The Honorable Ed Koch, dead at age 88 [MERGED]

[RazorzEdge88]

I find it amusing that people are so polarized on him, on both sides.

[palbert]

I find it amusing that people are so polarized on him, on both sides.

Your amusement is sick.

[RazorzEdge88]

Yeah, how dare I find peculiarity in people's devotion to a single political figure!

You're completely off the rails today...

[ravenstar]

I'm at an absolute loss as to how the opinion of a poster here about 1 issue has turned into a slanging match where that opinion is "bashing Amercia" and the responses are all about shovelling snow and living in a boring country. This place needs to become a reality TV show.

I have no idea who Ed Koch was beyond the articles I've read about him today and a snippet where he was in Sex in the City and Short Bus as himself.

Based on the reactions in this thread, you have to ask yourself if 1 action - or perceived lack thereof - is enough to derail all the good he appears to have achieved.

I remember when Regan died and the viciousness of the Gay community based on his absolute lack of reaction to the GRIDS/HIV/AIDS crisis in the early 80's. I saw none of this "well fuck you you're not American you're not entitled to an opinion" nonsense. From memory I saw nothing but hatred spewed at the man. I find that interesting.

[Hard-up1]

There's a difference between the hyperbolic "fuck you, you're not entitled" and "what is it to you? He didn't represent you, nor did he liberate your legal rights, nor did he impede your progress in Canada because he didn't move along NYC as fast as you wanted him to."

It seems fine for there to be an endless stream of Behold the Great Satan America via threads from Canadians about our politicians, our industry, our celebrities, etc., but when we are bold enough to observe that it is an attack from outside, we are suddenly the xenophobes. Isn't being attacked from without simply a reasonable trigger to in fact defend your causes, leaders, and institutions?

One poster may have insulted the Canadians, but even then, he didn't say anything any more caustic than had already been hurled at us for simply defending the late mayor's record. Somehow, answering that insult and attack has become worse than the attack. Odd that.

I certainly never said Pete or others were not entitled to opine, but I did and do hold that the observations are colored by their remote relation to the actions and policies of the former mayor of NYC.

Maybe it's easier to be less sensitive about your country, since I haven't notices any Aussie bashing on JUB.

[Hard-up1]

I do think it telling that a mod merged two opposing threads into one in which conflict was certain. I'm not sure how that served any greater need for efficiency or whatever.

Gee, who could have seen this fight brewing after that, huh?

[SLOPPYSECONDS]

I'm at an absolute loss as to how the opinion of a poster here about 1 issue has turned into a slanging match where that opinion is "bashing Amercia" and the responses are all about shovelling snow and living in a boring country. This place needs to become a reality TV show.

I have no idea who Ed Koch was beyond the articles I've read about him today and a snippet where he was in Sex in the City and Short Bus as himself.

Based on the reactions in this thread, you have to ask yourself if 1 action - or perceived lack thereof - is enough to derail all the good he appears to have achieved.

I remember when Regan died and the viciousness of the Gay community based on his absolute lack of reaction to the GRIDS/HIV/AIDS crisis in the early 80's. I saw none of this "well fuck you you're not American you're not entitled to an opinion" nonsense. From memory I saw nothing but hatred spewed at the man. I find that interesting.

cheer up is a sure sum awsum folk make muscial
ans folk get a good soak

thankyou

[ronboy]

Ed Koch was good for New York City.
He pulled the city out of a true financial mess.
But his goodness ended at the Rockland County line.
He didn't seem to have a very high opinion of upstate New York.
He made some really silly comments about upstaters when he was running for governor.
That was why he lost the chance for his party's nomination....
Nevertheless, he was one of those characters who kept coming back for more.....
Rest in peace Mayor Koch.....

[SLOPPYSECONDS]

see he play good koch and bad koch
_ yaaaaaaaaaY_

ans world saved again

haaaaaaaaaa

[ravenstar]

There's a difference between the hyperbolic "fuck you, you're not entitled" and "what is it to you? He didn't represent you, nor did he liberate your legal rights, nor did he impede your progress in Canada because he didn't move along NYC as fast as you wanted him to."

It seems fine for there to be an endless stream of Behold the Great Satan America via threads from Canadians about our politicians, our industry, our celebrities, etc., but when we are bold enough to observe that it is an attack from outside, we are suddenly the xenophobes. Isn't being attacked from without simply a reasonable trigger to in fact defend your causes, leaders, and institutions?

One poster may have insulted the Canadians, but even then, he didn't say anything any more caustic than had already been hurled at us for simply defending the late mayor's record. Somehow, answering that insult and attack has become worse than the attack. Odd that.

I certainly never said Pete or others were not entitled to opine, but I did and do hold that the observations are colored by their remote relation to the actions and policies of the former mayor of NYC.

Maybe it's easier to be less sensitive about your country, since I haven't notices any Aussie bashing on JUB.

There's definitely times when the Aussie bashers start on JUB Hard-up1. People will always have an opinion, whether they like this country or not like that country.

I'm not saying either side is worse than the other, I was simply observing that people outside of the US are entitled to their opinion on a persons achievements or perceived lack. My main thought when I read the post was "how in the hell can 1 opinion get under people's skin so much it derails an entire thread."

And to be blunt, I wasn't actually referring to any one particular post in this thread when I wrote my reply. It's a given on this board that there's going to be a shit storm the minute someone disagrees with another.

Instead of ignoring the negative comments and continuing on with the remember this mans achievements, like every other thread on JUB about a polarising figure, it's lost it's way and is now no longer about the man, but the two countries.

You were probably right in that the 2 threads should never have been combined. If we'd been left with the 2 threads, one for his supporters, the other for his detractors one thread would have plummeted and disappeared fast enough to have had no impact. As it stands combining the two just made certain all hell would break loose.

[Hard-up1]

Instead of ignoring the negative comments and continuing on with the remember this mans achievements, like every other thread on JUB about a polarising figure, it's lost it's way and is now no longer about the man, but the two countries.

You were probably right in that the 2 threads should never have been combined. If we'd been left with the 2 threads, one for his supporters, the other for his detractors one thread would have plummeted and disappeared fast enough to have had no impact. As it stands combining the two just made certain all hell would break loose.

Yeah. It wasn't rocket science. When one thread branded the deceased TWAT and the other used the honorific accorded former mayors, it was pretty clear there'd be a shitstorm for the amusement of those viewing from the tower.

[PreTTy PeTe]

Yeah. It wasn't rocket science. When one thread branded the deceased TWAT and the other used the honorific accorded former mayors, it was pretty clear there'd be a shitstorm for the amusement of those viewing from the tower.

Really dude ...........let it rest.

no shit storm here but the only one in your head.

[MattClaimer]

Looks like SOMEONE ^^^^ just HAS to have the last word -- on everything. Pffftttt...... whatever. Blah blah blah. (oh I'm gonna get it for that I bet, ooooohhhh so skeered!)

[MattClaimer]

I'm at an absolute loss as to how the opinion of a poster here about 1 issue has turned into a slanging match where that opinion is "bashing Amercia" and the responses are all about shovelling snow and living in a boring country. This place needs to become a reality TV show.

I have no idea who Ed Koch was beyond the articles I've read about him today and a snippet where he was in Sex in the City and Short Bus as himself.

Based on the reactions in this thread, you have to ask yourself if 1 action - or perceived lack thereof - is enough to derail all the good he appears to have achieved.

I remember when Regan died and the viciousness of the Gay community based on his absolute lack of reaction to the GRIDS/HIV/AIDS crisis in the early 80's. I saw none of this "well fuck you you're not American you're not entitled to an opinion" nonsense. From memory I saw nothing but hatred spewed at the man. I find that interesting.

No being at a loss here. It's the norm of the day, this "me" only attitude. ESP on forums where there's no real-time personal action. And that's why they do it. Wouldn't DARE step up in someone's face and bring it on, because they know they'd get knocked out. And that's the thing - I see it as cowardice, to be honest. They don't care what they "derail" as long as they get to say "I'M RIGHT AND ONLY MY OPINION MATTERS!"

A lot of people THINK they're right, and everyone else is WRONG. There's no trying to have a civil discussion with those... it's immediate disseminating rhetoric on full tilt! Their side and only theirs. No true "intelligent" discussion or debate.

And unfortunately this will never change. Sad for those people, all those bitter, angry, closed-minded assholes out there, plain and simple.

[PreTTy PeTe]

Looks like SOMEONE ^^^^ just HAS to have the last word -- on everything. Pffftttt...... whatever. Blah blah blah. (oh I'm gonna get it for that I bet, ooooohhhh so skeered!)

ok last word here. only one member here is allowed to Pffffft me and he doesn't post anymore.

miss you RL

[bankside]

There's a difference between the hyperbolic "fuck you, you're not entitled" and "what is it to you? He didn't represent you, nor did he liberate your legal rights, nor did he impede your progress in Canada because he didn't move along NYC as fast as you wanted him to."

It seems fine for there to be an endless stream of Behold the Great Satan America via threads from Canadians about our politicians, our industry, our celebrities, etc., but when we are bold enough to observe that it is an attack from outside, we are suddenly the xenophobes. Isn't being attacked from without simply a reasonable trigger to in fact defend your causes, leaders, and institutions?

One poster may have insulted the Canadians, but even then, he didn't say anything any more caustic than had already been hurled at us for simply defending the late mayor's record. Somehow, answering that insult and attack has become worse than the attack. Odd that.

I certainly never said Pete or others were not entitled to opine, but I did and do hold that the observations are colored by their remote relation to the actions and policies of the former mayor of NYC.

Maybe it's easier to be less sensitive about your country, since I haven't notices any Aussie bashing on JUB.

I'm sorry but no; Bottom line, I don't believe we would be seeing this "what's it to you?" reaction if non-Americans had been paying tribute to his noble leadership. And your notion of "being attacked from without" is the very definition of the kind of nationalism you reject earlier. Next, there is no campaign of anti-Americanism going on. As I've mentioned in other threads, I would be thrilled to see much more discussion about the 96% of the world that is not American. I would be thrilled to see much more discussion between just the millions of anglophones among whom Americans are perhaps a plurality but still a decisive minority. In the absence of enough critical mass for those other conversations to occur, I'm pleased to join in more topics about the US than would normally merit air time. And of course, no one talks about "the modest advance of the mandatory air bag initiative" or "the remarkable efficiency of the modern public lending library," they bitch about things that annoy them. When you combine the human propensity to bitch about things that annoy them, with a disproportionate amount of attention on the US, it is easy to mistake for anti-americanism. But it is no doubt a mistake.

The best thing to come out of the greek debacle was the freedom to give one's honest opinion about a world event caused by moronic governance, without being reflexively accused of anti-americanism. Ahh, memories….

[Hard-up1]

Among a handful of our neighbors to the north, a simple analysis of threads they have started about American topics proves my point.

Is it all the Canadians on JUB? No. Is it a real pattern for three or four of them? Yep. Do they start similar threads about perceived failings of other countries? No. Is there a need to rebut homages to a deceased man? No. Is there a reason to defend from outside attackers? Some say so, but I can understand that you think it is wrong-headed.

But, the pattern is there in Hot Topics, and it is not imagined. Whether it is anything other than just an annoyance is up for grabs.

[miaedu]

At the end of a funeral service for Ed Koch in Manhattan, friends and family applauded the former New York City mayor as the song "New York, New York" played.