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Thread: Bi or gay?

  1. #1

    Bi or gay?

    Hi, I'm new here.

    Basically, I like watching both gay and straight porn, but I don't feel romantically or emotionally connected to men, just women. I felt fine with "labeling: myself as bisexual, but I always hear people say that only women can be bisexual. I really don't know what to do or say at this point. I've never been in a relationship, but I did tell my friends a few years ago that I leaned both ways, and they were supportive and didn't treat me any different. I like women's breasts and I really enjoy straight porn and I have no problem with vagina, but I feel like when I was younger, it was drilled into my head that you can only go one way. My sexuality is basically non-existent off the internet.

    I told my mother I was bisexual four years ago, and the very next day I was embarrassed in church. Now that I am a little older, I see now that I can make my own choices as far as religion goes, but I never got the chance to rationally explore or figure myself out due to my parent's intolerance, despite the fact that I told them. I just wish I had the chance to figure things out in a safe, understanding environment without either my mother throwing God's disdain in my face or everyone else telling me I am Gay and just not fully out yet.

  2. #2
    Shy-ster justanothershyguy's Avatar
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    Re: Bi or gay?

    If you're not romantically or emotionally interested in men, then you're more likely to be straight but curious.

    They're all just labels anyway. Do what you want because it makes you happy, not because it makes other people happy.
    Author of Lost in a Dream. If you want to make me smile, read it and tell me what you think.

  3. #3

    Re: Bi or gay?

    Well, yeah, it sounds like you're most likely bisexual. But as justanothershyguy wisely says, they're nothing but labels, and therefore, really irrelevant and unimportant. To hell with them! Just focus on being yourself. That's it. If you like women or men exclusively, you'll know with time. Don't let anyone bully you into believing you're just lying to yourself and afraid/ashamed of being homosexual or any crap like that. There can be a lot of biphobia in this world.

    Good luck.

  4. #4
    Execuvette Rolyo85's Avatar
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    Re: Bi or gay?

    This is complicated on two levels - psychological and semantic.

    Psychological:

    1. If you have no (or limited) real life experience, it's hard to know when you're not one of the lucky extremes who never have any doubt about where their dick points at.

    2. I am NOT saying you have that issue, but it is highly likely, especially after you mentioned your church (which gives us some idea of your background) - a LOT of conflicted guys subconsciously try to minimize their attraction to other men by denying emotional or romantic connection to them and limiting it to the physical. This is especially common with religious people who are taught that homosexuality is a sin of the flesh while everyone feels emotional attachment and love only for the opposite gender. It's a problem that I have noticed in many guys, because the truth is that MOST people CAN have sex with the opposite of the gender that attracts them. So many guys will play straight while craving dick, and claim that they are madly in love with their girlfriends but just like some sweaty man action on the side with no feelings. This is a lie. Emotional attachment is absolutely part of you sexuality. A straight man CAN NOT fall in love with another man, and a gay man CAN NOT fall in love with a woman. As for bisexuality, it does not work that way, but I'll get to that later.

    3. You can only ever know what you are once you examine your feelings about being gay. I'm not saying you are, but imagine for a second that you don't get aroused by straight porn (or that it's just the guys there that do it for you) and that you are not confused about it. How does that make you feel? What would it mean for you to be gay? Because if you have serious issues with being gay, then a whole lot of your confusion will remain confused, since your brain would frantically try to undermine anything that has to do with homosexuality. Like, potentially, the issue I depicted above. If you would be fine with being gay though, then you can start really exploring your feelings honestly and figuring out what you are would be much easier.


    Semantic:

    Different people use the term "bisexual" to label different things. Here is my definition:

    1. In my experience, bisexuality works differently than homo- or heterosexuality. Bisexuals are attracted to both genders, true, but not at the same time. For them attraction depends on the particular person, the environment and context, NOT on the gender. A guy who falls for a guy and then - after the relationship runs its course - goes for a girl, is probably bisexual. But the guy who has a girlfriend and constantly cheats on her with guys, is just gay in denial. I am a fan of the Kinsey scale, and to me if one has ANY preference in genders, he should be labeled by the sexuality that goes for that gender. "I am bisexual, but I lean towards guys" to me translates as "I am gay". Others view it differently, BUT...

    2... there are two stigmas related to the term "bisexual", one of which is in mainstream, and the other - in gay culture. The first one is that even though for guys who want to Not Be Gay labeling themselves as "bi" seems to be a better option, for a HELL OF A LOT of people that means that you will go for them and then cheat on them or ditch them for the opposite gender. For some misguided reason many associate bisexuality with unfaithfulness and promiscuity, so it brings its own host of problems.

    3. The stigma in the gay community is much more justified however, and it has to do with the fact that MOST "bi" guys end up being gay. It feels like a safety net for boys in the process of coming out, and it pisses everyone off big time. So when someone tells us they're bi, what we hear is "I'm a closeted homo, and not ok with myself". Which, I'm sure you can see how that would not be very attractive for us.


    In the end, you might be bisexual, you might be gay, heck - you might even be straight and a Kinsey 2 (that is, with some real interest in your own gender, which is perfectly fine). None of what I just said is a criticism or an attempt at labeling you. It's just things to think about. But I do suggest thinking hard about being gay. Even if you are not, you will find that dealing with internalized homophobia is essential to figuring out who you are when you aren't certain.
    Last edited by Rolyo85; November 16th, 2012 at 11:03 PM.
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  5. #5

    Re: Bi or gay?

    Thank you for the insight. It's weird, I like watching gay pornography but I rarely feel attracted to men offline. But I like watching straight pornography also, but I feel different watching it than I do gay pornography. With gay pornography, everything is fast and I don't think much about it, but with straight pornography, it takes longer to climax, but I feel more satisfied physically. I kind of thought that meant I leaned more towards the gay side, but I always felt more satisfied.

    I get insecure a lot of times because sometimes people would ask me in the past if I am gay, and it still doesn't feel right saying that even at this point. I always see myself as a masculine person, and I kind of would like to emphasize my masculinity,but I always find people asking me if I am gay due to a "vibe" as being weird, since I never felt that whether I am masculine or feminine was directly connected to my orientation. I have been getting the "Are you gay?' Sporadically since eighth grade.

  6. #6

    Re: Bi or gay?

    Hmm, sounds like bisexuality or heterosexuality leaning towards bisexuality. Especially if you say you feel more satisfied physically with heterosexual porn.

    And, a lot of people get asked if they're gay. That doesn't mean anything. Most people connect certain characteristics or traits with sexual orientation, which can be very stupid, depending on the situation.

  7. #7
    Execuvette Rolyo85's Avatar
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    Re: Bi or gay?

    Quote Originally Posted by bwelleu2191 View Post
    Thank you for the insight. It's weird, I like watching gay pornography but I rarely feel attracted to men offline. But I like watching straight pornography also, but I feel different watching it than I do gay pornography. With gay pornography, everything is fast and I don't think much about it, but with straight pornography, it takes longer to climax, but I feel more satisfied physically. I kind of thought that meant I leaned more towards the gay side, but I always felt more satisfied.

    I get insecure a lot of times because sometimes people would ask me in the past if I am gay, and it still doesn't feel right saying that even at this point. I always see myself as a masculine person, and I kind of would like to emphasize my masculinity,but I always find people asking me if I am gay due to a "vibe" as being weird, since I never felt that whether I am masculine or feminine was directly connected to my orientation. I have been getting the "Are you gay?' Sporadically since eighth grade.
    Well, a lot of people on here will be quick to tell you you're not gay. Me, I'm of the opposite persuasion. I see signs and I interpret them by leaning to the gay side. You should have that in mind when you read my opinions. I rarely believe that people are really "confused". To me, that's usually a defensive reaction of denial of same-sex attraction, more than actual confusion.

    Sex and attraction come from the head, but also from the body. If I were to give you the "you're gay speech", I would say that you "rarely feel attracted to men offline" because your upbringing and church have brainwashed you into never allowing yourself to think in romantic terms about real people (as we know, stuff seen online is not "real", I had the same thing growing up). Then I'd say that the fact you get "satisfied" quicker with gay pornography is due to your body knowing what it wants, while the "more satisfied physically" from the straight porn is your brain telling you "good boy, you did well and reaffirmed your heterosexuality! Crisis averted!" I would also point out that internalized homophobia often manifests in attempts to be more "masculine", as if not being masculine is somehow a problem. I'd say you are afraid of being thought of as gay, and so you are afraid of THINKING of yourself as gay, therefore using your subconscious mind - this wonderful tool of self-deception - to give you false signals and turn you away from the trail.


    Notice, I am NOT saying all of that. It is a way to interpret things though, and perfectly valid. It might be true for you, or it might be that - as others have said on here - you're just straight... ish, and curious. But to me that's a simple explanation that lacks detail and depth. Not making it invalid, mind you, but I'd delve deeper and look for context and reasons.
    That we are capable only of being what we are, remains our unforgivable sin.
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  8. #8

    Re: Bi or gay?

    Quote Originally Posted by bwelleu2191 View Post
    I just wish I had the chance to figure things out in a safe, understanding environment without either my mother throwing God's disdain in my face or everyone else telling me I am Gay and just not fully out yet.
    ^

    I hope you can find that.

    And, really, don't worry so much about labels, man, maybe you're just not ready yet. No big deal.

  9. #9
    A Total Bottom mbamike's Avatar
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    Re: Bi or gay?

    Sounds like you should do some experimenting to figure thing out for real rather than just guessing.

    Hook up with some girls and with some guys to learn which you enjoy the most.

    Also, move out of your parents' house as soon as possible. They will just confuse you more and pressure you to be something of which they approve.

  10. #10

    Re: Bi or gay?

    Maybe I'm in no position to talk, or maybe I am...
    Let me put this bluntly, I think you're gay.
    I subscribe to everything ROLYO85 said in his first post, and I can add my own "experience".

    While I was in the closet, I always felt I could only fall in love with women, but wanted sex with men.
    I too could - if it were hot scenes- get off on straight porn.

    For me, these are not criteria to determine that you are Bi.
    At least not for me. I think you can find the hounest answer deep inside yourself.
    For me, if I was really hounest, I knew I was gay, and could explain why I thought I could only fall in love with women (upbringing, religion, media, fear, not allowing anything else)

    I think for a lot of gay guys, it takes getting out of the closet first, to then be able to fall in love with a man.
    At least, that's how I am feeling things now. I'm out for almost a year, and slowly, I start imagining falling in love with a guy, living together, meeting my family and, of course, having great sex with him.

    Good luck to you!

  11. #11
    I'm now a grandfather! JUB Moderator Seasoned's Avatar
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    Re: Bi or gay?

    As someone who was married to a woman and has two children and who is gay I know something about the internal resistance to coming out and I also know that I was gay from birth no matter what I was doing sexually. The thing is to not over think this and allow your thoughts to catch up to your feelings. The other thing to remember is that we all have an orientation regardless of whether or not we have sex. I'd never advise using people like candy in a box of chocolates to determine which you like.

    While one would never have to commit to an orientation if one wasn't so inclined, orientation identification does help with a sense of belonging and fitting in. I think the key is to allow your feelings to lead you to acceptance.
    "Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."--Dr. Seuss

  12. #12
    The Thoughtful One gameboy 11's Avatar
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    Re: Bi or gay?

    Hmm. Well first off there is a such thing as bisexual guys. Don't let anyone tell you different. Secondly, you sound a bit bicurious but leaning more towards women. I guess since you haven't had a sexual experience with anyone I would leave it at that. Lastly, I wanted to say just because you're masculine doesn't give anyone the inability to be gay. There are gay masculine men and feminine straight men. This world is a lot more complicated than it may seem through your eyes.

  13. #13
    The Thoughtful One gameboy 11's Avatar
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    Re: Bi or gay?

    I also think Rolyo85 has been making good posts but I do disagree with him slightly -- if someone is bisexual they are bisexual. End of story. Some bisexuals have no preference and would be fine with either a girl or boy in their life and some of them have a preference either for male or female. But if a male is into men and women but prefers men it DOESN'T make him gay, it just means when given a choice between men or women he will more often pick the guy. It doesn't automatically null the attraction to women.

  14. #14
    Execuvette Rolyo85's Avatar
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    Never said it nulls anything. But I have met VERY few gay guys who couldn't have sex with a girl or didn't earlier in their life. This is about labeling to me. If anyone who can be attracted to the gender they don't prefer is bi, it would mean that a good 90% of the human population is bi. And while this might give some comfort to those conflicted about their sexuality, to me personally it also makes the term meaningless.
    That we are capable only of being what we are, remains our unforgivable sin.
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    Re: Bi or gay?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rolyo85 View Post
    Never said it nulls anything. But I have met VERY few gay guys who couldn't have sex with a girl or didn't earlier in their life. This is about labeling to me. If anyone who can be attracted to the gender they don't prefer is bi, it would mean that a good 90% of the human population is bi. And while this might give some comfort to those conflicted about their sexuality, to me personally it also makes the term meaningless.
    I'm not sure because for me I've never had sex with a woman and would not consider it. But COULD I? The could vs would thing I guess. But there's no hardon with a woman so how could I have sex unless in the most narrow sense (I do consider sex to be ultimately about penetration). But I guess one could have a fluffer to get hard then do it with a woman?

    So, given that, I am unsure how 90% could be bi.

  16. #16

    Re: Bi or gay?

    Quote Originally Posted by cgymike View Post
    I'm not sure because for me I've never had sex with a woman and would not consider it. But COULD I? The could vs would thing I guess. But there's no hardon with a woman so how could I have sex unless in the most narrow sense (I do consider sex to be ultimately about penetration). But I guess one could have a fluffer to get hard then do it with a woman?

    So, given that, I am unsure how 90% could be bi.
    This made me chuckle

    At the peril of going kind of on topic.
    This is something I don't get either, how a gay man can have sex/be married to a woman. Must be really hard (no pun intended) and one should need a lot of closed eyes and fantasy, right?
    If anyone wants to answer this question, I am genuinly intrigued...

  17. #17
    Execuvette Rolyo85's Avatar
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    Re: Bi or gay?

    The spectrum of sexuality is fluid. For MANY men - gay or straight - sex is much more physical than it is emotional or psychological. Their bodies respond mostly to physical stimuli, and those are pretty similar with both genders. And in the end - friction is friction. For those of us who need other things to get aroused, it seems weird and impossible, but we are far fewer than the other kind.
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    Re: Bi or gay?

    Back to the topic and the OP. He is confused and asked for help and it will be up to him to accept his sexual orientation. The best we can do is state our experience. Theories abound. What came up in the last few replies is actually a topic that belongs in hot topics. If its not about the OP let it alone, please.
    "Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."--Dr. Seuss

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    JUB Addict MindBlast's Avatar
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    Re: Bi or gay?

    I've seen this before in friends (gay and bi guys). And yes men can be bisexual. However, IF YOU CAN HAVE SEX WITH A PERSON, YOU'RE CAPABLE OF MAKING AN EMOTIONAL CONNECTION.

    There, it had to be said. Just because you're capable of it doesn't mean it will happen, but you should be open to the fact that it's possible for you to fall for another guy, as long as you let go of the internal homophobia that was drilled into your head by your parents and the church.

  20. #20
    of the 99%
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    Re: Bi or gay?

    I believe if you continue to explore your sexuality with men, your positions on attractions will evolve. Most of your experiences have been negative with your mom abusing you with your religious faith. Also, pornography is not a healthy expression of what you like or can feel with men. Of course your feelings towards men are more physical if all you're doing is jerking off to them behind a computer screen.
    #439th oldest member on JUB.

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    Re: Bi or gay?

    Quote Originally Posted by bwelleu2191 View Post
    Hi, I'm new here.

    Basically, I like watching both gay and straight porn, but I don't feel romantically or emotionally connected to men, just women. I felt fine with "labeling: myself as bisexual, but I always hear people say that only women can be bisexual. I really don't know what to do or say at this point. I've never been in a relationship, but I did tell my friends a few years ago that I leaned both ways, and they were supportive and didn't treat me any different. I like women's breasts and I really enjoy straight porn and I have no problem with vagina, but I feel like when I was younger, it was drilled into my head that you can only go one way. My sexuality is basically non-existent off the internet.

    I told my mother I was bisexual four years ago, and the very next day I was embarrassed in church. Now that I am a little older, I see now that I can make my own choices as far as religion goes, but I never got the chance to rationally explore or figure myself out due to my parent's intolerance, despite the fact that I told them. I just wish I had the chance to figure things out in a safe, understanding environment without either my mother throwing God's disdain in my face or everyone else telling me I am Gay and just not fully out yet.
    I think you should watch a gay coming out movie like Get Real, Beautiful Thing or Summer Storm and see how you feel about it. I know that's a weird suggestion but it is really eye-opening to see on screen regular guys falling for each other and being together. I started off liking both straight and gay porn but I mostly watch gay now and I lean way more towards just guys now. It might not be the case with you but you should try whatever feels right when the time comes. You don't have to work out which label you fall under.

  22. #22
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    Re: Bi or gay?

    I label myself as bi-sexual but I'd put myself more into the gay side, I like women but I prefer men when it comes to the sex.
    But I guess no one has really a 50% attraction for guys and 50% for girls. You just prefer women over man Op, but if you have sexual attraction for men too, it means you're bi.

    And ''straight but curious'' stuff seems like bs to me, just my opinion.

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