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  1. #1

    How does being gay affect getting employed?

    So, I think I want to be a doctor of some sort someday, but I'm still in school. I'm wondering: Do people have a lot of experiences with discrimination in employment? Or particularly positive experiences? It could be in medicine or in general.

    I would also imagine it's location-specific, so maybe indicate where whatever you're talking about happened.

    Thanks

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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Employers are looking for ability to do the job and being professional too. You ought to conduct your private life in your private time. Most big employers ought to have policies which are anti-discriminatory. Harassment at work for you sexuality should have no a zero tolerance level. If you're going into medicine, its likely that your sexuality wouldn't be an issue, so long as it doesn't intrude into or affect your work ethic. That is, you're going into urology just to feel up guys with urino-genital problems etc....


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    JUB Addict T-Rexx's Avatar
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    It depends on the company.

    I have come across several large employers (like Indiana Wesleyan University) who require you to sign a form, indicating you are not gay. They explicitly state that they do not hire homosexuals, and that you will be fired if you engage in same-sex dating or other gay behaviors while under their employ.

    The majority of companies don't ask, however, and probably don't care.

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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Personally I've only had it overtly affect me once, but I hated that job so I was happy.

    As the person who hires for my company sexuality never even crosses my mind.

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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by fourozfree View Post
    So, I think I want to be a doctor of some sort someday, but I'm still in school. I'm wondering: Do people have a lot of experiences with discrimination in employment? Or particularly positive experiences? It could be in medicine or in general.

    I would also imagine it's location-specific, so maybe indicate where whatever you're talking about happened.

    Thanks
    I live in The Netherlands and the only place this is ever an issue is publicly funded religious schools. Other employers don't care.

    Quote Originally Posted by star-warrior View Post
    Employers are looking for ability to do the job and being professional too.
    Not the employers I worked for in the last three years.

    Quote Originally Posted by T-Rexx View Post
    I have come across several large employers (like Indiana Wesleyan University) who require you to sign a form, indicating you are not gay. They explicitly state that they do not hire homosexuals, and that you will be fired if you engage in same-sex dating or other gay behaviors while under their employ.
    You could lie, and if the company spied on you outside of work you could probably sue them straight to Hell.

    OP, there are also fields where being gay is actually beneficial for you career. Consider that as well.

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    JUB Addict LeicsDom's Avatar
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by T-Rexx View Post
    It depends on the company.

    I have come across several large employers (like Indiana Wesleyan University) who require you to sign a form, indicating you are not gay. They explicitly state that they do not hire homosexuals, and that you will be fired if you engage in same-sex dating or other gay behaviors while under their employ.
    In the UK that would be illegal

  7. #7
    penayforay
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    depends...If you're single...well there's no way anyone would really know unless you told them
    also depends on what kind of doctor you want to be. I remember reading something a long time ago about how some parents dont want their pediatricians to be gay (for whatever reason)
    but if you're like a brain surgeon and your work is good, I cant ever imagine it being a common issue

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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    It depends what state you are in. In 29 states,you can be fired at anytime for being gay,so it's important to keep that in mind when looking for work.

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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    I was a VP at a large American Bank and got my first promotion to official after I came out. Major City very big bank. My partner is an associate director at his firm. I am treated like his wife would be parties etc. But then we live work in London!

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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    it really helps around here.


  11. #11
    panegyric JUB Admin Corny's Avatar
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by T-Rexx View Post
    I have come across several large employers (like Indiana Wesleyan University) who require you to sign a form, indicating you are not gay. They explicitly state that they do not hire homosexuals, and that you will be fired if you engage in same-sex dating or other gay behaviors while under their employ.
    What? How is that legal?
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  12. #12
    Hard-up1
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    I worked as a busboy, a stock clerk in retail, a cafeteria worker, a factory worker, a cost accountant, and English teacher, a funeral home attendant, and a program manager. Never have I believed I would have been unwelcome or fired if I were out (when I wasn't) and I lived in Arkansas, New Mexico, and Alaska.

    Since I was 16, the only time I have been unemployed was for about a month.

    As I lived in a state that Ninja described as being able to fire me at any time (public employees are protected), I don't believe that lack of explicit protection is very germane. I never knew a gay man who was fired because he was gay there.

    To the point about Indiana Wesleyan University, the Wesleyans are the standout conservatives among Methodists, so I wouldn't want to work for them as a second class citizen, so I find it inconsequential that they don't want gay men. I'll bet they also can fire you for moral cause like adultery or public drunkenness. They hardly represent an average or typical employer. That would be the equal of finding that Focus on the Family was anti-gay in hiring. Ya think?

  13. #13

    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Corny View Post
    What? How is that legal?
    Many, perhaps most states are employment at will states. The employer can refuse to hire or can fire for any reason not prohibited by Federal law or specific state law. Gays are not protected by most anti-discrimination laws. Even where they have such laws, the law is not much help unless you inform the employer or prospective employer that you are gay, since proving that it knew you are gay is necessary to proving discrimination on that basis. BUT, as this thread shows, it does not seem to be a big issue in practice, and why would you want to work for someone who does not want you?

  14. #14
    Hard-up1
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Corny View Post
    What? How is that legal?
    Because it is a religious institution. Why would a Muslim or a Jew work at a pork sausage plant?

    It may be insidious, but taking the fight to the churches is the strategy that is guaranteed a backlash that will retard gay rights and gay marriage here.

    Exempting them from any legislation, especially about gay marriage, would be key to winning the political fight. As protections in law grow along with public opinion, those religious holdouts will grow increasingly marginalized.

    It doesn't make it right, but it makes it politically wise.

    The goal is to get the rights, which we will.

    As others have said, why would a gay man want to work for an explicitly anti-gay organization. It's well and good to advocate that there be no allowance of anti-gay religion, but that is a fantasy, far from reality. And more importantly, it is not how the great majority of Americans view state and religion interacting.

    Just as our tradition and heritage argues that the Church should not govern the State, it equally argues that the State should not direct theology. Of course, in reality, both ideals break down at multiple points.
    Last edited by Hard-up1; February 8th, 2013 at 05:18 AM.

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    panegyric JUB Admin Corny's Avatar
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Benvolio View Post
    Gays are not protected by most anti-discrimination laws.
    That was the missing piece of info. That's kinda sad.
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  16. #16
    Hard-up1
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Corny View Post
    That was the missing piece of info. That's kinda sad.
    Or, it's kinda irrelevant when one observes that we are not in fact being fired or excluded from employment based on sexuality, as most posters on here have attested.

    There was a law on the books for over a century in Missouri that gave the governor's approval to shoot Mormons on site. LDS missionaries loved to cite that. Problem was, Mormons hadn't been shot, nor were they getting shot.

    Sometimes laws are vestiges, and nothing more.

    Gay rights is the issue. We fight where it counts. Passing a law with magic words isn't the answer. Changing people's prejudices is, and that is the change that is occurring.

    Don't imagine the lack of explicit protection to be tantamount for cloaked discrimination. It's not.

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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    @OP: You're still in school? How old are you anyway?
    come now, my child. if we were planning to harm you, do you think
    we'd be lurking here beside the path in the darkest part of the forest?

  18. #18
    JUB Addict T-Rexx's Avatar
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by LeicsDom View Post
    In the UK that would be illegal
    Quote Originally Posted by Corny View Post
    What? How is that legal?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ninja108 View Post
    It depends what state you are in. In 29 states,you can be fired at anytime for being gay,so it's important to keep that in mind when looking for work.
    What Ninja said. In most of the USA, it is perfectly legal to fire you because you are gay. Sexuality is not always a protected status here.

    The OP's concern is quite valid. Being gay can have a big effect on getting a job here, depending on the employer. It's not an easy question to answer, however, as it depends on where you are and who is the employer.

    I agree with those who say they would not want to work for a company that discriminates. What an awful thing to have to hide your sexuality every moment of every day, just to keep your job. But, how many of us took our jobs because we wanted to work for a particular employer? Finding a job is difficult enough. Adding to that a need to navigate nebulous layers of intolerance by unenlightened institutions makes the task even harder for gays.

  19. #19
    Hard-up1
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    The bit that is being left out is that most corporate employers have explicit bans on interviewers asking anything about families or personal life.

    Of course, there are companies that don't and small business usually don't even have policies, but I've been on JUB for seven years, and I don't recall posts about contemporary events involving JUBBERs or their acquaintances being fired or not hired because of sexuality.

  20. #20
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    I recall at least one thread about a JUBber getting fired due to his sexuality, but it was eons ago,

    I've been gay and out for decades, and it's never hampered my ability to get a job. Even at an auto parts warehouse.

    Le

  21. #21
    JockBoy87
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Small independent offices are the best place to work I think. No doubt I've worked for a bigot at some point, but I've never experienced discrimination. My self confident attitude and strong bonds with coworkers really preclude it. In a bigger office, I could see bigotry being more of a problem. Now at the other end of the spectrum, if you can blow the boss and get hired to senior management, well then you've got it made.
    Last edited by JockBoy87; February 8th, 2013 at 10:01 AM.

  22. #22

    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by freefall View Post
    @OP: You're still in school? How old are you anyway?
    I'm 20.

    This is all very comforting to hear, everyone.

  23. #23
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard-up1 View Post
    Because it is a religious institution. Why would a Muslim or a Jew work at a pork sausage plant?

    It may be insidious, but taking the fight to the churches is the strategy that is guaranteed a backlash that will retard gay rights and gay marriage here.

    Exempting them from any legislation, especially about gay marriage, would be key to winning the political fight. As protections in law grow along with public opinion, those religious holdouts will grow increasingly marginalized.

    It doesn't make it right, but it makes it politically wise.

    The goal is to get the rights, which we will.

    As others have said, why would a gay man want to work for an explicitly anti-gay organization. It's well and good to advocate that there be no allowance of anti-gay religion, but that is a fantasy, far from reality. And more importantly, it is not how the great majority of Americans view state and religion interacting.

    Just as our tradition and heritage argues that the Church should not govern the State, it equally argues that the State should not direct theology. Of course, in reality, both ideals break down at multiple points.
    Only one exemption in Canada - the clergy themselves can be obliged to conform their personal conduct to the theological bigotry of the institution that employs them. But anything else a congregation does - hire a teacher, a janitor, a landscaper - is all subject to the human rights codes that protect gay people from being fired.
    Americans need to keep their guns so they can protect themselves from gun violence just like Nancy Lanza did. And like Chris Kyle did. And like Gabby Giffords did. And like Tom Clements did. And like Michael Piemonte. And Joseph Wilcox.

  24. #24
    Hard-up1
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    I don't excuse discrimination, but I still say it is a pretty moot question when one is asking about a religious institution. Why in the world would a gay man fight to work for an anti-gay religious institution. Sounds first-world problem to me.

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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard-up1 View Post
    Why in the world would a gay man fight to work for an anti-gay religious institution.
    Getting hired is very difficult nowadays. If I got a job offer, I would be willing to "bite the bullet" for a while. Update that resume. Start networking and hope for the best. In the meantime, that paycheck will seem mighty sweet.

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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    "How does being gay affect getting employed?"

    Well, if you show up dressed like this, it probably will play a role in their decision...

    "Everyone wants to be adored."

  27. #27
    Hard-up1
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by chrisrobin View Post
    Getting hired is very difficult nowadays. If I got a job offer, I would be willing to "bite the bullet" for a while. Update that resume. Start networking and hope for the best. In the meantime, that paycheck will seem mighty sweet.
    I'd never put you down for doing what is necessary to survive, but I don't think you'd work for Focus on the Family before just going to work at Burger King.

    I also know your posts and don't believe you'd actively work against gays.

    You're a great guy. I hope something opens up for you soon.

  28. #28

    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by MJEH89 View Post
    "How does being gay affect getting employed?"

    Well, if you show up dressed like this, it probably will play a role in their decision...

    This makes me want to apply for a job at focus on the family dressed like that and see what would happen.

  29. #29
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    any folk employ in 21st century or any cnetury is suck da shit a moron cultures world ova

    until

    awsum civlizations nogs figa out ABC

    thankyou

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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Choose a safe career such as hairdressing, florist or interior decorator. You won't suffer discrimination.

    Otherwise it's 'game on'. I was a mechanic and eventually got my gay ass fired. You will have to muster incredible acting skills (or worse, a pretend girlfriend / wife) inorder to succeed in a 'not gay' career. YMMV.

  31. #31
    Hard-up1
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    I'd be interested in hearing how many others on JUB have lost a job due to their sexual preference alone.

    I've never heard another member ever say it.

    For my own part, I've had continuous employment since I was 16, and never been ill treated or fired because I was gay.

  32. #32
    JockBoy87
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard-up1 View Post
    I'd be interested in hearing how many others on JUB have lost a job due to their sexual preference alone.

    I've never heard another member ever say it.

    For my own part, I've had continuous employment since I was 16, and never been ill treated or fired because I was gay.
    And a lot of people have worked very hard to make such a world possible for all of us.

  33. #33
    JUB Addict maxpowr9's Avatar
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    This applies for any human being in the workforce.

    Leave your personal BS at home and work shouldn't be a problem if you are good at your job.

  34. #34
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    I don't know how relevant this is to the topic, but I believe that people should take their sexuality into account when they are choosing career field.

    I mean, we take everything else - background, schools, race and so many other things - yet people still have the closet mentality when it comes to picking a job. I think you should never have to be closeted in the work place any more than in your personal or everyday life. If you want to be in a field that's predominantly conservative and homophobic, perhaps you should rethink that, or do your best to find an employer that provides an environment that would be an exception to this rule. But frankly, there's a reason why the arts and fashion are full of gays and it's not because of some genetic condition that makes us prone to it. It's because those, and others like them, are safe and welcoming environments for us.
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  35. #35

    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    I know gay employers who'll bend over backwards to hire gay staff.

    But I also remember years and years ago a display manager in the city's biggest hardware store saying 'We don't hire sissies'.

    Most PC managers nowdays keep quiet about their hiring policies. I worked for one state government agency for seven years which had a government-imposed policy that staff were allowed to access their personnel file. So ALL their decisions were made verbally and NOTHING was put in writing.
    Last edited by pat grimshaw; February 10th, 2013 at 08:46 PM.
    .

  36. #36
    johaninsc
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    Re: How does being gay affect getting employed?

    Quote Originally Posted by pat grimshaw View Post
    I know gay employers who'll bend over backwards to hire gay staff....
    and the ones who bend over forward...?

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