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  1. #1

    The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    20% of all gay men in the U.S have HIV, most do not even know it. Gay men still account for the majority of the cases of HIV being spread in the developed world. There is a very good chance that a very significant portion of the people reading this have HIV and do not even know it. It seems like to me that the Homosexual community is in denial about the rampant spreading of HIV by gay men, and some seem to think HIV is no longer a big deal. It is a big deal and people need to wake up.

    Less than 1% of the U.S general population has HIV or AIDS, gay men have over a 20 times greater chance of having HIV/AIDs.
    Last edited by SoVos20; November 28th, 2012 at 03:41 PM.

  2. #2
    The Mother of Loki Laufey's Avatar
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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Wow that's really high.

    It's about 2% here if I remember correctly. 0,2% for the total population.

    When I traveled to London I heard 1 in every 5 gay men have HIV. It made me feel kinda paranoid when having sex.

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    PerScientiam AdJustitiam bankside's Avatar
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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    SoVos, welcome aboard. I must say it is a bit unusual for new members to make two posts which could be read as being filled with fear or disgust about gay-related issues.

    Your other post was:
    The anus is for shitting out of, not for playing with. Disgusting IMHO.
    It is usually the sort of introduction to JUB made by a homophobic troll. But on the assumption that these are real issues for you, what do you propose that gay men do to improve the health of the gay community?
    Americans need to keep their guns so they can protect themselves from gun violence just like Nancy Lanza did. And like Chris Kyle did. And like Gabby Giffords did. And like Tom Clements did. And like Michael Piemonte. And Joseph Wilcox.

  4. #4

    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    20% and 1 in 5 are the same, but we have to wonder how the statistic was generated.

  5. #5
    Kein Ayin Hara JUB Admin KaraBulut's Avatar
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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    If the statistics sound high it's because they're being quoted out of context.

    The 1 in 5 statistic (a 20% infection rate) among men who have sex with men (MSM) is a statistic about MSM men who live in urban areas in the US. It includes a disproportionate number of men of color . The infection rate in urban areas is distorted by two statistical subgroups- white MSM over the age of 40 and latino and black MSM. The infection rate for minorities is about 2-3 times the rate for white MSM.

    My favorite overlooked fact: over 30 years into the epidemic, the CDC has never confirmed a case of HIV in women who have sex with women (excluding cases from IV drug use and transfusions). No one ever quotes that one.

    Being gay isn't a risk factor for HIV and AIDS. Having unprotected anal sex without a condom is the risk factor. This is also why there's a growing population of women who were infected via anal sex.
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  6. #6

    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Quote Originally Posted by bankside View Post
    SoVos, welcome aboard. I must say it is a bit unusual for new members to make two posts which could be read as being filled with fear or disgust about gay-related issues.

    Your other post was:


    It is usually the sort of introduction to JUB made by a homophobic troll. But on the assumption that these are real issues for you, what do you propose that gay men do to improve the health of the gay community?
    Sex should always be protected sex, there should be more done to educate men who have sex with men on the dangers of unprotected sex.

    About the anal sex thing, I know many people enjoy it, I just find the idea unpleasant.

  7. #7
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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    I think all of us who were born in modern countries are well aware of the risks. Some just decide to take more risks than others.

    A lot of immigrants on the other hand don't really choose to they just don't know any better.

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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Quote Originally Posted by Geiri85 View Post

    When I traveled to London I heard 1 in every 5 gay men have HIV. It made me feel kinda paranoid when having sex.
    And we have often been told the same about Americans.

    London, as a city, has a higher proportionof HIV+ people mainly because the facilities to treat it are better there.

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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Quote Originally Posted by SoVos20 View Post
    Sex should always be protected sex, there should be more done to educate men who have sex with men on the dangers of unprotected sex.

    About the anal sex thing, I know many people enjoy it, I just find the idea unpleasant.
    You are very authoritarian sounding and though I agree with education you need to take the human element into fact.
    The same thing could be said about countless millions of unplanned babies over the centuries and all sorts of stds that are not new since 1980.
    No matter how the best intent is humans are imperfect and often don't think these things that happen to others can happen to them, and this goes far beyond stds.
    What if all drivers obeyed the laws and were educated regularly, do you think the seemingly acceptable death toll and carnage would suddenly stop on the highways?

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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Trouw newspaper reported in 2006 that the University of Maastricht and the Schorer Stichting suspect that 11% of bi- and gay men in the Netherlands have HIV. During 55% of their sexual encounters the HIV+ men had unprotected sex.

  11. #11
    panegyric JUB Admin Corny's Avatar
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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Quote Originally Posted by KaraBulut View Post
    The infection rate in urban areas is distorted by two statistical subgroups- white MSM over the age of 40 and latino and black MSM. The infection rate for minorities is about 2-3 times the rate for white MSM.
    Any insight why this is like it? Less sexual education? More in the closet (although I don't see the HIV connection there)?
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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Quote Originally Posted by Geiri85 View Post
    Wow that's really high.

    It's about 2% here if I remember correctly. 0,2% for the total population.

    When I traveled to London I heard 1 in every 5 gay men have HIV. It made me feel kinda paranoid when having sex.
    wow, that is 20% ...


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    Kein Ayin Hara JUB Admin KaraBulut's Avatar
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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Quote Originally Posted by Corny
    The infection rate in urban areas is distorted by two statistical subgroups- white MSM over the age of 40 and latino and black MSM. The infection rate for minorities is about 2-3 times the rate for white MSM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Corny View Post
    Any insight why this is like it? Less sexual education? More in the closet (although I don't see the HIV connection there)?
    It is very difficult to have a conversation about HIV and minorities in the US without being accused of racial bias.

    At a conference I attended, I heard some some very startling statistics on the HIV infection rates among minorities. About 14% of the US population is black but 44% of newly-diagnosed HIV infections are among the black population. Of those new infections among blacks, about 30% are women and 70% are men. The statisticians are saying that 1 in 16 black men will contract HIV; the infection rate among MSM black men in urban areas is estimated to be close to 50% and the studies say that most don't know that they are infected.

    The HIV issue tracks two other public health issue- STDs and teenage pregnancy- which are also higher in minority groups in the US. In a nutshell, the problem is sexual activity at a young age without the use of condoms.

    The problem is not less sexual education (sex ed in the US is inadequate for everyone) - it's a complicated set of factors that combine high risk sexual activity, high infection rates, number of partners, circumcision rates combined with a lack of open discussion about HIV, sex and homosexuality. To put it in perspective, the infection rates for blacks in the US are statistically similar to the rates in blacks in Africa.

    http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/topics/aa/
    Last edited by KaraBulut; December 1st, 2012 at 06:16 AM.
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  14. #14
    Are u haleloo ya ? Telstra's Avatar
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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Quote Originally Posted by KaraBulut View Post
    It is very difficult to have a conversation about HIV and minorities in the US without being accused of racial bias.

    At a conference I attended, I heard some some very startling statistics on the HIV infection rates among minorities. About 14% of the US population is black but 44% of newly-diagnosed HIV infections are among the black population. Of those new infections among blacks, about 30% are women and 70% are men. The statisticians are saying that 1 in 16 black men will contract HIV; the infection rate among MSM black men in urban areas is estimated to be close to 50% and the studies say that most don't know that they are infected.

    The HIV issue tracks two other public health issue- STDs and teenage pregnancy- which are also higher in minority groups in the US. In a nutshell, the problem is sexual activity at a young age without the use of condoms.

    The problem is not less sexual education (sex ed in the US is inadequate for everyone) - it's a complicated set of factors that combine high risk sexual activity, high infection rates, number of partners, circumcision rates combined with a lack of open discussion about HIV, sex and homosexuality. To put it in perspective, the infection rates for blacks in the US are statistically similar to the rates in blacks in Africa.

    http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/topics/aa/
    Sounds very dangerous for those groups of people.
    And might spread out to other groups who like big cocks.


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  15. #15
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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Quote Originally Posted by Telstra View Post
    Sounds very dangerous for those groups of people.
    And might spread out to other groups who like big cocks.
    Well, that wasn't racist at all...

    The problem however still stands. Ignorance and denial will make sure that HIV will thrive amongst mankind for a long time.
    I just don't understand why the governments doesn't take these issues seriously? Pour money into research instead of fireworks and fancy crap and try to figure out something...

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    A Total Bottom mbamike's Avatar
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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Quote Originally Posted by Telstra View Post
    Sounds very dangerous for those groups of people.
    And might spread out to other groups who like big cocks.
    I like big cocks, but I use condoms.

    Homophobia kills!

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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    ANother issue is the fact that with drugs and treatment,people with HIV/AIDS are living longer. Of course that's a great thing but it also has sadly led to many gays,especially younger ones,losing their fear of it.
    They don't see the side effects many of these treatments have,they don't understand that sooner or later,you will die from it. ANd most of all,they don't see all the people dying from it all at once.
    There needs to be more education done on this,there really does.

  18. #18

    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Only a vaccine will wipe it out, and billions are being spent without success. The experience with syphilis shows that a cure is not enough. They have been able to cure syphilis with penicillin since the 40s, but it is still with us, because, as with HIV, infected people can live a long time without symptoms and infect many people. By contrast, Ebola is a horrible disease, but it kills very quickly and victims do not have time to spread it.

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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Comparing penicillin and vaccines is comparing apples and oranges.

    You should rather compare it with other vaccines. Many of them have a much better track record.

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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninja108 View Post
    ANother issue is the fact that with drugs and treatment,people with HIV/AIDS are living longer. Of course that's a great thing but it also has sadly led to many gays,especially younger ones,losing their fear of it.
    They don't see the side effects many of these treatments have,they don't understand that sooner or later,you will die from it. ANd most of all,they don't see all the people dying from it all at once.
    There needs to be more education done on this,there really does.
    This is the failure of HIV education today. Condom and testing is emphasized but little is said about how it is to live with HIV. Considering that half of people with HIV get diagnosed "late," HIV meds for them only extend their lives by 16 years+ on average, meaning HIV is still a premature killer but only a delayed killer in the Western World. I was ignorant about it myself, when I didn't understand why some 50 year old men on HIV meds needed oxygen tanks with walkers like nursing home elderly. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-15853743

  21. #21
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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Quote Originally Posted by SoVos20 View Post
    Sex should always be protected sex, there should be more done to educate men who have sex with men on the dangers of unprotected sex.
    You assume people are not educated?

    Heart Disease is the #1 killer and preventive education is readily available...so you should NEVER eat saturated fat/ALWAYS eat fruits/veggies/ALWAYS exercise/ NEVER gain any weight/NEVER allow stress...you get the picture?

    What I have noticed since the beginning of AIDS is the intentional and unintentional demonization of the victims.

    If you have that kind of thinking...then perhaps blame eveyone's CHOICES for their disease/death.

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    PerScientiam AdJustitiam bankside's Avatar
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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    I think we live in a gay subculture where two strangers are more likely to get together and fuck each other than go to a movie and get to know each other. That's why we have persistent HIV infection. That's the education piece that's missing. Because as difficult as it is to talk about race and HIV, suggesting anything other than Harm Reduction orthodoxy of "wear a condom while you fuck another random stranger" is even more impossible. You end up being told you're blaming the victim, or anti-sex, or judgmental, or hetero-centric whatever that is.

    The truth is I want people to enjoy sex and not be uptight about it. But getting a disease is not how to enjoy sex. The sexual skill we don't teach is where to draw the line so you don't get HIV or pass it on to someone else. And it is a skill we need to start teaching.

    First thing is to burst people's illusions about testing. "I got tested 2 months ago and four guys ago! I'm 'clean' Yaaaay!" Bullshit. Testing doesn't protect you from HIV, and it doesn't stop you from passing it on if you've slept with more than one guy since your last test. Once you sleep with someone you need to wait and get tested again.
    Americans need to keep their guns so they can protect themselves from gun violence just like Nancy Lanza did. And like Chris Kyle did. And like Gabby Giffords did. And like Tom Clements did. And like Michael Piemonte. And Joseph Wilcox.

  23. #23

    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Quote Originally Posted by Geiri85 View Post
    Comparing penicillin and vaccines is comparing apples and oranges.

    You should rather compare it with other vaccines. Many of them have a much better track record.
    You completely misunderstood my post.

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    Kein Ayin Hara JUB Admin KaraBulut's Avatar
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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Fortunately, this wasn't an advice thread because it's gone so far off course that I'm not sure where it's going.

    One common theme- and it's been the common theme for 30 years is that there are always lots of opinions about why HIV continues to persist but little seems to be be done that improves the situation.

    Some things have gotten better in 30 years. Certainly, everyone is aware of now that this is a virus that is transmitted primarily through sexual activity. We don't have crazies running around anymore suggesting that we lock up people with HIV or that we criminalize homosexual activity (well, except in Uganda). Gay people now have choices- they can even marry in some countries and in a few states in the US.

    Yet, HIV persists. Infection rates are lower in some socio-economic groups. They're disastrous in other socio-economic groups.

    We still have quite a ways to go. Everyone has their ideas about what the problem is. Seldom, however, does anyone promote solutions or suggest ways to change things- aside from a few members who are still active in public health or in HIV awareness initiatives.
    Last edited by KaraBulut; December 7th, 2012 at 06:30 PM.
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    Re: The HIV Epidemic and Gay men.

    Quote Originally Posted by Benvolio View Post
    You completely misunderstood my post.
    Yes I did, sorry.

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