A song of ice and fire: HBO's Game of Thrones

[Corny]

Warning .. possible spoilers in this thread. Only read up if you have seen all aired episodes to date!


Add spoiler tags to any post that reveals or speculates about content that hasn't been shown on tv yet!

Anybody as excited about it as me? I am a huge fan of the books and have high hopes for the HBO series.

A first longer trailer is out now:

http://www.hbo.com/game-of-thrones/i...4kFdg0zRcJHTWM



A somewhat shorter one on youtube:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ixEWrTLiZg[/ame]


So far I like all the characters - however Drogo looks kinda awful

But let's wait for April ..

[zoltanspawn]

I'm gonna be all over it. There's even been talk of a nerd party for the premier. And the long trailer looks fantastic.

I have two problems, though. 1) I won't pay for HBO and 2) I've lost *all* faith in Mr. Martin by this point. The latter diminishes my hopes that the series can possibly realize itself, unless there're some wildly talented writers tucked in the production's pocket. I'm not optimistic on that count, though.

[Fire]

Just like A Dance with Dragons, I've been alternately getting super excited and then trying to forget about this entirely since it was some time until it would be finished, and also so I wouldn't be too disappointed if it wasn't good.

Now that it's nearly here I can hardly contain myself

P.S. Ice looks badass in that trailer.

[zoltanspawn]

George says ADWD will be on bookstore shelves July 12. He says it's true.

I believe him.

I hope his publisher gave him a thorough edit after the last, long, wandering, long and wandering novel.

And I'm still a tad grouchy about the wait.

But the series began sooooooo well it's hard to be truly indifferent!

[hylas]

so, the books (and perheps the series) are worth checking out? i have to admit im not well versed at all in fantasy literature, but ive been meaning to get into it, because i really like sword & sorcery. so far ive only read lotr and 'his dark matters'. my understanding is this is a little more 'gritty', which is fine by me.

without spoilering, are there strong female characters and perhaps gay themes? i always enjoy these.

that one guy looks totally doable... wiki tells me his name is Nikolaj Coster-Waldau, and his character is Ser Jaime Lannister.

[Corny]

P.S. Ice looks badass in that trailer.

I love that they didn't make it too fancy.

so, the books (and perheps the series) are worth checking out? i have to admit im not well versed at all in fantasy literature, but ive been meaning to get into it, because i really like sword & sorcery. so far ive only read lotr and 'his dark matters'. my understanding is this is a little more 'gritty', which is fine by me.

definitely. It is not that much sorcery, much sword though. But even more intrigue and schemes

without spoilering, are there strong female characters and perhaps gay themes? i always enjoy these.

there are different types of "strong characters", but yeah there are strong female characters in most senses of the word there are no obvious gay themes except a few people who are described to love men or boys, but there are some subtle hints that portray a gay couple in important position.

that one guy looks totally doable... wiki tells me his name is Nikolaj Coster-Waldau, and his character is Ser Jaime Lannister.

sadly his character is an asshole

[zoltanspawn]

so, the books (and perheps the series) are worth checking out? i have to admit im not well versed at all in fantasy literature, but ive been meaning to get into it, because i really like sword & sorcery. so far ive only read lotr and 'his dark matters'. my understanding is this is a little more 'gritty', which is fine by me.

without spoilering, are there strong female characters and perhaps gay themes? i always enjoy these.

that one guy looks totally doable... wiki tells me his name is Nikolaj Coster-Waldau, and his character is Ser Jaime Lannister.

I would add the caveat that the fourth book received a very mixed reception by many readers, myself included. After enjoying 2,435 pages to get to it there is no doubt you will read it. But if the fifth book is bad too, it will be hard to recommend the series to everyone.

Also bear in mind that at the current pace, the novels will finish being written in 2023.

[Fire]

I love that they didn't make it too fancy.

Yeah, there is a website selling "replicas" of the sword, and their version is a bit silly...

I would add the caveat that the fourth book received a very mixed reception by many readers, myself included.

Yes, to me A Feast For Crows is not quite canon. And since A Storm of Swords came out in 2000?, it will have been eleven years since we found out anything new about (most of) the good characters. This has been a big reason for my ambivalence, as I don't see this series getting finished before GRRM has a heart attack and dies.

None of this would be such an issue if the first three books weren't so good, but they were, and there is little if nothing else out there similar to this series. Nearly every "great" fantasy book I hear about turns out to be poorly written, boring/predictable, full of ridiculous amounts of magic, terrible names, etc.

[AbnormalDann]

I need to read the rest of the series, as I recently finished "A Game of Thrones." Ambivalent about the HBO adaptation, but I'm willing to check it out.

[Corny]

None of this would be such an issue if the first three books weren't so good, .

whether it is frank herbert, tad williams or robert jordan .. this seems to be the fate of all of them ..

[Harke the Boeotarch]

I feel bad about this, Corny.

Scifi/Fantasy Miniseries tend to go very badly wrong. Examples: Riverworld, Legend of Earthsea (or so I've heard), Dune (arguably).

George says ADWD will be on bookstore shelves July 12. He says it's true.

I believe him.

I hope his publisher gave him a thorough edit after the last, long, wandering, long and wandering novel.

And I'm still a tad grouchy about the wait.

But the series began sooooooo well it's hard to be truly indifferent!

I think the three books I've read of the series already betray a wandering of the author's attention.

so, the books (and perheps the series) are worth checking out? i have to admit im not well versed at all in fantasy literature, but ive been meaning to get into it, because i really like sword & sorcery. so far ive only read lotr and 'his dark matters'. my understanding is this is a little more 'gritty', which is fine by me.

Without having read His Dark Materials (I did see the not-so-good movie), I think the work is probably a deconstruction of the theology of Christian writings such as Lord of the Rings, while The Song of Ice and Fire Trilogy deviates from LOTR in having black and grey morality in its earthly characters rather than black and white.

without spoilering, are there strong female characters and perhaps gay themes? i always enjoy these.

Since the series deconstructs the virtues of chivalry and throws them completely out of the window, you can expect a lot of scheming women and weaklings. Homosexuality does exist in the SoIaF universe, but exists almost exclusively to make the setting a little more colourful.
(If you're looking for that try Tanith Lee or Clive Barker).

I love that they didn't make it too fancy.

IMHO for once a somewhat unrealisticly looking sword would have been justified (given the exotic magical material that the sword is supposed to be made from). It still doesn't look bad in the trailer.

definitely. It is not that much sorcery, much sword though. But even more intrigue and schemes

An important theme in the setting at the beginning of the story, is that although magic exists, it has subsided/ been forced so much into the background, that at the beginning of the story the reader wonders if it exists at all.

that one guy looks totally doable... wiki tells me his name is Nikolaj Coster-Waldau, and his character is Ser Jaime Lannister.

sadly his character is an asshole

Spoiler: (Highlight this box to see the hidden message.)

He had very understandable reasons for doing what he did to one of the main characters in the first book, and he is mainly reviled by the people for breaking his knightly oath to his former king and killing him even though said king was so insane he probably would have torched half the city and his subjects in it just to get at his enemies.

None of this would be such an issue if the first three books weren't so good, but they were, and there is little if nothing else out there similar to this series. Nearly every "great" fantasy book I hear about turns out to be poorly written, boring/predictable, full of ridiculous amounts of magic, terrible names, etc.

I know a few great ones if you're interested...
I do grant you even good Fantasy authors tend to write scores of bad novels for every good one.

whether it is frank herbert, tad williams or robert jordan .. this seems to be the fate of all of them ..

A good writer knows where to stop.

It would be very refreshing to read a new Fantasy book that doesn't expand into a trilogy for a change.

[hylas]

Homosexuality does exist in the SoIaF universe, but exists almost exclusively to make the setting a little more colourful.

that actually sounds pretty good, too. not making an issue of it, just having it as 'a thing that exists', just like in real life. (if thats what youre saying.)

but dude, mark your spoilers!

[hylas]

ot: 'his dark materials' is clearly written for teenagers. it has very prominent philosophical concerns (as opposed to being mainly about escapism). its a good read, although theres a lot i would critisize - its very reactive (its defining characteristic is that its against certain things), and as the trilogy goes on, the story takes some baffling turns. and yes, the movie was pretty much botched despite its stellar cast.

[Harke the Boeotarch]

that actually sounds pretty good, too. not making an issue of it, just having it as 'a thing that exists', just like in real life. (if thats what youre saying.)

In my 'real life', it's homosexuality that is the mainstay of my life and heterosexuality that's the exotic ornament.

(If you're interested in Fantasy that is written from a homosexual perspective I can recommend anything by Clive Barker. Here the homosexuality is not tacked onto an otherwise very heterosexual story.)

Having said this, the treatment of sexuality is far more extensive than is usually the case in fantasy. Prostitution and rape are extensively described, and the sexual relationships between the characters are also described in this way.

but dude, mark your spoilers!

Nothing I've disclosed goes beyond the introduction of the characters in the first few pages of the first book.
The back of the paperback reveals a lot more.

[Fire]

whether it is frank herbert, tad williams or robert jordan .. this seems to be the fate of all of them ..

Yeah, it does seem like it will be that way with GRRM too, especially since he's so overweight.

It would be very refreshing to read a new Fantasy book that doesn't expand into a trilogy for a change.

Or worse, a "Cycle"

I know a few great ones if you're interested...
I do grant you even good Fantasy authors tend to write scores of bad novels for every good one.

I am interested, actually. Even with as many terrible fantasy books as I've read, I still haven't given up hope of finding something decent.

[Corny]

IMHO for once a somewhat unrealisticly looking sword would have been justified (given the exotic magical material that the sword is supposed to be made from).

afaik valyrian steel in the book is (physically) only described to be very sharp, hard but light at the same time. there is nothing about a "spectacular" look or similar.
kinda if you compare a paul binns blade to some other crap replica that you can buy at a medieval fare

[zoltanspawn]

without spoilering, are there strong female characters and perhaps gay themes? i always enjoy these.

Richard Morgan's The Steel Remains might be worth mentioning here. It's neither a great book nor his best (see Altered Carbon) but the premise is welcome.

The tone is gritty like asofai. There's more magic. And the main character is a pulp-style barbarian ala Conan only he's gay.

[-Callum-]

I didn't really like the first book, but I'm more of a sorcery guy than a sword. I'd definitely be picking up the tomes/textbooks in a fantasy world, not the armor. But anyway...I'm not sure he will ever finish the series. At his current pace and with his health, I don't think anyone can be certain of its completion.

[Harke the Boeotarch]

Or worse, a "Cycle"

Speculative fiction authors -it seems- can't finish plots at the end of their books anymore.

I am interested, actually. Even with as many terrible fantasy books as I've read, I still haven't given up hope of finding something decent.

You should try the golden oldies.

afaik valyrian steel in the book is (physically) only described to be very sharp, hard but light at the same time. there is nothing about a "spectacular" look or similar.
kinda if you compare a paul binns blade to some other crap replica that you can buy at a medieval fare

Rare weapons tend to be rare looking.

I didn't really like the first book, but I'm more of a sorcery guy than a sword. I'd definitely be picking up the tomes/textbooks in a fantasy world, not the armor. But anyway...I'm not sure he will ever finish the series. At his current pace and with his health, I don't think anyone can be certain of its completion.

Magic exists in Westeros, but it comes at a very high price and is considered a horrific practice even by people who spend their whole lives pillaging, murdering and raping.

Spoiler: (Highlight this box to see the hidden message.)

As the series progresses the daughter of the King murdered before the story starts finds a way to bring the magic back and uses this to organize a military expedition to win her empire back. At the same time a fire priestess uses human sacrifice to overpower Westeros, and the only real reason she had for that is to battle the necromantic elves that live beyond the hopelessly understaffed 'Hadrian's Wall'-like structure at the boundary of the nation. There's also alchemy in Westeros, but it doesn't work too well because it's largely dependent on magic.

[Corny]

Rare weapons tend to be rare looking.

But it is wielded by the Starks. Even their stronghold is plain looking. They are very often described as not caring or wearing much jewelery, ornaments or other accessories.

The ornaments of the other named weapons in the book are described in great details - so it is safe to assume that "ice" is rather simple.

[Harke the Boeotarch]

But it is wielded by the Starks. Even their stronghold is plain looking. They are very often described as not caring or wearing much jewelery, ornaments or other accessories.

The ornaments of the other named weapons in the book are described in great details - so it is safe to assume that "ice" is rather simple.

That's because they're supposed to be 'good' people.

Spoiler: (Highlight this box to see the hidden message.)

As the story progresses, their 'goodness' looks more and more like unjustified naïvité, given that just about every other member of every other noble family is so vile and/or devious, that it can never be explained why such people should have held such a castle in the first place, even given that their power comes from their actions in Winter. For instance their liegemen, the Boltons, traditionally wear the flayed skins of their vanquished enemies as clothing.

[Fire]

You should try the golden oldies.

Examples, please.

Spoiler: (Highlight this box to see the hidden message.)

As the story progresses, their 'goodness' looks more and more like unjustified naïvité

Spoiler: (Highlight this box to see the hidden message.)

Yeah, I believe we were intended to feel that way, or at least, to seriously consider this possibility. That said, I always thought of that naïvité as Eddard's personal failing, his tragic flaw, rather than that of the House itself. As for how they held Winterfell, I suppose they had the weight of tradition (they built the place, after all), force of arms, and the fealty of at least some loyal lords who bought into the whole honor thing as well. But I think you're right: if Ned's absurdly inflexible code of honor were the salient feature of his House through the ages (I don't recall whether or not this was mentioned in the series, so that may be), I too find it hard to imagine how they remained in power.

[Corny]

Spoiler: (Highlight this box to see the hidden message.)

That said, I always thought of that naïvité as Eddard's personal failing, his tragic flaw, rather than that of the House itself.

this.

Spoiler: (Highlight this box to see the hidden message.)

if Ned's absurdly inflexible code of honor were the salient feature of his House through the ages (I don't recall whether or not this was mentioned in the series, so that may be), I too find it hard to imagine how they remained in power.

there are quite a few of old nan's tales about the stark ancestors that tell a different story.

Spoiler: (Highlight this box to see the hidden message.)

at the end of CoK when the two bran and rickon hide in the tomb while winterfell is burning it is also mentioned how fearful and brutal some of the ancestors were

[Harke the Boeotarch]

Examples, please.

Tales of the Dying Earth - Jack Vance (Omnibus)
Tales from the Flat Earth - Tanith Lee (5 books so far, but each book has a theme of its own)
The Last Unicorn - Peter S. Beagle
Earthsea Trilogy - Ursula LeGuin

there are quite a few of old nan's tales about the stark ancestors that tell a different story.

Spoiler: (Highlight this box to see the hidden message.)

at the end of CoK when the two bran and rickon hide in the tomb while winterfell is burning it is also mentioned how fearful and brutal some of the ancestors were

I always thought that the difference between the people up North and the people down South was that

Spoiler: (Highlight this box to see the hidden message.)

the people from the North basically lived to protect the nation from the Others and because of this had less time for infighting of this kind

[Fire]

Tales of the Dying Earth - Jack Vance (Omnibus)
Tales from the Flat Earth - Tanith Lee (5 books so far, but each book has a theme of its own)
The Last Unicorn - Peter S. Beagle
Earthsea Trilogy - Ursula LeGuin

Thanks Harke, I'll be heading to the library tomorrow to pick up a couple of these.

[Corny]

you can watch the first 14min online now:

http://www.hbo.com/game-of-thrones/i...B2kgv+AJpTLsU=

(if that long-ass link doesn't work: go to http://www.hbo.com/game-of-thrones/index.html and click on "video" on the top )

[Pianist]

I've read the books... and at this point in time, I don't much care anymore.

I was intrigued by the Others and the Northern menace beyond the Wall but I soon got tired of the endless politicking and intrigue. I can read real history for that. Too much sword and not enough sorcery for my tastes I'm afraid.

As such, I won't be watching.

For lots of epic fantasy fun and a large ensemble cast of characters, I recommend the Malazan Book of the Fallen series by Steven Erickson.

[zoltanspawn]

Well, what'd you cats think of the premier?

I'm giving it full geek endorsement. I expected condensed storylines and missing chapters. But it was impressively faithful. Good for HBO.

I have a quibble here and there (Tyrion's casting for instance, sheesh) but nothing that isn't negligible before the generally excellent accomplishment. I'm looking forward to more.

Kat is awesome, the violence is fun, dire wolves, Arya, Joffrey, intrigue, foreboding. It's all very promising. I'm going to try and find a way to watch it next week, too.

[aijalon18]

Just curious, is there anything gay about it?

[zoltanspawn]

No, not really.

[ColorSlaughter]

Well, what'd you cats think of the premier?

I'm giving it full geek endorsement. I expected condensed storylines and missing chapters. But it was impressively faithful. Good for HBO.

I have a quibble here and there (Tyrion's casting for instance, sheesh) but nothing that isn't negligible before the generally excellent accomplishment. I'm looking forward to more.

Kat is awesome, the violence is fun, dire wolves, Arya, Joffrey, intrigue, foreboding. It's all very promising. I'm going to try and find a way to watch it next week, too.

I enjoyed it, despite not reading the books (though I'm reading them now!). Though I wasn't fond of the general crude-ness of the show, but it was still a fun watch. Watched in on an HD projector with surround sound was quite a treat!

[Sgt Pepper]

Jason Momoa is HOT in it. That is all.

[joesman]

I did not read the books but found the first airing incredibly entertaining, thrilling.

[thatgirl]

Jason Momoa is HOT in it. That is all.

LOL. This is one of the main reasons I've been looking forward to it.

I just haven't had time yet to check it out but I'll make time for Jason Momoa.

[thatgirl]

Okay, I watched the premiere last night.

Some elements of the show made me kind give it the side-eye and I'm glad I'm not the only one who's noticed this:

Can I Just Watch A Game of Thrones in Peace? [Brown Feminist Fan Rant]
Does HBO's "Game of Thrones" have a race problem?
'Game of Thrones': Feminist or not?

Overall, it was pretty good. Kind of slow but I'm sure once they set up the storylines it'll become interesting.

Oh and is equal opportunity nudity too much to ask for? Balance, please.

It's weird that HBO already renewed it for 2nd season tho. Must be some epic shit.

[kbas9000]

Jason Momoa gets butt naked in Game of Thrones
http://www.justusboys.com/forum/show...=1#post7073169

[Corny]

finally i got to watch the first two episodes.

so far I really like it, especially most of the cast. however .. i don't really like drogo jason momoa is all good and hot. but totally not how i pictured him. also cat (lady stark) is rather weak. she seems so rough yet fragile .. and always pictured her as much "nobler", yet a very strong personality. not sure if i will like jon snow yet, but the other stark siblings are great! and peter dinklage (tyrion) is dead on. really looking forward to see him shine.

Okay, I watched the premiere last night.

Some elements of the show made me kind give it the side-eye and I'm glad I'm not the only one who's noticed this:

Can I Just Watch A Game of Thrones in Peace? [Brown Feminist Fan Rant]
Does HBO's "Game of Thrones" have a race problem?
'Game of Thrones': Feminist or not?

Overall, it was pretty good. Kind of slow but I'm sure once they set up the storylines it'll become interesting.

please continue watching and if you like, slowly start to read the books as well. this criticism is absolutely baseless. this is a fantasy story with incredibly strong (and important) female characters. you might already have seen a hint if you paid close attention to the queen and arya. the "race problem" is a race problem of the viewer because he/she projects his racial stereotypes into a fantasy world that is oriented on medieval times. the drokthari are "wild brown savages" from our point of view and from the little bit of impressions and a "culture shock" that we have seen being thrown at the targaryens. the show of course compresses a lot of things, but i hope that they will show more of those proud people's culture later on.

[Harke the Boeotarch]

I'm halfway through reading A Feast For Crows now.

Sadly I missed episode 1 and 2.

[joesman]

If there is a word to describe the tv series it is RIVETING!

[tyrion09]

The book series is one of my favorites ever, and I'm greatly enjoying the HBO adaptation for the most part. My only major gripe is all the Dothraki stuff, which has sadly come across so far as cheap cliched fantasy nonsense. I keep waiting for Xena to show up.

Other than that side of things, I'm loving it!

[NineOfClubs]

Never even heard of the books.

I've been watching the series and liking it.

[zoltanspawn]

I've watched the second and third installments now and I'm more impressed than ever. My initial judgment of Peter Dinklage as a bouffant pedestal has been razed by the actor's ability; he's great.

I've chatted with a few who haven't read the books and it's enormous fun listening to their theories about what is to come.

[Dream Is Collapsing]

Awesome series. Love the books. And yeah, there are some definite gays in the books. And you're all going to be quite happy with a scene coming up soon (not sure which episode yet) between Renly and Loras. They are erm... "praying" together.

While Renly looks nothing like how he's described in the books, I'm okay with it, because the guy playing him is super fucking hot. So excited his character is gay and we'll get to see certain proof of it.

[Ohiospeedo]

^^^ - I am reading the books now, and almost done with the 2nd book. I don't recall any chapters of them "praying" together.

Loving the book series and the show. I think that hottest one of the show is Jon Snow.

[Corny]

^ this isn't directly in the book but it's in the subtext

[oakpope]

I am a super fan of the books and the series so far does a great job in my opinion. Love Tyrion in the book, love the actor in the serie. Love to hate Cersai, Jaime and Goeffroy. Can't wait to see the Knight of the Rose

[Corny]

^ yeah where the heck was he? shouldn't he appear at the tournament?

[Corny]

well there he was. and the - in the books - subtle gay vibe between him and renly was made very obvious

also a nice full frontal nude scene with theon greyjoy (yumm!) and a lot of fighting






(huge)
http://i.imgur.com/ioGpy.jpg






(huge)
http://premium1.uploadit.org/ggreenw//Alfie4.jpg
http://premium1.uploadit.org/ggreenw//Alfie9.jpg

[Ohiospeedo]

Winter is coming!

I just finished the 3rd book, and I have to say Damn! To me though it seems like all the books could be one long book. There isn't any conclusions or big cliff hangers. I am glad that I didn't start reading the books in the beginning. I couldn't imagine having to wait more than 5 years for the next book to come out. I have a feeling that I am going to be disappointed when I finish the 4th book. But at least I only have to wait until July for the next book.

[Ivabigun227]

And yes, there's Gay scenes - simulated oral sex in these pics.....