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  1. #1

    Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Some gun owners say: "We need weapons for our security. We can not give up our right!"

    Americans donīt live in a war zone.
    When a society needs weapons to feel safe,
    what`s wrong with this society?

    The problem goes deeper. It is not only a weapon problem. That too!Stricter laws are needed.

    Why Americans have this feeling of insecurity and fear?

    What makes the Americans fear?

    Perhaps because the media and politicans are playing with the fear?
    Americans do not like to take an example to other countries. Okay, but sometimes you should do that. I donīt want to be a smart aleck. I am saddened by the events in America. Look to France, UK, Germany (your friends) or Japan, Australia and so on. Why they are not afraid? There were also shootings- but rarely.

    Why does a person need an assault rifle?

    And what is the response to these events?
    Do you want to make schools to maximum security prisons?
    You give up your freedom?

    No, fight the fear! Then you don`t need weapons anymore...

    I grieve with you. We all grieve with you.
    Greetz from a german friend

  2. #2

    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    And now the NRA wants police men with guns at schools.

    http://edition.cnn.com/2012/12/21/us...html?hpt=hp_t1

    I canīt believe it.

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Thanks for your thoughts. It IS something that can't be explained simply. It is something we all have to discuss. Not NRA, not GOP, not Dems, but together but leave the NRA out of it.
    BEWARE! Harassing the Indian may result in sudden and severe hair loss.

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    There is no society that needs it. But it is a symbol or a totem for many Americans. And so more of them will succumb to Darwin's Law, but sadly, so too will the innocent.
    Americans need to keep their guns so they can protect themselves from gun violence just like Nancy Lanza did. And like Chris Kyle did. And like Gabby Giffords did. And like Tom Clements did. And like Michael Piemonte. And Joseph Wilcox.

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben1 View Post
    And now the NRA wants police men with guns at schools.

    http://edition.cnn.com/2012/12/21/us...html?hpt=hp_t1

    I canīt believe it.
    Armed police is nothing! Some gun lobbyists want the kindergarten teachers to be armed too. That way the children will surely be safe from a crazed lunatic! All the smart, responsible, gun-wielding parents will have safely locked their children into a fortified, bunker-like classroom with a smart, gun-wielding Responsible Adult.™

    What if Adam Lanza had become a teacher?
    Americans need to keep their guns so they can protect themselves from gun violence just like Nancy Lanza did. And like Chris Kyle did. And like Gabby Giffords did. And like Tom Clements did. And like Michael Piemonte. And Joseph Wilcox.

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Heard the portion of Wayne Lapierre's speech that I could stomach. Typical neocon crap. The blame for Sandy Hook rests on everyone but the NRA.

    A modest proposal: Mr. Lapierre should give the same speech as he gave this morning... to the parents and relatives of the dead children.

    In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    "Fear"? Carrying a sidearm has nothing to do with fear, it has to do with being prepared.

    Prepared for what? For the very real crime that goes on regardless of laws and police, leaving the individual citizen with no one to rely on but himself when it strikes.

    Assault rifle? Those can be owned only by having one of a finite, set number of federal licenses -- otherwise, you have to join the military.

    Fighting the fear will not save people from crime. It wouldn't have saved my friends from rape, it wouldn't have saved me from the 2x4 hitting me over the head. But what saved one of them? and what saved me? Being prepared, by having a weapon ready to use.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by bankside View Post
    There is no society that needs it. But it is a symbol or a totem for many Americans. And so more of them will succumb to Darwin's Law, but sadly, so too will the innocent.
    You're just trying to change the set of people who get killed. "Gun control" doesn't regard people as persons, but as statistics. It's a set of beliefs that would rather give criminals the upper hand in return for a false sense of safety.

    It's a set of beliefs that says, "Oh, sure, Kuli would be dead, but that's fine because statistically we're better off, so that's okay".

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Let's not overlook what's going on in our schools today. Do you know any teachers? If you do, how many of them are allowed to discipline the children in their classes? Not very many, if any, in many (if not, most) districts. They can send them to detention and a host of other things, but the troublemakers usually wind up right back in the classrooms.

    I know of one school system where teachers were allowed to start a process which sent the troublemakers to a special school. That at least separates the troublemakers from the rest of the kids.

    Perhaps there should be metal detectors at the entranct to schools, along with guards.

    Kids grow up exposed to faux violence on tv and in video games these days. The level of violence in these areas is appalling. Maybe it's also time for parents to wake up and take charge of their children. All too many of them use the school system as a sort of expensive day care facility.

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by chrisrobin View Post
    Heard the portion of Wayne Lapierre's speech that I could stomach. Typical neocon crap. .

    .
    Accurately quote just one thing that he said which is untrue. You can't do it.

  11. #11
    loki81
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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    the genie is already out of the bottle with guns... even if they were made 100% illegal today, there would still be millions out there on the streets. and short of shredding the 4th Amendment, you're not going to see armed police officers searching through every home in America trying to ferret out guns.

    which isn't to say that semi-meaningful regulations can't be passed, but to say that people need to just stop being "fearful" and everything will magically be better doesn't really reflect a good understanding of the issues imo.

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by HenryReardon View Post
    Let's not overlook what's going on in our schools today. Do you know any teachers? If you do, how many of them are allowed to discipline the children in their classes? Not very many, if any, in many (if not, most) districts. They can send them to detention and a host of other things, but the troublemakers usually wind up right back in the classrooms.

    I know of one school system where teachers were allowed to start a process which sent the troublemakers to a special school. That at least separates the troublemakers from the rest of the kids.

    Perhaps there should be metal detectors at the entranct to schools, along with guards.
    I'm not going to go into the psychology of discipline here. Meanwhile... while the metal detector idea isn't bad, remember that this guy shot his way in through a window.

    Quote Originally Posted by HenryReardon View Post
    Kids grow up exposed to faux violence on tv and in video games these days. The level of violence in these areas is appalling. Maybe it's also time for parents to wake up and take charge of their children. All too many of them use the school system as a sort of expensive day care facility.
    This is sadly true.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    I'm not going to go into the psychology of discipline here. Meanwhile... while the metal detector idea isn't bad, remember that this guy shot his way in through a window.



    This is sadly true.
    Even worse, when they get home from school, tv and video games are their primary forms of amusement.
    Sadly, I don't see a solution to that. At least not until parents take charge.

  14. #14

    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    When a society needs weapons to feel safe,
    what`s wrong with this society?

  15. #15
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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben1 View Post
    And now the NRA wants police men with guns at schools.

    http://edition.cnn.com/2012/12/21/us...html?hpt=hp_t1

    I canīt believe it.
    Some Democrat suggested that before LaPierre did, this time around. They have a point:

    How have our nation's priorities gotten so far out of order? Think about it. We care about our money, so we protect our banks with armed guards. American airports, office buildings, power plants,courthouses — even sports stadiums — are all protected by armed security. We care about the President, so we protect him with armed Secret Service agents. Members of Congress work in offices surrounded by armed Capitol Police officers. Yet when it comes to the most beloved, innocent and vulnerable members of the American family — our children — we as a society leave them utterly defenseless, and the monsters and predators of this world know it and exploit it.
    It's a point LaPierre made after Virginia Tech, too. Think how different things might have been this time if it had been followed.
    Last edited by Kulindahr; December 21st, 2012 at 12:28 PM.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben1 View Post
    When a society needs weapons to feel safe,
    what`s wrong with this society?
    It has a non-zero crime rate, and no one legally obligated to protect the citizens.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben1 View Post
    And now the NRA wants police men with guns at schools.

    http://edition.cnn.com/2012/12/21/us...html?hpt=hp_t1

    I canīt believe it.
    What if some crazy police shot all the school kids dead?


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  18. #18

    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    See, Kuli, I am living in Germany. And I have friends in Spain, Denmark and so on. No friend, nobody, has a gun at home - and it`s not necessary. And we don`t have less idiots and psychopaths than the US, I think. Of course our police and armee and so on have weapons - but not our citizens. Some people have shooting as sports discipline (is this the right word?), yes, but that`s it. We do not feel that we need weapons. Police at school, assault rifles in private hands, a gun in the tray or under the pillow, a weapons association with influence, that is unthinkable here. Therefore I ask: Why you need weapons in private hands? And if you need weapons, what is wrong in your society. I donīt think itīs only tradition - I think there is fear, distrust -- uncertainty - I want to understand this, you see?

  19. #19
    loki81
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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben1 View Post
    No friend, nobody, has a gun at home - and it`s not necessary.
    I wonder if Jews living in Germany in the 1930's/40's would agree.
    Last edited by opinterph; December 21st, 2012 at 05:57 PM. Reason: added attribution

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    He believes it's about freedom and having guns somehow makes you free, and the moment you don't have guns, you're a slave. Makes a sense that is not, but there you have it.
    That we are capable only of being what we are, remains our unforgivable sin.
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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by loki81 View Post
    I wonder if Jews living in Germany in the 1930's/40's would agree.
    Yay emotional baseless arguments! Like guns would have made a difference. In fact they would have ALL been exterminated, had they tried to defend themselves with guns.
    That we are capable only of being what we are, remains our unforgivable sin.
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  22. #22

    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Is that the level of the debate we want, loki? It is about the Germans killed Jews 70 years ago or is it a matter that American children are slaughtered today?
    In this way the problem is never solved.

    By the way, since Sandy Hook died 78 persons in the USA by fire weapons!!!

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by loki81 View Post
    I wonder if Jews living in Germany in the 1930's/40's would agree.
    It would have been hard to ask them - since they would have bombed in their houses because of the armed threat they represented.
    ATTACK OF THE LIBERAL ELITE

  24. #24
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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by Rolyo85 View Post
    Yay emotional baseless arguments! Like guns would have made a difference. In fact they would have ALL been exterminated, had they tried to defend themselves with guns.
    just pointing out the irony (?) of a German criticizing Americans for being distrustful of their government.

    I'm not particularly strong on the second amendment personally, but talking about removing all guns from the US is pointless. it's never, ever, ever going to happen. never. it's like suggesting to the Irish that they combat alcoholism by shutting down the Guinness factories.

    and even if it did happen, there would still be millions of guns out on the streets already and porous borders with Mexico and Canada for even more to be brought into the country through.

    there's no political will for it, certainly not within our generation. so talking about repealing the 2nd Amendment is pointless when we should be looking at what effective regulations we can impose instead.

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    I don't buy the "never ever". Things are only "never ever" until they happen. It happened with slavery, it happened with integration, mixed marriage, gay rights, the first black president... It will happen with guns as well, sooner or later.

    And I find it in poor taste to go the "yeah, but you guys killed jews" route. That was decades ago. Wanna talk about what the US was doing at the time? Yeah, not genocide, but still not pretty either. It's not just off-topic, it's an unnecessary insult to someone whose PARENTS weren't even born then.
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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by loki81 View Post
    I wonder if Jews living in Germany in the 1930's/40's would agree.
    So idiotic statement i can't describe it.


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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by Rolyo85 View Post
    I don't buy the "never ever". Things are only "never ever" until they happen. It happened with slavery, it happened with integration, mixed marriage, gay rights, the first black president... It will happen with guns as well, sooner or later.
    slavery was concentrated amongst extremely rich southern land owners. on the other hand, about 50% of Americans today own guns. while there's support for many regulations, support for a ban of all guns is at an all-time low



    even if a gun ban were imposed today, Americans currently own 50% of the guns on the face of the planet and a generation's worth of attempts at closing the Mexican border haven't seen much success.

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    And until a couple of years ago, more than 50% of Americans opposed same sex marriage. Things change. And it won't start with a ban, it will start with tighter regulation.
    That we are capable only of being what we are, remains our unforgivable sin.
    - Gene Wolfe

  29. #29
    loki81
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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    legalizing gay marriage is largely a state issue that wouldn't require a constitutional amendment... a completely different beast than trying to repeal the 2nd Amendment (and presumably repealing the 4th Amendment if you want cops breaking down doors to get all existing guns off the streets)

    we might need that fence on the Mexican border built too. and probably another one up north.

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Legalizing gay marriage should not be a state issue to begin with, and DOMA is mostly a legal issue. But yeah, point stands. Lucky for us, EVERY amount of gun regulation is STILL within the confines of the 2nd Amendment ^_^
    That we are capable only of being what we are, remains our unforgivable sin.
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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by loki81 View Post
    the genie is already out of the bottle with guns... even if they were made 100% illegal today, there would still be millions out there on the streets. and short of shredding the 4th Amendment, you're not going to see armed police officers searching through every home in America trying to ferret out guns.

    which isn't to say that semi-meaningful regulations can't be passed, but to say that people need to just stop being "fearful" and everything will magically be better doesn't really reflect a good understanding of the issues imo.
    Don't be too pessimistic about the possibility of success. Australia de-gunned.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-20765259
    Americans need to keep their guns so they can protect themselves from gun violence just like Nancy Lanza did. And like Chris Kyle did. And like Gabby Giffords did. And like Tom Clements did. And like Michael Piemonte. And Joseph Wilcox.

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben1 View Post
    .

    By the way, since Sandy Hook died 78 persons in the USA by fire weapons!!!
    On average in 2009, 93 people were killed on the roadways of the U.S. each day.

    So which is the larger problem?

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Exactly Henry and auto accidents would be much more severe if the entire industry wasn't insured, tested, licensed and regulated. Which is what responsible people in the us desire to occur with guns.

    Although the auto argument is ignorant. When a automobile is properly used it results in no deaths. When a gun is properly used it results in the destruction of something. A target or a six year old.
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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by HenryReardon View Post
    On average in 2009, 93 people were killed on the roadways of the U.S. each day.

    So which is the larger problem?
    Collectively, Americans travel around 5 trillion miles per year in motor vehicles. The vehicles enable citizens to perform essential functions like work and school. They move goods like food to where they can be consumed. Without motor vehicles the economy would collapse, and many millions of Americans would probably starve. They are essential.

    Imagine how many would die if there was little or no requirement to regulate driving capabilities (ie licenses, driver testing), if vehicles did not need to be roadworthy (registration) and there were no restrictions on how large or powerful a vehicle anybody could drive?

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by bankside View Post
    Don't be too pessimistic about the possibility of success. Australia de-gunned.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-20765259
    Unless protection of gun rights was enshrined in their constitution, the comparison is not relevant. It is impossible for guns to be banned in the US unless there is a massive sea-change. It will not happen. Ever.

  36. #36
    loki81
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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    I like the idea of a gun buyback, but the fact remains that there are legions of people who will absolutely not, under no circumstances, surrender their guns. and I'm not sure we've reached the point where we want police breaking down doors and confiscating legally-purchased guns against the owners' will.

    I'm not sure how realistic it is, but what I'd really love to see is an exorbitant tax on bullets. maybe give waivers to shooting ranges (as long as the bullets don't leave the range) and limited waivers to hunters (for whatever is deemed "average" for a season's hunting use... buy a hunting license, get X number of rounds tax-free)

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by loki81 View Post
    I like the idea of a gun buyback, but the fact remains that there are legions of people who will absolutely not, under no circumstances, surrender their guns. and I'm not sure we've reached the point where we want police breaking down doors and confiscating legally-purchased guns against the owners' will.

    )
    But 'police breaking down doors' is the next logical step when a country starts to slide down that slippery slope, is it not?

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by HenryReardon View Post
    But 'police breaking down doors' is the next logical step when a country starts to slide down that slippery slope, is it not?
    Well, when the gun buyback happened in Australia in 1996, they didn't break down my door. Or anybody I know.

    What DID happen was the gun homicide rates and gun suicide rates dropped by more than 50% immediately. And there hasn't been a mass shooting in the nation in the 16 years since.

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    auribus teneo lupum Stardreamer's Avatar
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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben1 View Post
    See, Kuli, I am living in Germany. And I have friends in Spain, Denmark and so on. No friend, nobody, has a gun at home - and it`s not necessary. And we don`t have less idiots and psychopaths than the US, I think. Of course our police and armee and so on have weapons - but not our citizens. Some people have shooting as sports discipline (is this the right word?), yes, but that`s it. We do not feel that we need weapons. Police at school, assault rifles in private hands, a gun in the tray or under the pillow, a weapons association with influence, that is unthinkable here. Therefore I ask: Why you need weapons in private hands? And if you need weapons, what is wrong in your society. I donīt think itīs only tradition - I think there is fear, distrust -- uncertainty - I want to understand this, you see?
    I knew couple of Germans when I stationed over there who had guns, my Aunt's brother was one of them. They had rifles they used for hunting.
    Under democracy one party always devotes its chief energies to trying to prove that the other party is unfit to rule - and both commonly succeed, and are right. H. L. Mencken US editor (1880 - 1956)

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by loki81 View Post
    I like the idea of a gun buyback, but the fact remains that there are legions of people who will absolutely not, under no circumstances, surrender their guns. and I'm not sure we've reached the point where we want police breaking down doors and confiscating legally-purchased guns against the owners' will.

    I'm not sure how realistic it is, but what I'd really love to see is an exorbitant tax on bullets. maybe give waivers to shooting ranges (as long as the bullets don't leave the range) and limited waivers to hunters (for whatever is deemed "average" for a season's hunting use... buy a hunting license, get X number of rounds tax-free)
    Constitutionally any mandatory surrender of guns by the Federal government would require the owners to be compensated for the 'taking' of their property. Our congress can't even pass budgets for the things they have already mandated that we have, can you see trying to get that bill through the House?
    Under democracy one party always devotes its chief energies to trying to prove that the other party is unfit to rule - and both commonly succeed, and are right. H. L. Mencken US editor (1880 - 1956)

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by andysayshi View Post
    Well
    What DID happen was the gun homicide rates and gun suicide rates dropped by more than 50% immediately. And there hasn't been a mass shooting in the nation in the 16 years since.
    And were the freedoms you gave up to achieve that goal worth it? I think not.
    I also know, from a lifelong friend whose lived their for 35 years, Oz is already pretty socialist, so it was
    probably an easier sell that it would be here in the US wher we still place some value on our freedoms

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by Stardreamer View Post
    Constitutionally any mandatory surrender of guns by the Federal government would require the owners to be compensated for the 'taking' of their property. Our congress can't even pass budgets for the things they have already mandated that we have, can you see trying to get that bill through the House?
    I don't always agree with you, but considering the clusterfuck going on in the house - and now they've retired to replenish their condoms and lube, I have to say Amen to that.
    ATTACK OF THE LIBERAL ELITE

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by henryreardon View Post
    and were the freedoms you gave up to achieve that goal worth it? I think not.
    I also know, from a lifelong friend whose lived their for 35 years, oz is already pretty socialist, so it was
    probably an easier sell that it would be here in the us wher we still place some value on our freedoms
    Oh No NOT THE SOCIALISM!!!!!!!!

    (I hope no one has told Henry that streets and sewer systems are the socialism - you KNOW what he'd have to start doing)
    ATTACK OF THE LIBERAL ELITE

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by TX-Beau View Post
    [(I hope no one has told Henry that streets and sewer systems are the socialism - you KNOW what he'd have to start doing)
    Streets and sewer systems are not sociallism. For the record, the first turnpikes in this country, up until a bit after 1815 or so, were built and operated by, corporations. I've heard that at least one state turnpike currently operating may be leased to private enterprise so it can be run more efficiently.

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Yeah Henry they are, ALL government programs are socialism. Public Libraries, fire departments, police departments, the army, it's all the socialism.
    ATTACK OF THE LIBERAL ELITE

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by TX-Beau View Post
    Yeah Henry they are, ALL government programs are socialism. Public Libraries, fire departments, police departments, the army, it's all the socialism.
    Not at all. You don't even understand the stuff you believe.
    From Merriam-Webster


    Definition of SOCIALISM


    1

    : any of various economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods


    2

    a: a system of society or group living in which there is no private property

    b: a system or condition of society in which the means of production are owned and controlled by the state

    3

    : a stage of society in Marxist theory transitional between capitalism and communism and distinguished by unequal distribution of goods and pay according to work done


    Source Link (added by moderator): http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/socialism
    Last edited by opinterph; December 21st, 2012 at 09:22 PM. Reason: added quote tags and source link; Refer to CE&P Posting Guidelines

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Like oh I don't know collective governmental ownership and administration of the distribution of fire safety?
    ATTACK OF THE LIBERAL ELITE

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by TX-Beau View Post
    Like oh I don't know collective governmental ownership and administration of the distribution of fire safety?
    Neither of which have anything to do with the means of production.

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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Quote Originally Posted by loki81 View Post
    … what I'd really love to see is an exorbitant tax on bullets.
    It is not particularly difficult to manufacture your own bullets at home.


    Quote Originally Posted by HenryReardon View Post
    But 'police breaking down doors' is the next logical step when a country starts to slide down that slippery slope, is it not?
    Do you concur with the ACLU’s opinion regarding Section 215 (and other elements in Title II) of the USA Patriot Act?


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    PerScientiam AdJustitiam bankside's Avatar
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    Re: Thoughts after Sandy Hook

    Sometimes the world's media reports on a country to help the locals understand it. And sometimes the questions foreigners ask as they try to make sense of that country can also help a country understand itself. Perhaps to see itself without the veneer of its own assumptions and givens.

    Expats describe the moment they realized they weren’t in Canada any more.
    This sacred text explains why the US can't kick the gun habit
    The Newtown massacre - Fake tears
    The gun control that works: no guns
    Newtown Massacre - The Rifle and the American Identity (in French)
    How is a conspiracy theory born?
    Gun debate also a battle over the past. (Paywall/Library subscription. Gist: Skeptical of US revisionist history on meaning of second amendment and court bias in Heller.)
    Culture of personal violence to blame.

    It's astonishing, this idea that people need guns to free themselves from governments of their own creation. And that by not having them under the coffee table they were somehow less free than people subjected to the Second Amendment. If you were to suggest this, in any number of countries around the world, you'd be laughed at by free people until you understand they are utterly unafraid of their governments.

    It's astonishing that anyone could believe the idea that a chicken in every pot and a gun under every pillow will make any country a better, safer, more secure place.

    And it's laughable that a bunch of Americans with their guns could shoot down a north korean nuke, or take out a plane full of terrorists.
    Last edited by bankside; December 21st, 2012 at 10:38 PM.
    Americans need to keep their guns so they can protect themselves from gun violence just like Nancy Lanza did. And like Chris Kyle did. And like Gabby Giffords did. And like Tom Clements did. And like Michael Piemonte. And Joseph Wilcox.

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