View Post
    Your statement is perfectly logical and reasonable; however, the state agency with which I interact most frequently has announced a 2-week delay in the processing of all documents, reports, licenses, etc. The state is claiming that the delay is a result of sequestration.

    (It’s a red state, btw.)
    Because we differentiate between operations and support duties, my top line budget was cut 38%. However, support such as my recruiting work are only a fraction of the overall budget compared to ops funds. So even though they will cut us until we can not operate for half the year, the main focus of the navy will be affected. Already the civilians were given the furlough notice. That is to last for FY13. Fy14 starts October 1st, I imagine they will RIF folks and that is when we will see the biggest economic downturn.

    However, as I have said previously, the cuts must occur for many of these red state folks to realize how much of what they 'like' gets cut by the feds. Your politicians can no longer lie to you and tell your your taxes are being stolen and funneled to New York City when services die off in your back yard. Hell I hope they cut another ten percent in May when the CR runs out.

    Once people actually see the republicans are lying to their faces about who funds what... they will kick them to the curb. That doesn't excuse democrats gets things wrong as listed above. But Democrats are not on record saying this sequestration is a good thing, and don't worry about it. Republicans are and it will haunt them in 2014 and 2016.
    Everyone can be great, because everyone can serve.
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  47. #47

    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    ^^

    First of all sequestration was Obama's idea. He owns it.

    Do you really expect people to believe that your overall budget (top line) is being reduced 38%?

    You may have fallen for the fake gloom and doom of the President .. but don't expect the rest of us to believe your nonsense.


  48. #48
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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Yesterday I saw an article that shows the Native Americans and poor sections in the state are being cut and teachers and school closings the whole deal. Then I couldn't get into JUB and I forgot what the article was, therefore, I cannot find it in my files. But the Sequestration is working now on cutting for real. I just cannot find it.
    BEWARE! Harassing the Indian may result in sudden and severe hair loss.

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    Re: The 32 Dumbest and Most Devastating Sequester Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by GiancarloC View Post
    The problem in the US is much of the funding is lopsided... a great deal of it is directed to richer areas, while poor areas still suffer from a serious lack of funding. Many high schools in LAUSD can't even afford to buy new books and computers. There is severe disparity in this system. If the money was spread out more evenly and in a fair manner, test scores could be better.
    That is not true at all. There have been multiple studies done, and real-life attempts to dump money into poor areas, that have proven that money won't fix the problem.

    You're also woefully misinformed about spending and funding. The example I always use is Chicago, which spends $13,078 per student to operate. The suburb I came from, which is wealthy, spent $10,202 per student during that same period. The Chicago district has 404,151 students, 42,000 employees and an annual budget of $5.11 billion. The suburban district has 29,000 students, 3,000 employees, and a budget of $286.6 million. Chicago's district has a whopping 681 schools ( ! ), while the suburban district has 33. Chicago's district has 10 times the students but a budget that is 18 times higher.

    The issue isn't the funding, its how it is spent.

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