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Thread: Glee! [merged]

  1. #251

    Re: Glee! [merged]

    they've indicated several times in fact that Kurt had the hots for Finn. They just made it more obvious on that episode.

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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    No i know they hinted that he might have a thing for Finn a few times. But last night it was all of a sudden this full on obsession where he's manipulating his relationship and trying to convert him. It was so stupid and not even interesting. It was just so uncomfortable to watch and I usually love a gay scene. Why not make him interested in Puck or other Asian?

  3. #253
    blacksyringe
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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    ^ I'm not entirely sure that Finn's sexuality is concrete in the series. There really isn't any overwhelming evidence indicating he is a total heterosexual. So, anything can happen. This is a show where one has to suspend their disbelief.

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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    ^I'm sorry but that is ridiculous. It is clear that Finn is hetero. The only people who it is unclear about is the guy in the wheelchair, the black guy, the Asian guy, and maybe Puck. I only include Puck is because he could so be one of those hypermasculine closet cases that overcompensates.

  5. #255
    blacksyringe
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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    ...and you know that, how?

  6. #256
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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    Artie has a thing for Tina, so I don't believe he's gay. I don't think the show is trying to hide anyone's sexuality. From the get-go Kurt was shown as being gay.

    Kurt has always been shown as being perceived as gay, even though he never told anyone for a while. The directors would most likely have given hints by now if anyone else was gay.

    I think any other gay characters, especially love interests for Kurt, will be people we've seen but don't know much about or new characters.

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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    I was starting to worry about the show after the first few episodes, but these last two especially have been so damned good. It's weird to say this, but when I watch this show it feels like someone's given me a gift.

  8. #258

    Re: Glee! [merged]

    I think it would be really great to see what happens when Finn (who is so dumb) realizes that Kurt is in love with him!!!!

  9. #259
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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    Quote Originally Posted by knobby View Post
    I think it would be really great to see what happens when Finn (who is so dumb) realizes that Kurt is in love with him!!!!
    The whole tie scene when he finds his dad's old suit is cute but come on!

  10. #260

    Re: Glee! [merged]

    Quote Originally Posted by aijalon18 View Post
    ^I'm sorry but that is ridiculous. It is clear that Finn is hetero. The only people who it is unclear about is the guy in the wheelchair, the black guy, the Asian guy, and maybe Puck. I only include Puck is because he could so be one of those hypermasculine closet cases that overcompensates.
    I tend to agree. I think it's been made pretty clear that Finn is straight. Even his internal monologue is all about girls. But you never know, it's television after all. Things could change.

    One thing about the episode, a lot of people have chastized Mercedes for telling Puck to back off. I don't think she's the kind of person to willingly support blatantly lying to Finn. I get the feeling she hasn't considered Finn's position in all of this at all. All she sees is Puck trying to break up the happy home that is Finn & Quinn (and Drizzle). If she saw how things really are she'd probably be the first person to tell Finn the truth.

    I'll be curious to see what happens with Quinn once the cat's out of the bag. I can kinda see Finn going back to her for the sake of the baby but I can also see him seeing it as his ticket to freedom.

  11. #261

    Re: Glee! [merged]

    Did anyone notice that Finn said that they didn't even have sex while at the dinner table with Quinns parents. It sure will be interesting when that info comes out.

  12. #262
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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    Quote Originally Posted by knobby View Post
    I think it would be really great to see what happens when Finn (who is so dumb) realizes that Kurt is in love with him!!!!
    Poor Finn, dumb as a box of nails but so adorable and cute you just have to love him.
    The love Kurt has for him is gonna confuse the Hell out of the poor baby. I mean Kurt will be able to convince him of just about anything. After all, he still does not know how babies are made. By the way, when Finn told his pregnant gf's parents hey had not had sex no one flinched or said huh?

    I am still chocked up after seeing Sue visit her sister, what a magnificent scene.
    Seeing Sue in that light was so heartwarming.
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  13. #263
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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    Quote Originally Posted by sonny10305 View Post
    Poor Finn, dumb as a box of nails but so adorable and cute you just have to love him.
    The love Kurt has for him is gonna confuse the Hell out of the poor baby. I mean Kurt will be able to convince him of just about anything. After all, he still does not know how babies are made. By the way, when Finn told his pregnant gf's parents hey had not had sex no one flinched or said huh?

    I am still chocked up after seeing Sue visit her sister, what a magnificent scene.
    Seeing Sue in that light was so heartwarming.
    Quinn's mom told him to "Stop lying" (Or to stop his lies) when he mentioned they didn't have sex.

    I took it for no one believed him.

  14. #264

    Re: Glee! [merged]

    It started out so so but then went into Emmy mode when the Glee group started to sing with the deaf choir. I almost cried.

    Does Finn know Quinn is giving the baby up? that part is confusing

  15. #265

    Re: Glee! [merged]

    Quote Originally Posted by Digicel View Post
    Does Finn know Quinn is giving the baby up? that part is confusing
    Yeah he does.

    Does anyone think the other clubs will use the set list to cheat?

    Kurt kinda turned into Suzy Pepper with his speech to Rachel about how the object of their desire will never desire them.

    And Terri was actually pretty sane in this ep for a change. She almost has me rooting for them staying together. I was kinda hoping that Quinn would stick around when Will showed Terri the car so she could decide for herself whether he'd make a good dad.

    This is how I think it'll pan out: Finn will find out but be conflicted about whether to stay with Quinn or not. I suspect he wont then he'll be crying into Rachel's shoulder pads. Will will find out, leave Terri but end up back with her to raise their adopted baby.

    And I agree, the Deaf choir was excellent. And Tina getting her first solo

  16. #266

    Glee is offensive

    My favorite show is Glee, but I must say that it can be very offensive at times.

    Reasons:

    1.) The gay guy is as caricatured as Jack from Will and Grace. This is offensive. In the real world of musical theatre and high school drama departments there are not just one but several gay men in the department, and some of them are masculine like Quinn, like Mr. Shue, and the mohican hair cut dude. TV *STILL* is not comfortable in making the gay guys masculine and real.

    2.) The wheel-chair episode had a comment from one of the Cheerios that they were "losers" because they were in the chairs. Very offensive. I would have expected at least one character to have said something to correct her.

    3.) In an episode some time back, Mr. Shue went out of his way to dodge the flaky teacher who was obsessed with Josh Groban. He didn't want him to play in his singing group because he was flaky. This is counter to the "be kind to the underdog" nature of the show. Isn't Shue supposed to be FOR the underdog?

    4.) In last week's episode they made fun of deaf people. The hard of hearing teacher kept misinterpreting what was being said. This was supposed to be funny. No, it was not.

    Still my favorite show, but when it offends it offends deeply.

  17. #267

    Re: Glee is offensive

    Well, I can't say I completely disagree with your observations. For the wheelchair thing, your point 2, sometimes the best way to make a point more sharply is to portray characters or comments that the audience watching knows are any degree of shallow, ignorant or coming from a buffoon. Nobody expects the cheerleading squad (especially as led by Sue Sylvester!) to be worldly, sensitive or emotionally enlightened individuals so that comment just reinforced the ignorance. You laugh at them - like Homer Simpson or that example I always read about with Archie Bunker being a racist and boob that was the butt of the joke because he was so unenlightened. Although, maybe cheerleaders would take issue with how the Cheerios are portrayed.

    I agree that deaf teacher gag fell pretty flat. Movies and TV might do the same thing with someone inflicted with Tourette's who curses spontaneously, or a blind person who spends time stumbling into objects, so I saw that can't-hear-well-therefore-misunderstands-everything more lazy and cliched than anything.

    I find the larger problem with "Glee" is that it can't quite find its tone. See this article for a comment on that too:

    "The producers may consider their show a mash-up but they’ve forgotten how to make their disparate parts gel into a cohesive whole. It could be a matter of too many cooks. Co-creators Ryan Murphy, Ian Brennan and Brad Falchuk take turns writing and seem to have different ideas of how they want Glee to be, tonally. Or maybe the pilot was just too good."

    Originally (according to the "Entertainment Weekly" cover story a while back) the show's tone was much darker and more bitter, a sort of mean-spirited satire. That openly gay character and the other things you mention may fit more into that model, which would be stuff like vicious skewering of "underdogs" or cliche characters or high school popularity contests and that cutthroat social ladder. "Glee" seems to be trying to do some of this along with "cute and cuddly" inspirational musical numbers and "heartwarming" moments. I do like the contrast because you never know where an episode might swing, it's unpredictable, but it can be jarring for sure and throw some viewers.

  18. #268

    Re: Glee is offensive

    I think the show went over your head.

    The stereotypes are purposefully done and it's tongue-in-cheek humor is actually making fun of the stereotypes people make against minorities particularly in Hollywood and the media.

    You never wondered why the Asian-American guy in the Glee Club is called "Other Asian".

    It's making fun of invisibility of Asian men in media.

  19. #269
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    Re: Glee is offensive

    It's over the top and total satire. It depicts men as dumb. The gay kid is fantastically portrayed as someone who can be himself. It deals in "types" and is my favorite show. As far as last week's episode, you forgot to mention the crime laden inner city glee kids.

    PS Cheerleaders don't wear their uniforms all day to class.

  20. #270

    Re: Glee is offensive

    Thanks for the info, Trinket. Good stuff! And Diamond, no, the show has not gone over my head. I get the wit. Remember, it's my favorite show for a reason.

    I just think that I would buy the satire defense more if they portrayed Mr. Shue or Quinn as gay in addition to the caricature. With just the caricature, I don't feel it's satire. It's just offensive.

    As Trinket pointed out, the problem lies with the show not knowing what tone it's to take.

    I'll still watch. I love satire. But sometimes satire can be used as an excuse to degrade and perpetuate stereotypes with impunity.

  21. #271
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    Re: Glee is offensive

    The show is exaggerated to point out the clique-riddled societies that exist in high schools and how glee club brings all of those different people together. It's not supposed to be realistic. If you notice, they make fun of EVERYONE. It's equal opportunity. It can get away with it the same way that South Park does. It doesn't favor anyone.
    Someone asked me once how I could know that I'm gay if I've never slept with a woman. I've never shoved shards of glass into my eye, either, but I don't have to give it a shot to know that it's not for me.

  22. #272
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    Re: Glee is offensive

    Quote Originally Posted by JNewYork View Post
    3.) In an episode some time back, Mr. Shue went out of his way to dodge the flaky teacher who was obsessed with Josh Groban. He didn't want him to play in his singing group because he was flaky. This is counter to the "be kind to the underdog" nature of the show. Isn't Shue supposed to be FOR the underdog?
    I stopped watching it, but still saw that one .. he dodged this guy because he was fired for inappropriately touching a student ..
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    Re: Glee is offensive

    Quote Originally Posted by Corny View Post
    I stopped watching it, but still saw that one .. he dodged this guy because he was fired for inappropriately touching a student ..
    He's also a pot dealer.
    Someone asked me once how I could know that I'm gay if I've never slept with a woman. I've never shoved shards of glass into my eye, either, but I don't have to give it a shot to know that it's not for me.

  24. #274
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    Re: Glee is offensive

    >>>Cheerleaders don't wear their uniforms all day to class.

    They did in my high school.

    Lex

  25. #275

    Re: Glee is offensive

    Quote Originally Posted by JNewYork View Post
    I just think that I would buy the satire defense more if they portrayed Mr. Shue or Quinn as gay in addition to the caricature. With just the caricature, I don't feel it's satire.
    But that's exactly what satire is. The point of satire is to reveal an essential truth through caricature and exaggerated humor. If you flesh something out or make it less caricatured, then it's...not satire.

    I don't think Glee is offensive but I do think it's often unfunny, and that's where it's intended satire fails. Satire is supposed to be witty and humorous and Glee is rarely ever that.

  26. #276

    Re: Glee is offensive

    It seems you might have been a fan of "socialist realism" from the Soviet past: happy dancing maidens bringing in the harvest, happy tractor drivers, happy factory workers praising the glorious achievments of the perfect society, etc. People found this rather boring.

  27. #277

    Re: Glee is offensive

    OP, you fit the stereotypes of gay guys getting offended by every little thing, and it offends me...

    ...yeah, it doesn't really offend me, but geez, I get tired of these guys that have to find every little thing offensive in some way.

  28. #278
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    Re: Glee is offensive

    Besides, raging queen stereotype or not, Kurt is the funniest character on the show.
    Someone asked me once how I could know that I'm gay if I've never slept with a woman. I've never shoved shards of glass into my eye, either, but I don't have to give it a shot to know that it's not for me.

  29. #279

    Re: Glee is offensive

    I just think that it's easy to use satire as an excuse to degrade gay people. If anybody complains, as I have, then they get told that they're just "missing the satire."

    Sorry if I'm being annoying by being offended. I'm just tired of gay men's representation in the media to always be weak, effeminate, girly, flamboyant.

    If we're not being portrayed that way in Will and Grace, we're being portrayed that way as "satire" in Glee.

    Where is the ONE gay man character on TV who is a strong, MASCULINE, well adjusted dude? There isn't one. Not one.

    And to not have ONE character like that on TV is offensive in itself, but when we gays ARE being portrayed, and the portrayal is this over the top girly gay--all under the guise of satire--then it's even more offensive.

    But I know, I can't complain, because it's just "satire."

  30. #280
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    Re: Glee is offensive

    is the characters last name- i represent all gay men on the planet?
    "If you can't do something smart,do something right."-Jayne Cobb

  31. #281
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    Re: Glee is offensive

    I don't find Glee offensive at all, most of them have a message some where it's just YOUR job to find them.

  32. #282
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    Re: Glee is offensive

    Quote Originally Posted by JNewYork View Post
    Where is the ONE gay man character on TV who is a strong, MASCULINE, well adjusted dude? There isn't one. Not one.
    Keith in Six feet under.
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  33. #283

    Re: Glee is offensive

    Quote Originally Posted by MawellEvans View Post
    is the characters last name- i represent all gay men on the planet?
    The implication is there, yes.

    Re: Keith of Six Feet Under. Good example. So there is one after all. Who knows, there may be others. But by far the rule, not the exception, is to portray gay men as weak, effeminate, flamboyant caricatures.

    And it's offensive, whether it's "satire" or not.

  34. #284

    Re: Glee is offensive

    Quote Originally Posted by G-Lexington View Post
    >>>Cheerleaders don't wear their uniforms all day to class.

    They did in my high school.

    Lex

    Hehe They did in my high school, too.

    JNew York, please lighten up a little bit. What you say may be right, but we are dealing with a small group of people here and they just have a "type" of character on display. Like the gay guy. Why not have a gay guy that is not the least bit feminine? Answer, they only come on once a week and have only a few episodes in a season to generate characters. The wheelchair guy is the same thing. As for Shu being for the underdog, even the best of people are still "human" and do stray. It is an hour of fun, lite comedy/drama, and song.

  35. #285

    Re: Glee is offensive

    Good points, Grantt. And great pic under your name. Is that you? Damn. If not, you have good taste.

  36. #286

    Re: Glee is offensive

    Quote Originally Posted by JNewYork View Post
    Where is the ONE gay man character on TV who is a strong, MASCULINE, well adjusted dude? There isn't one. Not one.
    Andrew and Bob on Desperate Housewives.

  37. #287

    Re: Glee is offensive

    It sarcasm...plus shows the stereotypes out there..& even how some people really are...Glee hidden messages..I love this show...

  38. #288
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    Re: Glee is offensive

    Andrew from Desperate Housewives is pretty masculine looking and comfortable with himself. Even if he is an asshole for at least the first two seasons.

    Quote Originally Posted by kinski View Post
    Andrew and Bob on Desperate Housewives.
    Oh damn. Beat me to it.

  39. #289
    blacksyringe
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    Re: Glee is offensive

    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt Pepper View Post
    But that's exactly what satire is. The point of satire is to reveal an essential truth through caricature and exaggerated humor. If you flesh something out or make it less caricatured, then it's...not satire.

    I don't think Glee is offensive but I do think it's often unfunny, and that's where it's intended satire fails. Satire is supposed to be witty and humorous and Glee is rarely ever that.
    Indeed. The show is a mere mockery of caricatured figures, and the social cliques within a high school. I too don't find Glee offensive...but the direction it has is terrible. They are starting to develop characters, making them dimensional. It's difficult to be satirical and mock caricatures if we can feel for the characters - adding depth to a caricature, is well, not satirical. For example, Sue having a disabled sister is interesting, but it adds humanity to her when in actuality her insidiousness is her only redeeming quality - I only watch the show for her. If she is continually humanized I'm afraid I will lose interest in the show.

  40. #290

    Re: Glee is offensive

    I'm curious as to what "essential truth" the satire is speaking of.

  41. #291

    Re: Glee is offensive

    blacksyringe, you and I are in complete agreement. I don't fault Glee for being "offensive", I fault it for being plot-driven, obvious, badly directed and often unfunny.

    JNewYork, I know what you're trying to say, but far more offensive than anything in Glee is the implication in your statements that masculine gay men = good, while effeminate gay men = bad. I'm actually surprised no one else in this thread has pointed that out. Hopefully you didn't mean that the way it sounded.

  42. #292

    Re: Glee is offensive

    I hear ya, Sgt. Yes, I should point out that all points on the gender identification spectrum are valid. Feminine is not bad.

    It's just tiresome to see that "weak" and "flaky" are the favorite ways that Hollywood portrays gay men. I hear the argument that in Glee's case it's satire. But most of the other leads are not satirical, except for the Cheerleader coach, and even she is very realistic. So the way they're presenting Kurt, they are presenting him as real not some satirical sketch.

    Is Finn a satire? Is Rachel? Is Puck? Is Shue? Is Artie? Is Quinn? Is Emma? Is Mercedes? I find all the aforementioned to be presented as very realistic people. So I can only assume that the character of Kurt is also presented as real, too.

    And the way he's presented is offensive. Even the over the top Sue Sylvester is actually very realistic, too.

    I should restate that I love Glee. It's actually brought me to tears on a number of shows. It's funny, warm and I feel for the characters and the drama they go through.

    Bravo to this great show! And bravo to the actor who portrays Kurt. He's a phenomenal actor. And, yes, there are plenty of queenie guys in drama depts.

    But it would be nice to also show the truth, that not all gays are like that.

  43. #293
    blacksyringe
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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    Awesome...further evidence Amber Riley and Lea Michele are the only two worth a damn.

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVCzqFLc4lM[/ame]

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKONiUWFWGQ[/ame]

  44. #294
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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    Hmm I never noticed this but Glee is based in my home town! (Lima, Ohio) That is very... awkward because I've never even watched the show... I should give it a chance lol.

  45. #295
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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    I still heart this show, even though some people say it isn't what it "used to be."

    It's hilarious, and I love the music in it. The writers do a great job of incorporating the meaning of the songs to what happened in the episode.

    I'm beautiful in my way - cause god makes no mistakes - I'm on the right track - baby I was born this way!

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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    It's not as mean-spirited as it was in the first episode, which made me laugh numerous times, but it's better than it was for a few episodes where I thought it didn't know who it was. I think they've begun to settle in nicely. It's still better and more unique that half the shit on tv.

  47. #297

    Re: Glee! [merged]

    It's a very inconsistent show. Kurt mentioned that they have anonymity in the Glee club but just a few eps back they were being harassed by the entire school.

    Why would anyone care about yearbook pictures being defaced, enough to ban an entire group from having one? Though I tend to put that down to Sue's conniving ways, which used to be cute and funny but are now just loathesome. I was kinda rooting for Quinn to go directly to Figgins to get the Cheerios banned from competition. But when they win Sectionals I guess success will be the best revenge.

    One big question... now that Will knows, where does that leave baby Drizzle? And I shudder to think of how Sue's gonna run the club now that Will is out.

  48. #298
    blacksyringe
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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    ^ It's mostly because there a multiple writers, and each writer is interpreting and therefore writing the characters differently. The inconsistencies are in the writing. Once they gather their thoughts, and tone down the Auto-Tune, this would be awesome come Emmys for comedy.

  49. #299
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    Re: Glee! [merged]

    For the first time in years I finally feel there is something worth watching.
    I couldn't get my mind off you all day.
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  50. #300
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    Glee star Corey Monteith gets naked

    http://www.bilerico.com/2009/11/glee...gets_naked.php


    A link for the Finn fans. And yes there are pictures, but not full frontal.
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