No More Love for GoProud

[rareboy]

Gee.

Most homos hate them.

The Republicans still don't love them.

Poor GoProud. Literally. By being shut out of CPAC, these homos are missing the opportunity to rub shoulders at the urinals with some big potential Daddy Moneybucks supporters.

Or I guess they could still hang around there and hope for some action in the stalls.

http://blog.pe.com/multicultural-bea...om-conference/

Great way to get support guys. But never fear. Come the next election, GoProud will still declare their undying support for the Republican candidate who openly shuns homo rights, like they always have in the past.

[Rolyo85]

Misleading thread title. It assumes there was ever any love for GOProud...

[Vitamin]

CPAC has been irrelevant for quite some time. I question GOProud's motives for wanting in the organization, it really gains them nothing.

I mean seriously, what did they get last year, a booth? Oh yeah, a booth is the answer to equality! If they were actually trying to get Republican candidates to support our causes I might respect them, but they seem more like some sort of social club that loves being shit on. Don't do scat, kids. It means you're a Republican.

[chance1]

GoProud is in good company

Chris Christie wasn't invited either

[GiancarloC]

Yeah, there wasn't ever any love for either of the backstabbing groups known as GOPRoud and Log Cabin Republicans... these two groups have done nothing to help the gay community.

[Stardreamer]

Given the stirrings in the wind on the right, GOProud and LCR may find themselves getting some love before too long. The Republicans are beginning to see the light at the end of the social conservative tunnel but are realizing its a demographic train barreling down on them that they need to either embrace or give up any chance of winning election again soon. Some prominent voices are already realizing it, hence the list of over 100 prominent conservatives filing a brief with the SCOTUS supporting gay marriage. Making up with GOProud would be a first step.

[GiancarloC]

The republicans are beginning to see the light at the end of the social conservative tunnel? Where? they aer still sticking to their same old shitty views. Lets not try to sugarcoat it... they aren't getting any better. And that list isn't great. I mean come on... Meg Whitman? Who cares about her? She mismanaged ebay beyond belief and nearly bankrupted herself trying to buy the governor seat in California. That list really had no big names on it... and it wasn't anything special. GOProud needs to be marginalized... half of their members aren't even gay to begin with.

[Stardreamer]

The republicans are beginning to see the light at the end of the social conservative tunnel? Where? they aer still sticking to their same old shitty views. Lets not try to sugarcoat it... they aren't getting any better. And that list isn't great. I mean come on... Meg Whitman? Who cares about her? She mismanaged ebay beyond belief and nearly bankrupted herself trying to buy the governor seat in California. That list really had no big names on it... and it wasn't anything special. GOProud needs to be marginalized... half of their members aren't even gay to begin with.

Every news story I see categorizes them as 'prominent' Republican and Conservative leaders including Eastwood of the Empty Chair but its always easier to ignore the message and downplay its relevance. If you really think that the RNC and other conservatives are so completely unable to read the writing on the wall and adjust then there is nothing really to debate, they will go down to become a third rate political party and something else will take their place. They simply cannot ignore the turning tide of public opinion on gay marriage forever no matter how much their social conservative wing can wish otherwise. Time will tell.

[GiancarloC]

Every news story I see categorizes them as 'prominent' Republican and Conservative leaders including Eastwood of the Empty Chair but its always easier to ignore the message and downplay its relevance. If you really think that the RNC and other conservatives are so completely unable to read the writing on the wall and adjust then there is nothing really to debate, they will go down to become a third rate political party and something else will take their place. They simply cannot ignore the turning tide of public opinion on gay marriage forever no matter how much their social conservative wing can wish otherwise. Time will tell.

Who? Meg Whitman for example isn't an prominent republican leader. She's operating a company right now on the brink of bankruptcy (what a surprise). Yeah, I do think they are incapable of reading the writing on the wall and they'll stick to their egos rather than admitting they are wrong. I'd rather see them go down to a third rate political party.

[Telstra]

Misleading thread title. It assumes there was ever any love for GOProud...

nah quite accurate because of this title:
"Conservative gay group GOProud excluded from conference"

[maxpowr9]

I remember this article in the NYT last week and it was quite a breath of fresh air.

Can the Republicans Be Saved From Obsolescence?

It is quite a long read but these paragraphs stuck out like a sore thumb to me [well, one sentence but it needs context]...

On Nov. 30, more than 2,000 progressives shuffled into the Washington Convention Center to participate in RootsCamp, an annual series of seminars hosted by the New Organizing Institute, where the most cutting-edge digital and grass-roots organizing techniques are discussed. The shaggy and the achingly earnest are well represented at RootsCamp, which makes it an easy target of derision from the right. A reporter from the conservative publication The Daily Caller attended the postelection gathering in 2010 and made great sport of the “unconference,” with its self-conscious inclusiveness, which the reporter termed “multilingual, multicultural and multi-unpurposeful.”

But the handful of conservatives who attended the conference this past November were in no mood to sneer. One was Patrick Ruffini, a 34-year-old leader of the G.O.P.’s young-and-restless digerati. At RootsCamp, his breathless tweets of the sessions held by top Obama organizers — “In eight years, calling people will be obsolete”; “Digital organizing director and field director will be one and the same” — set off a buzz among Republican techies. Ruffini was plainly impressed by the openness of the experience. “I’m like, Wow, they’re doing this in front of 2,000 people, and the system seems to actually work,” he told me a month later. "The thing I was struck by at RootsCamp was that in many ways, the Democratic technology ecosystem has embraced the free market — whereas the Republican one sort of runs on socialism, with the R.N.C. being the overlord.”

The bolded part is something that the GOP has to get over or else it will keep tripping over its own feet.

[crimsonpaine]

Not news, as they were excluded last year.

[Stardreamer]

Who? Meg Whitman for example isn't an prominent republican leader. She's operating a company right now on the brink of bankruptcy (what a surprise). Yeah, I do think they are incapable of reading the writing on the wall and they'll stick to their egos rather than admitting they are wrong. I'd rather see them go down to a third rate political party.

Then that is the way they will go but it is not likely, once the base groups start splitting off and all they are at risk of being left with dwindling numbers of die hard religious conservatives and tea party fanatics, the leadership will either have to adapt or a new party will form that is the main Republican party in all but name (or vice verse depending on how the breakup happens). The latter would be preferable actually since it would take most of the far right nutcase baggage out of the party and leave the new party with no need to even pay them homage. Bottom line is there is going to be an opposition party, it is a must in our system, if the Republicans become so far out of touch with the electorate to fulfill that role then someone else will.

You may not agree that these are leaders but they are still prominent voices in the community and their stand highlights that there are cracks forming in the party over these social issues. The first sign of a coming sea change. With the majority of the voting public against them on the point and the libertarian wing willing to provide a reasonable view change on the subject, I just don't see the Republican party as a whole riding gay marriage down in suicidal flames.

[maxpowr9]

^ I would rather see a coalition in the form of a moderate/libertarian party [the socially liberal and fiscally conservative party] but that is only a day dream.

[GiancarloC]

Then that is the way they will go but it is not likely, once the base groups start splitting off and all they are at risk of being left with dwindling numbers of die hard religious conservatives and tea party fanatics, the leadership will either have to adapt or a new party will form that is the main Republican party in all but name (or vice verse depending on how the breakup happens). The latter would be preferable actually since it would take most of the far right nutcase baggage out of the party and leave the new party with no need to even pay them homage. Bottom line is there is going to be an opposition party, it is a must in our system, if the Republicans become so far out of touch with the electorate to fulfill that role then someone else will.

The problem with this is that most of the money is centered around social conservatives. The social conservatives have the most amount of money within the party, and thus most of the power. This is why I don't see the party moving to being a moderate party as some here would want. I'd rather see the republican party shrivel up and crumble away. The less they are in power the better. Not even their so called "moderates" are appealing when it comes to other issues.

You may not agree that these are leaders but they are still prominent voices in the community and their stand highlights that there are cracks forming in the party over these social issues. The first sign of a coming sea change. With the majority of the voting public against them on the point and the libertarian wing willing to provide a reasonable view change on the subject, I just don't see the Republican party as a whole riding gay marriage down in suicidal flames.

They aren't that prominent. Whitman for example isn't prominent. Her campaign for Governor in California was one of the most catastrophic failures in California history.... she outspent Jerry Brown by several times and lost by double digits. And I don't care for the so called "libertarian wing" either. As I said in Hot Topics recently, libertarianism is NOT a moderate philosophy and it's NOT an optimal one either. It's a horrible set of views that pushes such rubbish like austerity.

Libertarians are NOT moderates. A real moderate isn't one who disavows government the way they do. And the "libertarian wing" in the republican party is Ron and Rand Paul... yeah... forget about it!

[Rolyo85]

^ I would rather see a coalition in the form of a moderate/libertarian party [the socially liberal and fiscally conservative party] but that is only a day dream.

Libertarians are not moderate.

[JockBoy87]

What will happen to the GOP is likely what we are seeing in the Conservative Party (UK). There will be a time when they have to take a stand on major gay rights issues and it splits the party right down the middle. We have yet to see what the resolution will be on the other side of the pond, and if it is a major factor in the 2015 elections. Remember, while the CP leadership is pushing same sex marriage for England right now, just 10 years ago they voted to keep discussion about gays out of public schools. Maybe we are already seeing early signs, such as the VAWA vote, and the Republican brief in the matter of the Prop 8 case.

The GOP has to change within itself, and no amount of pressure from the outside is going to make them give up the social conservative support. They can't and expect win elections. I am starting to believe that part of Romney's problem was a failure to excite social conservatives.

The GOP can change in two ways. For one, the bigotry will one day significantly hurt their electability, worse than if they abandon anti-gay bigotry, and party operatives will make the change, or, the GOP may also change when the social conservatives elect to de-emphasize homosexuality themselves. I can't see either one happening until strong support for LGBT rights gets into the 70+ percent range. The reason why it didn't take that level of civil rights support for the Nixonites to drop racism was the adoption of the Moral Majority in the 1970s. Along that vein, I suppose what GOProud and LCR can do to be most effective, is not try to pressure the Republican Party, but find some suitable source of support to fill the enthusiasm gap for the Republican Party, preferably something that doesn't involve demagoguery.

[kayman23]

Well, it isn't like CPAC was ever really "accepting" of them in the first place, but this is downright hilarious. But don't worry, GOProud will be back like roaches to a nasty house. They have permanent Stockholm Syndrome, they seek acceptance and attention from their oppressors...

[maxpowr9]

What will happen to the GOP is likely what we are seeing in the Conservative Party (UK). There will be a time when they have to take a stand on major gay rights issues and it splits the party right down the middle. We have yet to see what the resolution will be on the other side of the pond, and if it is a major factor in the 2015 elections. Remember, while the CP leadership is pushing same sex marriage for England right now, just 10 years ago they voted to keep discussion about gays out of public schools. Maybe we are already seeing early signs, such as the VAWA vote, and the Republican brief in the matter of the Prop 8 case.

The GOP has to change within itself, and no amount of pressure from the outside is going to make them give up the social conservative support. They can't and expect win elections. I am starting to believe that part of Romney's problem was a failure to excite social conservatives.

The GOP can change in two ways. For one, the bigotry will one day significantly hurt their electability, worse than if they abandon anti-gay bigotry, and party operatives will make the change, or, the GOP may also change when the social conservatives elect to de-emphasize homosexuality themselves. I can't see either one happening until strong support for LGBT rights gets into the 70+ percent range. The reason why it didn't take that level of civil rights support for the Nixonites to drop racism was the adoption of the Moral Majority in the 1970s. Along that vein, I suppose what GOProud and LCR can do to be most effective, is not try to pressure the Republican Party, but find some suitable source of support to fill the enthusiasm gap for the Republican Party, preferably something that doesn't involve demagoguery.

Germany faces a similar problem with Merkel...

Gay Rights Emerge as Campaign Issue in Germany

I get the feeling she will get "das boot" next election.

[JockBoy87]

Germany faces a similar problem with Merkel...

Gay Rights Emerge as Campaign Issue in Germany

I get the feeling she will get "das boot" next election.

I think there were Bundesrat elections where the coalition parties lost seats, before the latest push for increased partnership rights, so it may not be connected to LGBT rights in any way. If you make a thread, I'm sure our German friends would be glad to comment.

[chrisrobin]

GoProud is in good company

Chris Christie wasn't invited either

Remind anyone of the barroom scene from Star Wars.

[Sausy]

GoProud..wtf is with the name if they do everything they can to sweep under the rug their gay identity and STILL can't get the cnservative base to accept and welcome them? If you're gonna get fucked, be a power bottom...not subservient one only taking it to fulfill your duties. There's nothing "proud" about them.

[GiancarloC]

Remind anyone of the barroom scene from Star Wars.

Is that for real?

I mean lets go through the first line... we have a losing VP candidate who sees Russia from her back yard , a crazy nutcase, a cheating hypocrite and another sore loser who couldn't admit defeat.

The second line... you have Santorum (name says it all), idiot gun nut who wants to arm school teachers, and a losing Presidential candidate.

Apparently CPAC loves its losers and dumbasses.

[eastofeden]

I am able to co exist peacefully with a straight socially liberal, environmentally conscience but fiscal conservative Republican (there are alot of them in the San Francisco Bay Area and in Silicon Valley)...some people call them California Republicans...but I have yet to meet a Gay Republican that I can get along with. I almost never have to go deep before I hear racist or misogynist or anti choice and even homophobic crap from them....all of those things are dealbreakers for me. Life is too short.

[Rolyo85]

I am able to co exist peacefully with a straight socially liberal, environmentally conscience but fiscal conservative Republican (there are alot of them in the San Francisco Bay Area and in Silicon Valley)...some people call them California Republicans...but I have yet to meet a Gay Republican that I can get along with. I almost never have to go deep before I hear racist or misogynist or anti choice and even homophobic crap from them....all of those things are dealbreakers for me. Life is too short.

Meh, I don't see how I could be friends with someone, regardless of how liberal and otherwise cool they are, when I know they vote against my rights as a human being...

[GiancarloC]

California republicans? Those guys are declining in influence big time... they lost all sorts of districts in the last election (Mary Bono Mack for one). The republican party in California is almost in the dustbin (and party affiliation wise they are down below 30% of the population). They are such a non-factor it's kinda funny. They can't even do anything in our State Assembly. They just sit there. They can't even filibuster. The democrats rule this state. Sorry for that off topic bit...

Edit: And looking it up California is almost 65-35% Democrat. Those "fiscal conservatives" are almost long gone in this state. And they can take their anti-tax attitudes elsewhere. Can't wait to see that loser Kevin James get wiped out in the Mayor's Race here in LA.

[eastofeden]

Meh, I don't see how I could be friends with someone, regardless of how liberal and otherwise cool they are, when I know they vote against my rights as a human being...

Well...for one thing...alot of those Republicans vote Democrat...often....

It wasn't too long ago that voting Democrat also meant voting against our rights. Personally I am too far left to be a Democrat so I am an Independent. I would vote Democratic Socialist if I thought it would make a difference and I wouldn't be throwing my vote to the opposition.

[eastofeden]

California republicans? Those guys are declining in influence big time... they lost all sorts of districts in the last election (Mary Bono Mack for one). The republican party in California is almost in the dustbin (and party affiliation wise they are down below 30% of the population). They are such a non-factor it's kinda funny. They can't even do anything in our State Assembly. They just sit there. They can't even filibuster. The democrats rule this state. Sorry for that off topic bit...

Edit: And looking it up California is almost 65-35% Democrat. Those "fiscal conservatives" are almost long gone in this state. And they can take their anti-tax attitudes elsewhere. Can't wait to see that loser Kevin James get wiped out in the Mayor's Race here in LA.

Money problems are often cited as the #1 reason for a marriage to fail. I can easily respect someone who has a differing opinion on how we spend money even if I disagree with them across the board...agreeing to disagree is healthy.

[GiancarloC]

Money problems are often cited as the #1 reason for a marriage to fail. I can easily respect someone who has a differing opinion on how we spend money even if I disagree with them across the board...agreeing to disagree is healthy.

I really can't... at least not in this state. Fiscal conservatism is one of the reasons why this state suffered financially... many anti-tax laws/propositions passed in the past caused much of our mess. We're getting our financial situation in order through the Jerry Brown method as I call it. And it's one republicans here hate.

[chance1]

Remind anyone of the barroom scene from Star Wars.

stolen from Steve Schmidt

[rareboy]

Remind anyone of the barroom scene from Star Wars.

omg.

You have to be shitting me.

This is the best that they can do?

I think that it is pretty clear that CPAC has no more wind left in its sails.

[chrisrobin]

This is the best that they can do?

No. They forgot Michelle Bachmann, Piyush Jindal and Marco Rubio.

I think that it is pretty clear that CPAC has no more wind left in its sails.

Plenty of wind: no sails.

[chance1]

It's like an alcoholic hitting rock bottom

It has to happen for change to take place

Perhaps this is their moment of clarity

[Apollo]

Who? Meg Whitman for example isn't an prominent republican leader. She's operating a company right now on the brink of bankruptcy (what a surprise). Yeah, I do think they are incapable of reading the writing on the wall and they'll stick to their egos rather than admitting they are wrong. I'd rather see them go down to a third rate political party.

Ebay is turning around actually. Not under Meg's lead of course, but yeah. Ebay is doing just fine. http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/28/bu...anted=all&_r=0

Also, the republicans are reading the writing on the wall. They held a closed door session a few months ago discussing the problem, but I think their problem is, they don't know how to change. They fucked themselves into a corner when they redid some of the congressional district maps. Now they must pander to ultraconservative people or risk loosing their seat to truely ultra-conservative rivals. Another big problem with that scenario is the fact that they might be able to win congressional seats with ultraconservative view points, but they will never will the Presidency like that.

[GiancarloC]

Meg wrecked ebay while she was in charge. And I wasn't talking about ebay. I was talking about the company she is in charge of now.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2...nings/1936817/

Their profits fell 16%... less than expected lol. I guess that's "progress". That company is so screwed... and their laptops have fallen badly in quality. I used to swear by HP... not anymore.

Sure they don't know how to change... and that's a problem. Many of their biggest fundraisers are socially conservative, and that's also another problem.

Edit: Btw, after reading that article Ebay is far from fine. Amazon is still eating away at their profits, and they still are terrible for people selling anything. I gave up using them after they took increasingly large portions of what I sold.

[JockBoy87]

^^^ I dunno, I had a Compaq from 2005 that lasted for five years of continuous abuse

Love me my new Toshiba though

[GiancarloC]

I did like my last HP, but their newer ones don't look like quality to me.

I have a Lenovo now and won't look back. Lenovo has seriously beaten HP... and just surpassed them in market share (well as of Nov 2012... I'm sure the margin is even greater now):

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-1...t-packard.html

[Apollo]

Meg wrecked ebay while she was in charge. And I wasn't talking about ebay. I was talking about the company she is in charge of now.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2...nings/1936817/

Their profits fell 16%... less than expected lol. I guess that's "progress". That company is so screwed... and their laptops have fallen badly in quality. I used to swear by HP... not anymore.

Sure they don't know how to change... and that's a problem. Many of their biggest fundraisers are socially conservative, and that's also another problem.

Edit: Btw, after reading that article Ebay is far from fine. Amazon is still eating away at their profits, and they still are terrible for people selling anything. I gave up using them after they took increasingly large portions of what I sold.

In all truth, HP was going downhill long before she took the helm. I still remember the Touchpad, but I got in on that fire sale the moment I heard about it. WebOS is an absolutely amazing mobile OS to this day. At least the company that owns the software now is gonna use it.

Amazon and Ebay aren't really the same company to be honest though. But Amazon has always been very successful. Jeff Bezos is like a less stylish Steve Jobs, and absolute genius when it comes to business. It's really craigslist and bookoo that are fucking up Ebay.

Regardless though, this isn't the thread for such conversations. Really it isn't about Meg Whitman either. She is just one of the people on that list. Not only that, unless you read tech blogs, you won't know her name. A bigger name on there is the highly successful Clint Eastwood. If there is any republican that will rally young republicans into accepting homosexuals and their causes, it's him.

[Apollo]

^^^ I dunno, I had a Compaq from 2005 that lasted for five years of continuous abuse

Love me my new Toshiba though

All about Asus for me. I have never though HP was an appealing brand. They always made ugly computers with the worst crapware of all of them.

[Just_Believe18]

GoProud..wtf is with the name if they do everything they can to sweep under the rug their gay identity and STILL can't get the cnservative base to accept and welcome them? If you're gonna get fucked, be a power bottom...not subservient one only taking it to fulfill your duties. There's nothing "proud" about them.

Haha! Oh snap!

[GiancarloC]

In all truth, HP was going downhill long before she took the helm. I still remember the Touchpad, but I got in on that fire sale the moment I heard about it. WebOS is an absolutely amazing mobile OS to this day. At least the company that owns the software now is gonna use it.

She didn't inspire any confidence and she's a horrible CEO. Lets not beat around the bush.

Amazon and Ebay aren't really the same company to be honest though. But Amazon has always been very successful. Jeff Bezos is like a less stylish Steve Jobs, and absolute genius when it comes to business. It's really craigslist and bookoo that are fucking up Ebay.

Amazon has the option for people to sell their stuff... ebay has auction format, but it seems like the "buy it now" format is more popular than auctions right now. Ebay is still screwed up... and Paypal is even more fucked up. Craigslist and Bookoo aren't the ones... most people are switching over to Amazon to sell their stuff because there are less listing fees.

Regardless though, this isn't the thread for such conversations. Really it isn't about Meg Whitman either. She is just one of the people on that list. Not only that, unless you read tech blogs, you won't know her name. A bigger name on there is the highly successful Clint Eastwood. If there is any republican that will rally young republicans into accepting homosexuals and their causes, it's him.

I can assure many people here in California still remember her name. And Clint Eastwood... empty chair... he's lost his marbles a while ago. He's not the one to help the GOP. He's stuck in a different era.

I'm not an apologist.

[Apollo]

She didn't inspire any confidence and she's a horrible CEO. Lets not beat around the bush.

Ummm what bush?

Amazon has the option for people to sell their stuff... ebay has auction format, but it seems like the "buy it now" format is more popular than auctions right now. Ebay is still screwed up... and Paypal is even more fucked up. Craigslist and Bookoo aren't the ones... most people are switching over to Amazon to sell their stuff because there are less listing fees.

As someone who is a tech geek, I can tell you Amazon is not about auctions at all. Amazon has always been about selling things through their service from other companies. Usually if Amazon doesn't personally sell something they will list 3rd party sellers. But you will really not see the 3rd party sellers if Amazon can sell it first.

Craigslist has no listing price and it promotes easier reach to local buyers. Same with bookoo. Well bookoo is made for that. Only recently does Bookoo charge to post pictures...which is probably still cheaper than listing on Amazon. Ebay has recently been trying to encrouch on Amazon's turf and Amazon is bitch slapping them. But really, all Ebay wants to do is get a foothold in Amazons market to make a good profit.

Buuuuut, you are you, and I could post Amazon's official business model and you still wouldn't believe me. So I stop it here.

I can assure many people here in California still remember her name. And Clint Eastwood... empty chair... he's lost his marbles a while ago. He's not the one to help the GOP. He's stuck in a different era.

I'm not an apologist.

Yeeeeah, Clint Eastwood keeps putting out Oscar nominated and winning movies and producing even more high quality movies. Meg Whitman...well California knows who she is apparently (a blue state). IMO, Clint Eastwood will and has gotten the bigger focus as the signer on the petition. Celebrity trumps shitty CEO anyday.

[GiancarloC]

Ummm what bush?

It's saying. Whitman is still a shitty CEO.

As someone who is a tech geek, I can tell you Amazon is not about auctions at all. Amazon has always been about selling things through their service from other companies. Usually if Amazon doesn't personally sell something they will list 3rd party sellers. But you will really not see the 3rd party sellers if Amazon can sell it first.

Uh what? I never claimed Amazon was about auctions, but if people want to sell Amazon is better. I have a sellers account on there and have sold a variety of things. I have sold things faster on Amazon too.

Craigslist has no listing price and it promotes easier reach to local buyers. Same with bookoo. Well bookoo is made for that. Only recently does Bookoo charge to post pictures...which is probably still cheaper than listing on Amazon. Ebay has recently been trying to encrouch on Amazon's turf and Amazon is bitch slapping them. But really, all Ebay wants to do is get a foothold in Amazons market to make a good profit.

Don't really care. I was talking about Amazon and Ebay. Ebay fails miserably and so does its Paypal which is even a bigger disaster. And FYI, I am also a tech geek.

Buuuuut, you are you, and I could post Amazon's official business model and you still wouldn't believe me. So I stop it here.

What does that mean? I know what Amazon's business model is, and I know what Ebays is too.

Yeeeeah, Clint Eastwood keeps putting out Oscar nominated and winning movies and producing even more high quality movies. Meg Whitman...well California knows who she is apparently (a blue state). IMO, Clint Eastwood will and has gotten the bigger focus as the signer on the petition. Celebrity trumps shitty CEO anyday.

So what? The Oscars isn't the end all to all great movies. I don't really care for it anymore. And his last movie was not high quality. And what about knowing Whitman? She's not popular here. Eastwood lost a step or two. He's not a great actor/director anymore.

Is there a response here to what I said? I'm still waiting. My point was about Whitman. Not about the terribly out of touch Eastwood.

[Apollo]

It's saying. Whitman is still a shitty CEO.



Uh what? I never claimed Amazon was about auctions, but if people want to sell Amazon is better. I have a sellers account on there and have sold a variety of things. I have sold things faster on Amazon too.



Don't really care. I was talking about Amazon and Ebay. Ebay fails miserably and so does its Paypal which is even a bigger disaster. And FYI, I am also a tech geek.



What does that mean? I know what Amazon's business model is, and I know what Ebays is too.



So what? The Oscars isn't the end all to all great movies. I don't really care for it anymore. And his last movie was not high quality. And what about knowing Whitman? She's not popular here. Eastwood lost a step or two. He's not a great actor/director anymore.

Is there a response here to what I said? I'm still waiting. My point was about Whitman. Not about the terribly out of touch Eastwood.

Well obviously Meg is shitty at her job. HP is still trying to recover and well we saw how she left Ebay.

I guess I did misinterpret your post, but I still wouldn't say Amazon is the one destroying Ebay. Amazon has always done Amazon and Ebay has always done Ebay and they lived in harmony for all these years. Problem is, when Ebay attempted to branch out into "Buy it Now" more and acting like they were Amazon, they started loosing their auction customer base. But Ebay never collapsed or failed, and they are coming back strongly too.

Sorry, but when people hear Clint Eastwood's name. They know who he is, they know his movies. The older folks know his earlier work. Whether he has skipped a step or two is honestly irrelevant. No one really knows that, if it is true at all. And most people will be surprised (kinda) he signed this brief. It will hopefully cause some young and old alike republicans to think their positions.

Especially with a lot of younger men seeing Gran Tarino and most likely thinking how much of a complete badass he was in the movie.

[GiancarloC]

I guess I did misinterpret your post, but I still wouldn't say Amazon is the one destroying Ebay. Amazon has always done Amazon and Ebay has always done Ebay and they lived in harmony for all these years. Problem is, when Ebay attempted to branch out into "Buy it Now" more and acting like they were Amazon, they started loosing their auction customer base. But Ebay never collapsed or failed, and they are coming back strongly too.

Ebay did it to themselves and Paypal is one of the WORST I have ever dealt with. I'm still looking for a viable alternative to Paypal, but what sucks is there aren't widely used alternatives. And by the way, there are big sellers on Ebay that get way more attention than others. And I don't think their "comeback" is that strong. It's sorta like Myspace's "comeback"... it's a bit weak.

Sorry, but when people hear Clint Eastwood's name. They know who he is, they know his movies. The older folks know his earlier work. Whether he has skipped a step or two is honestly irrelevant. No one really knows that, if it is true at all. And most people will be surprised (kinda) he signed this brief. It will hopefully cause some young and old alike republicans to think their positions.

And? I know who he is too. Does that make me sympathetic to him? No. He completely blew his credibility in that idiotic swipe on Obama. As far as republicans changing... I don't see it happening, regardless if he signed it or not.

[Apollo]

Ebay did it to themselves and Paypal is one of the WORST I have ever dealt with. I'm still looking for a viable alternative to Paypal, but what sucks is there aren't widely used alternatives. And by the way, there are big sellers on Ebay that get way more attention than others. And I don't think their "comeback" is that strong. It's sorta like Myspace's "comeback"... it's a bit weak.



And? I know who he is too. Does that make me sympathetic to him? No. He completely blew his credibility in that idiotic swipe on Obama. As far as republicans changing... I don't see it happening, regardless if he signed it or not.

I doubt it. Most people arent as vehemently supportive of Obama as you are. Not to mention, this isnt about democrats and Obama supporters, this is about him rallying a republican, conservative base to accept homosexuality and homosexual causes. Most likely, the people we want supporting us also supported his swipe at Obama.

I know for a lot of people, someone who supports republicans and conservative viewpoints can't possibly also support gay issues and rights. But, speaking from experience, it is incredibly easy for them to do so. And the more conservatives Clint can bring to the support table. The happier I am.

As for comparing Ebay to Myspace. That is so off. Myspace DIED. DIED DIED DIED. Ebay lost a few sales and some customers. Myspace needs to rebrand ENTIRELY and change their focus. Ebay is still doing fine in the auction space and starting to come back into it.

[GiancarloC]

I doubt it. Most people arent as vehemently supportive of Obama as you are. Not to mention, this isnt about democrats and Obama supporters, this is about him rallying a republican, conservative base to accept homosexuality and homosexual causes. Most likely, the people we want supporting us also supported his swipe at Obama.

Oh puh-leaze. I am not "vehemently supportive of Obama". I am one who can make up my own mind and I don't need anyone else defining the way I think and believe. I don't care for republicans, certainly not ones here in California who are declining in number. I don't care for the conservative or republican base either. I don't care if they support the gay community... much of what republicans support is repugnant and destructive to this country.

BTW, I always gave Obama a B-/C+ rating. He's done decently, but hasn't taken the bull by its horns... I wish for stronger initiative on his part. Certainly better than the F- rating I give the republicans in the Congress.

I know for a lot of people, someone who supports republicans and conservative viewpoints can't possibly also support gay issues and rights. But, speaking from experience, it is incredibly easy for them to do so. And the more conservatives Clint can bring to the support table. The happier I am.

And that's true. Anyone who supports the republican party in its present state can't support gay issues. They need to shift their entire views politically. I'm indifferent if a few support equal rights... there are so many other issues I have with their viewpoints.

As for comparing Ebay to Myspace. That is so off. Myspace DIED. DIED DIED DIED. Ebay lost a few sales and some customers. Myspace needs to rebrand ENTIRELY and change their focus. Ebay is still doing fine in the auction space and starting to come back into it.

http://www.imediaconnection.com/content/32367.asp

Myspace had a bit of a mini-comeback. Ebay and Myspace are far from fine. Ebay still isn't doing that great.

[Apollo]

Oh puh-leaze. I am not "vehemently supportive of Obama". I am one who can make up my own mind and I don't need anyone else defining the way I think and believe. I don't care for republicans, certainly not ones here in California who are declining in number. I don't care for the conservative or republican base either. I don't care if they support the gay community... much of what republicans support is repugnant and destructive to this country.

BTW, I always gave Obama a B-/C+ rating. He's done decently, but hasn't taken the bull by its horns... I wish for stronger initiative on his part. Certainly better than the F- rating I give the republicans in the Congress.



And that's true. Anyone who supports the republican party in its present state can't support gay issues. They need to shift their entire views politically. I'm indifferent if a few support equal rights... there are so many other issues I have with their viewpoints.



http://www.imediaconnection.com/content/32367.asp

Myspace had a bit of a mini-comeback. Ebay and Myspace are far from fine. Ebay still isn't doing that great.

I believe your hatred of the republican party is well documented on this forum. You as bad as the republicans on this board. You will never admit when they have a good point of plan or have done something decent like 100 prominent or retired republicans signing this brief and submitting it to the Supreme Court.

It is because of your hatred of repubicans and conservatives that you believe they could never support gay issues. That is a complete and utter lie on your part. Nothing is black and white. There are plenty of liberals who are strictly agaisnt gay rights and gays as are there republicans who would quickly go to a gay pride parade in support of homosexuality. I say this because I know a few of them.

Conservatives will always exist. That is just the truth of the matter. You will always have conservatives vs liberal thinking and they will spawn parties arguing these view points. It's just human nature. Everything has a opposite, an opposing force to keep the other in check.

[Sausy]

I believe your hatred of the republican party is well documented on this forum. You as bad as the republicans on this board. You will never admit when they have a good point of plan or have done something decent like 100 prominent or retired republicans signing this brief and submitting it to the Supreme Court.

It is because of your hatred of repubicans and conservatives that you believe they could never support gay issues. That is a complete and utter lie on your part. Nothing is black and white. There are plenty of liberals who are strictly agaisnt gay rights and gays as are there republicans who would quickly go to a gay pride parade in support of homosexuality. I say this because I know a few of them.

Conservatives will always exist. That is just the truth of the matter. You will always have conservatives vs liberal thinking and they will spawn parties arguing these view points. It's just human nature. Everything has a opposite, an opposing force to keep the other in check.

You're sounding like Spock here

[GiancarloC]

I believe your hatred of the republican party is well documented on this forum. You as bad as the republicans on this board. You will never admit when they have a good point of plan or have done something decent like 100 prominent or retired republicans signing this brief and submitting it to the Supreme Court.

I'm not alone in my hatred of the republican party... there are many on here who share the same feelings. I have no sympathies for a party of obstructionist fools. And no I'm not as bad as them. Get a grip. And what good points or plans do they have? The republican party doesn't have any good plans. What is coming out of the House of Representatives in the Committee on the Budget headed by Paul Ryan? Absolutely fucking nothing.

I'm not going to sugarcoat the party to try to make them look better. They make themselves look bad, hence why they got whipped on election day.

It is because of your hatred of repubicans and conservatives that you believe they could never support gay issues. That is a complete and utter lie on your part. Nothing is black and white. There are plenty of liberals who are strictly agaisnt gay rights and gays as are there republicans who would quickly go to a gay pride parade in support of homosexuality. I say this because I know a few of them.

What is a complete and utter lie? The fact that republicans are mostly social conservatives? This is reality. I am not talking about exceptions, but looking at the BIGGER PICTURE. And I still LOOK AT THE BIGGER PICTURE and KNOW liberals and those on the left are FAR MORE SUPPORTIVE of equal rights than those int he republican party by many times. I don't care about a few of them. I care about the BIGGER PICTURE.

Conservatives will always exist. That is just the truth of the matter. You will always have conservatives vs liberal thinking and they will spawn parties arguing these view points. It's just human nature. Everything has a opposite, an opposing force to keep the other in check.

What is this conservative vs liberal thing? The world doesn't work that way. At least countries outside of America. Politicalcompass.org does a decent job defining political spectrum but even that is not perfect. The world isn't black and white as said... it's far more complex. I am not a "liberal". I am a social democrat and a green. I view the democratic party here in America as still too much in the pockets of corporations. Republicans are even deeper in it.

I'm not one who is going to sugarcoat what the republican party really stands for because of some hatred for those on the left. My point has been made.