Why are republicans supporting gay marriage now?

[animalius]

Just a few months ago, the republican party almost bled to death opposing gay marriage. Now, a large number of top republican leaders including Clint Eastwood are openly supporting removing the bans on gay marriage. I'm scared. What are they planning to do?

[xbuzzerx]

This doesn't disturb me half as much as how many nominally "Democratic/liberal" gay people who are such because of gay issues may happily hop ship if the GOP removes its whole antigay platform. See yuh women, other minorities and middle class people!

[ravenstar]

Because the President supported it, they thought it would cost him the election and turned it out brought the gay vote behind Obama.

Conservatives the world over are all the same. They'll say what they need to say to try to win the next election, then do whatever the hell they please.

[Rolyo85]

This doesn't disturb me half as much as how many nominally "Democratic/liberal" gay people who are such because of gay issues may happily hop ship if the GOP removes its whole antigay platform. See yuh women, other minorities and middle class people!

That's a legitimate fear. Already many in the gay community are going to the libertarians...

But what can you expect? Gays, unlike any other minority, come from every part of society, every nation, every race... Can't expect them all to stay within one party. It's an artificially forced thing, and it shouldn't really happen like that. But I think it will be years before Republicans truly embrace gay rights.

[G-Lexington]

They wised up and realized that the support they were getting for opposing it was now less than the support they would get for supporting it. And yeah, I think we'll see some gays (and gay-friendlies) shifting over to the Republican party. And why shouldn't they?

Lex

[maxpowr9]

That's a legitimate fear. Already many in the gay community are going to the libertarians...

But what can you expect? Gays, unlike any other minority, come from every part of society, every nation, every race... Can't expect them all to stay within one party. It's an artificially forced thing, and it shouldn't really happen like that. But I think it will be years before Republicans truly embrace gay rights.

If the libertarian party had any clout in the country, they would be the moderate third party that this country desperately needs. I would go on the record and say that many LGT people are closeted libertarians because of the espoused characteristic of self-reliance [something the GOP has sadly forgotten about]. How many guys on here were somewhat [or fully] dejected by their own family and had to carve their own pathway into the future? I think you will see the platitudes change when gay marriage is legal throughout the US.

[eastofeden]

I am suspicious of the GOP and it's motives so I immediately thought they were doing damage control in case the Supreme Court ruled against us.

[eastofeden]

This doesn't disturb me half as much as how many nominally "Democratic/liberal" gay people who are such because of gay issues may happily hop ship if the GOP removes its whole antigay platform. See yuh women, other minorities and middle class people!

I have had that concern all along. I dread the day they embrace us because approval and acceptance will be a powerful aphrodisiac from the people who oppress us for alot of people. I have been saying this since I was 21...fuck approval and acceptance...give me equality under the law.

[RazorzEdge88]

If the libertarian party had any clout in the country, they would be the moderate third party that this country desperately needs.

"Moderate"? There's nothing "moderate" about wanting to take an ax to the minimal social safety net (in comparison with the rest of the industrialized world) this country has.

The Randian nonsense peddled by you and your ilk is radical nonsense meant to give even more power to big business.

[kayman23]

This doesn't disturb me half as much as how many nominally "Democratic/liberal" gay people who are such because of gay issues may happily hop ship if the GOP removes its whole antigay platform. See yuh women, other minorities and middle class people!

I have had that concern all along. I dread the day they embrace us because approval and acceptance will be a powerful aphrodisiac from the people who oppress us for alot of people. I have been saying this since I was 21...fuck approval and acceptance...give me equality under the law.

Fair weather political friends and not true allies to social equity. There are plenty of them in the LGBT fold and some of them are even on this board notice how they show ambivalence towards other topics of social inequities...

[maxpowr9]

Fair weather political friends and not true allies to social equity. There are plenty of them in the LGBT fold and some of them are even on this board notice how they show ambivalence towards other topics of social inequities...

Any free-thinking person would realize that both political parties in the US are garbage but the Democrats are the lesser of two evils atm.

Again, you are welcome to enter the delusion of either main party but this country has always been socially liberal but fiscally conservative [the latter could be substituted for self-reliant]. You are open to debate that but would be hard-pressed to undermine the validity of it.

[loveguys72]

Perhaps those who signed the amicus brief before the SC finally realized the desperate rear-guard action the GOP has been fighting against equality before the law is no longer a politically tenable position if they wish to remain a national, rather than a regional, party.

In any case, in politics, you take your support where you can find it. If these people want to (finally) be on the right side of history, whatever their motive, good on them.

[kevin23]

Tsk, tsk boys. Politicians are politicians no matter the Party. They build their base with certain groups and then cater to them. When that base starts to erode they look for other groups they can recruit. The Dems lost presidential races for years for being anti gun. This issue wasn't mentioned when Obama ran and he won handily. Only since the tragadies of the school shootings by mentally ill people has guns become an issue. And in the mid-term elections the Dems will likely pay heavily for this.
Americans love their guns, even the least educated in our society know they have a right to their guns guaranteed by the Second Amendment. They may not know which amendment it is but they know it is a right and will never give it up. Responsible gun ownership needs to be taugh and taugh and taught as well as how to solve disagreements in a civil manner to help reduce gun violence and violence in general. I think the black, white and latino leadership needs to address this with the same fevor as the Voting Rights way back in the 50's- 60's. Such as Bill Cosby has been preaching for years.

I too wish the Liberterian party were stronger and produced viabable canidates to compete with our two party system.

[tigerfan482]

They are all politicians. They support whatever the current political climate says they should support. Republicans are just slower on the uptake when it involves anything non-discriminatory.

[GiancarloC]

If the libertarian party had any clout in the country, they would be the moderate third party that this country desperately needs. I would go on the record and say that many LGT people are closeted libertarians because of the espoused characteristic of self-reliance [something the GOP has sadly forgotten about]. How many guys on here were somewhat [or fully] dejected by their own family and had to carve their own pathway into the future? I think you will see the platitudes change when gay marriage is legal throughout the US.

The Libertarian party is anything but moderate. The reality is the Green Party is the one that should have more clout. We need more regulations, not less. Many LGBT people are closet libertarians? That's a first. I think most are actually more identifying with greens, and not libertarians.

Libertarian thought is a major threat to this country and would destroy whatever social safety net exists, as previously mentioned. This is not a moderate philosophy. Green philosophy is more for a mixed system. If one were to take a look at Germany, the Green Party has always had significant power and Germany is better off because of it.

Oh and the libertarians are peddling even bigger garbage than either the democrats or republicans right now... and it's not the kind of crap we need. Austerity is not the answer. Brazil and Ecuador are two examples where mixed economics has worked... government spending on health care and education, coupled with pragmatic policy.

The so called "freedom" libertarians yap on about regarding "economics" is NOT freedom. It's just "freedom" for big businesses to fuck over the average person more. We can't have "economic freedom" and "social freedom" in the same sentence. One isn't freedom at all. There has to be regulation and strong government intervention in the economy. It's the only way. Every country that has engaged in austerity has screwed themselves... my country in Spain got taken over by these extremist libertarians who reduced the economy to rubble so they can save a few bucks.

This is more a CE&P topic if anything.

[pat grimshaw]

…We need more regulations, not less…

Giancarlo. I hope you don't mind If I quote this maxim of yours here.

(I reckon it might be used against you later in your career.

[GiancarloC]

The Dems lost presidential races for years for being anti gun.

So... Clinton lost election and re-election?

This issue wasn't mentioned when Obama ran and he won handily. Only since the tragadies of the school shootings by mentally ill people has guns become an issue. And in the mid-term elections the Dems will likely pay heavily for this.

Absolute BS. If we were to look at the polls a majority of Americans support more regulation not less when it comes to guns. Thanks for the total falsehoods. And the dems won't pay heavily for it. The GOP will get whipped in 2014 because they have fucked up on the economic front and continued to stall the Obama administration.

Americans love their guns, even the least educated in our society know they have a right to their guns guaranteed by the Second Amendment. They may not know which amendment it is but they know it is a right and will never give it up. Responsible gun ownership needs to be taugh and taugh and taught as well as how to solve disagreements in a civil manner to help reduce gun violence and violence in general. I think the black, white and latino leadership needs to address this with the same fevor as the Voting Rights way back in the 50's- 60's. Such as Bill Cosby has been preaching for years.

More nonsense. If Americans love their guns, why have support for gun control increased to all time highs not seen since the 1990s? And as far as Latinos, 4 million more of us voted in the 2012 election as compared to the 2008 election so that's already being addressed.

- - - Updated - - -

Giancarlo. I hope you don't mind If I quote this maxim of yours here.

(I reckon it might be used against you later in your career.

Oh what horseshit. At least READ my post, rather than picking and choosing.

Used against me? How so? I don't take kindly to threats especially from crypto-fascists.

[Vitamin]

Before you get to excited know that the politicians on that brief going around are all former Republican somebodys. Former Governors, Secretaries, Congressmen. It's progress, that could lead to real change, but its only a very small step.

Still, change in the American political process happens very quickly, and there's still 2-4 years before it really starts mattering. Who knows, maybe by 2016 the GOP Presidential Candidate will be a pro-gay marriage Chris Christie. Or they could continue the same old backtracking they've been doing since post-Bush. We have no idea.

[GiancarloC]

It's such an insignificant brief it doesn't really detract from the bigger picture. The republicans will continue to drag their feet on this and as far as Chris Christie... I don't think he's pro-gay marriage.

[maxpowr9]

Before you get to excited know that the politicians on that brief going around are all former Republican somebodys. Former Governors, Secretaries, Congressmen. It's progress, that could lead to real change, but its only a very small step.

Still, change in the American political process happens very quickly, and there's still 2-4 years before it really starts mattering. Who knows, maybe by 2016 the GOP Presidential Candidate will be a pro-gay marriage Chris Christie. Or they could continue the same old backtracking they've been doing since post-Bush. We have no idea.

Ironic you mention history when Christie vetoed a gay marriage bill in NJ after it passed both the state house and senate. That is basically an "accidental overdose" at this point of said bitter pill to swallow. If he had actually passed said legislation, he would have much more respect for being bipartisan.

[T-Rexx]

Before you get to excited know that the politicians on that brief going around are all former Republican somebodys nobodies. Former Governors, Secretaries, Congressmen.

I fixed it for you.

These people are not very prominent, and, with rare exception, not currently in positions of power. They have no office, no legislative authority, no ability to vote on anything.

Former "top advisers" to former president GWB.

Four former governors.

A woman who ran for governor of California, and lost.

Two (count 'em - two) congressmen.

It's progress, that could lead to real change, but its only a very small step.

Agreed. It's progress, but not much.

I have no doubt that the day will come when the GOP claims to support gay marriage, just as they claim now to support civil rights (which they also once opposed). But, when that day comes, I expect the GOP will be just as enthusiastic in its support of gay marriage as it is today in its support of civil rights - which is to say, not very much.

[Vitamin]

Ironic you mention history when Christie vetoed a gay marriage bill in NJ after it passed both the state house and senate. That is basically an "accidental overdose" at this point of said bitter pill to swallow. If he had actually passed said legislation, he would have much more respect for being bipartisan.

Christie has gone on record saying he supports civil unions. It's definitely not ideal, but he could evolve on the issue like Obama.

And as Joe Scarborough likes to keep pointing out, Christie has a 74% approval rating, and is plus 20 with women voters. If the Republicans would get their heads out of their asses and actually take him he probably could win big in 2016.

[HunterM]

It's about time they come around. I welcome any and everyone who supports gay marriage.

[Rolyo85]

Fair weather political friends and not true allies to social equity. There are plenty of them in the LGBT fold and some of them are even on this board notice how they show ambivalence towards other topics of social inequities...

Dude, I REALLY don't like this guilt-tripping. Everybody has their own problems. Being sympathetic to other groups' woes doesn't mean we have an obligation to address all of them with the same frequency as gay issues.

[DigitalFudge]

I'm excited, I can be a republican now.



Done with these poor, immigrant, whores. The shit I have put up with to support da gheighs.

[csb999]

Barry Goldwater . What if the Republicans started acting like Republicans like Goldwater and Eisenhower instead of borderline looney Christianoids ?

[rareboy]

Just a few months ago, the republican party almost bled to death opposing gay marriage. Now, a large number of top republican leaders including Clint Eastwood are openly supporting removing the bans on gay marriage. I'm scared. What are they planning to do?

You answered your own question.

The GOp is trying to put a pink bandaid on their self-inflicted wound.

[Sausy]

The worst thing is the GOP has been pulled too far to the right...some conservatives and remaining moderates understand that responsible governing cannot be held hostage to ideological purity but the rank and file activists are very definitively activist movement conservatives with a far right bend tinged by religious orthodoxy or populism. These signers have the winning argument even if there is so much dissension from the activist base of the party that pushes so many hard liners with tone deaf, inflexible political incompetence. Inclusion is the way to go, basic human rights and dignity that complements a more conservative vision of how we should work as a country would make for a GOP that can sustain a broad national appeal. A positive, nclusive, pro-growth conservatism that respects individual liberties and isn't tied to a harshly corporatist approach would definitely find a lot of support among the neglected middle in this country but appears a pipe dream as the tentacles of movement conservatism seem too firmly entrenched to lose much ground in the short run at least.

[TheSpectatingLoner]

They realize that they have to bend on social issues to stay relevant.

[chrisrobin]

.
Votes - It's already 2014. A Republicon would fuck a snake to get votes.

[kayman23]

Any free-thinking person would realize that both political parties in the US are garbage but the Democrats are the lesser of two evils atm.

Again, you are welcome to enter the delusion of either main party but this country has always been socially liberal but fiscally conservative [the latter could be substituted for self-reliant]. You are open to debate that but would be hard-pressed to undermine the validity of it.

Uh, whom said I am a fan of either party?

I don't like any of the so-called relevant parties as a whole including your libertarian party either. They are all asshats that thinks about the bottom line and how much clout they can win out in the end.

FYI, the libertarian party has basically became the hiding ground for anarchists and the privileged types that want to basically do what the SCOTUS is trying to do to Section 5 of the Voters' Rights Act (VRA). That's right get rid of all social equity protections for vulnerable groups in this nation, thus allowing the '(white male) establishment' to run-a-mok on them again. See Rand Paul and Ron Paul as examples...

[kayman23]

Dude, I REALLY don't like this guilt-tripping. Everybody has their own problems. Being sympathetic to other groups' woes doesn't mean we have an obligation to address all of them with the same frequency as gay issues.

I'm sorry, but you are going to have get over it and



I'm here for the social minorities not just some minorities. Especially, the LGBTs of colors that always seemingly gets overlooked...

[Rolyo85]

Your gifs went under my head, sorry.

And whatever heroic crusader of justice you see yourself as, what your posts come across, is annoying guilt-tripping, like people here have somehow failed in some sort of duty.

Sorry, but if this forum is not minority-conscious enough for your high horse standards...

[Rolyo85]

FYI, the libertarian party has basically became the hiding ground for anarchists and the privileged types that want to basically do what the SCOTUS is trying to do to Section 5 of the Voters' Rights Act (VRA). That's right get rid of all social equity protections for vulnerable groups in this nation, thus allowing the '(white male) establishment' to run-a-mok on them again. See Rand Paul and Ron Paul as examples...

This, though, I wholeheartedly agree with.

[BustinJeiber]

Nothing the GOP does is ever for the good of the general public. Remember that whenever you are led to believe otherwise by anything "progressive" you see from the republican party. They are the literal wolf in sheeps clothing.

[Saybrooke]

I think they're realizing they're on the losing side of history!

[alphacock]

lol maybe they need to realize it would make a better economy!

[xbuzzerx]

FYI, the libertarian party has basically became the hiding ground for anarchists and the privileged types

You'll always find a handful of "true believers" who seem to regard Ayn Rand as political Mohammad, but yeah, what you just said encompasses 90+% of all libertarianism I've seen. That plus I never seem to get a consistent answer even out of the smaller number of true believers as to what Libertarianism as a political platform is or should be... it always sounds like Baskin Robbins 31 flavors of ideas with most libertarians disavowing what other libertarians have said and saying the person who said it must have been an idiot who didn't understand libertarianism. You hear from one that basic public services like even police and fire shouldn't exist and you'll hear from another that that's ridiculous and libertarianism is just about some pure form of respect for individual rights. I couldn't explain to anyone what libertarianism politically is because I've never heard a coherent view from any of its advocates.

In general though I would say that what I've seen has most closely matched Bill Maher's tongue in cheek description of them as "Republicans who have sex and smoke pot." It generally seems to be privileged upper middle class+ white people who don't really care that much about the social safety net because they don't rely on any part of it and virtually never have, lived in nice neighborhoods and had nice private health insurance and went to private schools.

[aussieboy901]

As David Cameron said, "I don't support gay marriage in spite of being a conservative, I support gay marriage because I am a conservative"

[moniker]

I'll let you in on a little secret: this issue drives professional politicians crazy - they think "a 16 trillion dollar debt and people worry about this shit...?"

[pat grimshaw]

I'll let you in on a little secret: this issue drives professional politicians crazy - they think "a 16 trillion dollar debt and people worry about this shit...?"

i want and I want it now!

[xbuzzerx]

i want and I want it now!

Implying the overall effort for gay rights is a sudden, abrupt fad and doesn't go back half a century.

[pat grimshaw]

^ Did you see that sensible HuffPost article yesterday?

[Rolyo85]

The thing with the "trillion dollar deficit" bullshit is that just like starving children in Africa, it has NOTHING to do with marriage equality, anti-discrimination protections etc. Those don't require money. In fact, marriage equality has been proven to BRING money to states that perform same-sex marriages. If it's such a non-issue and there are more important things, just grant it to people so that we can move on to serious problems, eh?

[RazorzEdge88]

Well guys, that settles it. We can't possibly tackle more than one political issue at a time.

[pat grimshaw]

Veruca Salt wants it NOW!

[T-Rexx]

As David Cameron said, "I don't support gay marriage in spite of being a conservative, I support gay marriage because I am a conservative"

The Republican Party in America is most definitely NOT a conservative party. They are a religious party that believes in massive budget deficits, government support for the wealthy, and the imposition of Christian fundamentalist values (=Sharia Law, ironically) on American society.

[Adrock-JD]

They've discovered that a dick in your ass isn't as bad as it sounds?

[jshine868]

Cause they need our votes.

[Rolyo85]

Cause they need our votes.

Imagine how desperate they must be, if they're down to SODOMITE votes...