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View Poll Results: Choose a Memorial to welcome Rev. Phelps to Hell:

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  • Phelps Memorial #1

    0 0%
  • Phelps Memorial #2

    3 6.67%
  • Phelps Memorial #3

    0 0%
  • Phelps Memorial #4

    0 0%
  • Phelps Memorial #5

    1 2.22%
  • Phelps Memorial #6

    4 8.89%
  • Phelps Memorial #7

    2 4.44%
  • Phelps Memorial #8

    0 0%
  • Phelps Memorial #9

    27 60.00%
  • Phelps Memorial #10

    8 17.78%
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  1. #1901
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    Re: Westboro Baptist Church to picket Oklahoma liquor store over sign mocking Fred Phelps' death

    Good job Wilson High School!

  2. #1902
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    Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    For decades, Fred Phelps was a living paradox. Back in the 50s and 60s, he was a strong advocate of civil rights. As a lawyer, he would protect the black people who were arrested for peaceful acts of protests. At times, he was so frustrated by people's prejudices that he would lose his temper in the courtroom.

    Then he disappeared for a couple decades. When he came back into the public light, he was now the hateful Fred Phelps that most people now know of.

    In a way, his open hostility against gay people has furthered gay rights by light years. How? It turned people off about anti-gay propaganda. The more hate he and his family spewed out to the open public, the more people he converted to our side. Think reverse psychology.

    My theory is perhaps after his frustration with the system regarding black people's civil right movement, he became convinced that the prejudices against gay people were too subtle for any progress to be made. If we look at history, often times the status quo remained until all hell broke loose. But with the civil right regarding gay people, the systematic prejudices against haven't been dramatic enough for a speedy change.

    What if Fred Phelps purposefully sacrificed himself and his family by making them into the most hated family in America to simulate the drama we needed to convert just enough people to our side?

    If I'm right, this would make Fred Phelps the noblest man of our generation.
    Last edited by zombiekiller; June 16th, 2014 at 07:15 PM.

  3. #1903
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Reverse psychology is a crock, invented by the paranoid to justify their borderline delusional conspiracy theories.
    Don't do scat, kids. It means you're a Republican.

  4. #1904
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vitamin View Post
    Reverse psychology is a crock, invented by the paranoid to justify their borderline delusional conspiracy theories.
    Wow, you're mean.

    To the OP, that would be so weird, yet somewhat cool if that was really the case.

  5. #1905
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vitamin View Post
    Reverse psychology is a crock, invented by the paranoid to justify their borderline delusional conspiracy theories.
    Well... had FP been hateful all his life, I would agree with you completely. But I can't ignore the noble things he did back in the 50s and 60s. What he turned into after his come back from obscurity made no sense when compared to his old self.

  6. #1906
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by xboxfan34 View Post
    Wow, you're mean.

    To the OP, that would be so weird, yet somewhat cool if that was really the case.
    I probably should have added that I wasn't accusing the OP of being any of those things, just misguided that's all.
    Don't do scat, kids. It means you're a Republican.

  7. #1907
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
    Well... had FP been hateful all his life, I would agree with you completely. But I can't ignore the noble things he did back in the 50s and 60s. What he turned into after his come back from obscurity made no sense when compared to his old self.
    Supporting equal rights for one group doesn't necessarily equate to supporting equal rights at all. There was wisdom when Jesus(and by the way I don't consider myself particularly religious) said "Why do you worry about the speck of dust in your friend's eye when you have a log in your own?" There are people who view the civil rights movement as a way to lash out at the demons in others so they don't have have to deal with their own. Fred Phelps revealed that he was that kind of person when he failed to deal with his own prejudices, and chose to attack gay people instead.
    Don't do scat, kids. It means you're a Republican.

  8. #1908
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Yea, well, Hitler was a sweetheart when he was younger also. Are you out of what is left of your mind? When you go down in flames later in life as an evil bastard you don't get a do over. This is how you exit and I'm not willing to assume anything about your ulterior motives. He said some hateful things about me and people like me who I love so he can go fuck off.

    This is not directed at the OP, as I understand what he is saying about why FP might have done the things he did. I don't buy it.

  9. #1909
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    The man that thanked his "god" for dead soldiers did it all in the name of advancing gay rights, because the only way to win an argument in America is to play at the theater of the absurd?

    Hardly. With that logic, the KKK should have gotten black people reparations by now.
    "Thereís death on the horizon,

    and Iíll run to behold your sacrifice..."

  10. #1910
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Haha if you guys have such disgusted reaction to him, them perhaps my theory might not be so far fetch after all.

    Remember that the Mormon church with its tens of millions of dollars in anti gay but politically correct propaganda has done more damage to our cause than FP ever did.
    Last edited by zombiekiller; June 16th, 2014 at 08:18 PM.

  11. #1911
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Your theory falls flat when I couldnt imagine him convincing his whole family to go along with it and the fact that he also targetted dead soldiers.

  12. #1912
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Also let me add that if this was meant to do what you said it is, then he wouldnt involved the young children in the whole thing. They wouldnt be able grasp what he was trying to accomplish if your theory is correct. If he was doing it for that why would he poison the childrens minds?

  13. #1913

    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vitamin View Post
    Supporting equal rights for one group doesn't necessarily equate to supporting equal rights at all. There was wisdom when Jesus(and by the way I don't consider myself particularly religious) said "Why do you worry about the speck of dust in your friend's eye when you have a log in your own?" There are people who view the civil rights movement as a way to lash out at the demons in others so they don't have have to deal with their own. Fred Phelps revealed that he was that kind of person when he failed to deal with his own prejudices, and chose to attack gay people instead.
    Satan started out an angel too.
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  14. #1914
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by MakeDigitalLove View Post
    Also let me add that if this was meant to do what you said it is, then he wouldnt involved the young children in the whole thing. They wouldnt be able grasp what he was trying to accomplish if your theory is correct. If he was doing it for that why would he poison the childrens minds?
    You make a very good point. I pondered about this very question for months.

    I tried to imagine myself going through something like what I proposed to see how I would/could pull it off. My conclusion was the only way for me to pull this off was if only a select few in my family would know the true motive and would go along with it while the rest, including the children, would have to be brainwashed. Then I looked at the Phelps family. I think if this was the case then Shirley would probably be the only one at this point to know the truth.

    In other words, he sacrificed himself and his family.

    Again, remember that even though most people like to pit a face on the hate crowd, and the Phelps seem to make the most sense, the various mega churches like Mormon and Pat Robertson's church have done way way more damage to us with their tens/hundreds of millions of dollars and political correctness than the Phelps family ever did.
    Last edited by zombiekiller; June 16th, 2014 at 08:58 PM.

  15. #1915
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    I believe in yin and yang so where there is a possibility of the highest good there is always a possibility of the greatest evil...and vice versa. One cannot exist without the possibility of the other.

    I don't know fi it was intentional or not but I think he helped us move forward and sway public opinion in our favor more than any other single entity. If it was intentional...that would be cool!
    "I think the world would be a lot better off if more people were to define themselves in terms of their own standards and values and not what other people said or thought about them" - Hillary Rodham Clinton

  16. #1916
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vitamin View Post
    Reverse psychology is a crock, invented by the paranoid to justify their borderline delusional conspiracy theories.
    On this level, though, it isn't reverse psychology so much as creating a backlash in favor of what you really want by making such a vile opposition that people draw away in disgust.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  17. #1917
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    I need to be clear. I'm not claiming this as fact. It's just a thought experiment. I just think there's too much of a coincidence to completely dismiss this idea. Occurred to me last year when the news of FP's death came to me.

  18. #1918
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vitamin View Post
    Supporting equal rights for one group doesn't necessarily equate to supporting equal rights at all. There was wisdom when Jesus(and by the way I don't consider myself particularly religious) said "Why do you worry about the speck of dust in your friend's eye when you have a log in your own?" There are people who view the civil rights movement as a way to lash out at the demons in others so they don't have have to deal with their own. Fred Phelps revealed that he was that kind of person when he failed to deal with his own prejudices, and chose to attack gay people instead.
    It makes sense to see his anger in the courtroom earlier as being triggered by something he considered the opposite of a civil right and so set him on a path of hate rather than the OP thesis.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  19. #1919
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
    Again, remember that even though most people like to pit a face on the hate crowd, and the Phelps seem to make the most sense, the various mega churches like Mormon and Pat Robertson's church have done way way more damage to us with their tens/hundreds of millions of dollars and political correctness than the Phelps family ever did.
    That face was prominent enough that it spilled over to the Mormons and others be association. If nothing else, he put the brakes in a small way on the broader forces, because people just didn't want to look as bad as he was.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  20. #1920
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    That face was prominent enough that it spilled over to the Mormons and others be association. If nothing else, he put the brakes in a small way on the broader forces, because people just didn't want to look as bad as he was.
    Well, small or not, he did sway a lot of people away from the larger forces that are against us.

  21. #1921
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
    Well, small or not, he did sway a lot of people away from the larger forces that are against us.
    That's because they couldn't distance themselves sufficiently -- there just wasn't enough maneuvering room when he claimed to be representing the Bible which both the Mormons and Catholics claim to use. So those who resented his noise automatically resented them, and all their efforts at trying to look reasonable appeared like trying to cover their real motives... which were the same as his.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

  22. #1922
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    gurl you tried it

    You're just a ball of yarn and this pussy is done playing with you


  23. #1923
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    ^ yeah......
    We only see two things in people, what we want to see and what they want to show us. - Dexter Morgan

  24. #1924
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by CupidBoy View Post
    ^ yeah......
    Cosignin your man just like a bitch ass bitch. smh.

    anywho, as far as conspiracy theories go, I've heard them all, Illuminati, 9/11, Kennedy's assassination, the existence of "Michael Jackson", but this is by far the stupidest.
    You're just a ball of yarn and this pussy is done playing with you


  25. #1925
    coleos patentes rareboy's Avatar
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
    I need to be clear. I'm not claiming this as fact. It's just a thought experiment. I just think there's too much of a coincidence to completely dismiss this idea. Occurred to me last year when the news of FP's death came to me.

    Trust me. His own family would have known this.

    And they know that for all these years he has had a loathing of homos that he turned into a crusade.

    I think that your theory is nuts when you look at the facts.

    The guy and his family really hates fags. Those in the family who have fled the Westboro Baptist Church have made this clear.

    Don't romanticize this monster.

  26. #1926
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
    You make a very good point. I pondered about this very question for months.

    I tried to imagine myself going through something like what I proposed to see how I would/could pull it off. My conclusion was the only way for me to pull this off was if only a select few in my family would know the true motive and would go along with it while the rest, including the children, would have to be brainwashed. Then I looked at the Phelps family. I think if this was the case then Shirley would probably be the only one at this point to know the truth.

    In other words, he sacrificed himself and his family.

    Again, remember that even though most people like to pit a face on the hate crowd, and the Phelps seem to make the most sense, the various mega churches like Mormon and Pat Robertson's church have done way way more damage to us with their tens/hundreds of millions of dollars and political correctness than the Phelps family ever did.
    I really, really doubt if Fred Phelps was doing this for the greater good, he would sacrifice his family, especially the children. If he was doing this for the better that means he has a heart and cared in some way. That obviously means he would care about his family and he wouldn't sacrifice his them, especially children and purposely outcast from the rest of the world. It just doesn't make any sense.

  27. #1927
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
    You make a very good point. I pondered about this very question for months.

    I tried to imagine myself going through something like what I proposed to see how I would/could pull it off. My conclusion was the only way for me to pull this off was if only a select few in my family would know the true motive and would go along with it while the rest, including the children, would have to be brainwashed. Then I looked at the Phelps family. I think if this was the case then Shirley would probably be the only one at this point to know the truth.

    In other words, he sacrificed himself and his family.

    Again, remember that even though most people like to pit a face on the hate crowd, and the Phelps seem to make the most sense, the various mega churches like Mormon and Pat Robertson's church have done way way more damage to us with their tens/hundreds of millions of dollars and political correctness than the Phelps family ever did.
    I really, really doubt if Fred Phelps was doing this for the greater good, he would sacrifice his family, especially the children. If he was doing this for the better that means he has a heart and cared in some way. That obviously means he would care about his family and he wouldn't sacrifice his them, especially children and purposely outcast them from the rest of the world. It just doesn't make any sense.

  28. #1928
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    My guess is no.

    -d-

  29. #1929
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Fred Phelps was just a vile old bastard...may he rot in Hell.

  30. #1930
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
    Haha if you guys have such disgusted reaction to him, them perhaps my theory might not be so far fetch after all.

    Remember that the Mormon church with its tens of millions of dollars in anti gay but politically correct propaganda has done more damage to our cause than FP ever did.
    And yet, BOTH of them are now failing. So again, hardly.
    "Thereís death on the horizon,

    and Iíll run to behold your sacrifice..."

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by MakeDigitalLove View Post
    I really, really doubt if Fred Phelps was doing this for the greater good, he would sacrifice his family, especially the children. If he was doing this for the better that means he has a heart and cared in some way. That obviously means he would care about his family and he wouldn't sacrifice his them, especially children and purposely outcast them from the rest of the world. It just doesn't make any sense.
    May be from his perspective sacrificing his family for a greater cause was just? I'm thinking of Lot and how he offered his daughters up to be gang raped to save a couple of strangers.

  32. #1932
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    ^ I don't understand why you want to believe this fantasy about Phelps.

  33. #1933
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    An Occam's Razor field day.

  34. #1934
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
    May be from his perspective sacrificing his family for a greater cause was just? I'm thinking of Lot and how he offered his daughters up to be gang raped to save a couple of strangers.
    I think that considering everything is good but in this case...his best gift was reminding everyone that he is a horrible example...and he served as a mirror for those people who had the same thoughts as he did. Most actual monsters don't even know they are monsters....mirrors help change all that..

    if this was his plan...very cool...but I doubt it.
    "I think the world would be a lot better off if more people were to define themselves in terms of their own standards and values and not what other people said or thought about them" - Hillary Rodham Clinton

  35. #1935
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
    May be from his perspective sacrificing his family for a greater cause was just?
    Like I said, if he was doing it for some kind of good it means he cared in some way which would mean he would care about what happened to his children. The children didn't need to be sacrificed, he could have completely excluded his family and find other nut jobs to do this very same thing without making his family hated just to make a point.

    I don't understand why you want to believe this was some sort of clever scheme. No one actually needs to do this to show how awful prejudice/racist/homophobic/sexist, etc people are. There has been plenty of progress for civil rights before his family existed and there will be plenty more when they're long gone.
    Last edited by MakeDigitalLove; June 17th, 2014 at 02:12 PM.

  36. #1936
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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    I suspect this sort of idea arises from thinking, "Wouldn't it have been a wonderful plan?"

    Sure, it would have been a wonderful plan -- but that doesn't mean it was one.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Where is the nobility in picketing the funeral of a young soldier who was killed in service to his country and proclaiming his death to be the result of a government which allows 'fags' in the military? Where is the nobility in suing the grieving father who tried to prevent the protest? Where is the nobility in the so-called Christian Fred Phelps winning the case and, on top of being granted a sizeable chunk of money, but also being granted his attorney fees when he and his wife were the attorneys?

    Tell me, where is the nobility?

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by rareboy View Post
    ^ I don't understand why you want to believe this fantasy about Phelps.
    Well, about a year ago when this possibility occurred to me, I wanted to doubt it, too. But the more I dug into his involvement with the civil right movement, the more sense it made to me that he decided to sacrifice everything to sway as many people as he could our way by showing what a monster's face looked like.

    Again, remember that there have been much larger forces at work against us. These forces have been very politically correct, which is why they've been so successful with the public at large. Don't forget that almost all cases of marriage equality this far have been won through the courts. Referendum votes still work against us.

    If Phelps really was the monster he appeared to be, then he unintentionally sent a lot of people our way. If my theory is right about him, then he really did send a lot of people our way. Regardless of if it was intentional or not, he sent a lot of people our way. I dare say public opinion would still be overwhelmingly against us had Phelps not show them what a monster face looked like.

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by gsdx View Post
    Where is the nobility in picketing the funeral of a young soldier who was killed in service to his country and proclaiming his death to be the result of a government which allows 'fags' in the military? Where is the nobility in suing the grieving father who tried to prevent the protest? Where is the nobility in the so-called Christian Fred Phelps winning the case and, on top of being granted a sizeable chunk of money, but also being granted his attorney fees when he and his wife were the attorneys?

    Tell me, where is the nobility?
    Did you, even read my proposal?

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    What bizarre thinking.

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
    Did you, even read my proposal?
    Yes, I did, and I find it difficult to understand why you are defending him. That's like saying that Hitler murdered millions of Jews in order to make the world aware of their plight.

    If you haven't seen this interview with Shirley Phelps, I recommend that you do so.

    EDIT: Do you really think this 'person' is on our side?

    Last edited by gsdx; June 17th, 2014 at 03:54 PM. Reason: Addition

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
    Did you, even read my proposal?
    I have to second that question.

    The idea is bizarre, but if true there is an aspect of nobility -- sick and twisted nobility, but nobility.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    No. The answer is no. The answer was no before I read the train of thought. It is no still..

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by gsdx View Post
    Yes, I did, and I find it difficult to understand why you are defending him. That's like saying that Hitler murdered millions of Jews in order to make the world aware of their plight.

    If you haven't seen this interview with Shirley Phelps, I recommend that you do so.

    EDIT: Do you really think this 'person' is on our side?

    I have watched that video many times. It's one of the things that made me think Shirley is in on it.

    Your analogy of Hitler is flawed. He killed millions of Jews. All the Phelps have ever done is swayed more and more public opinion for us by showing people the true face of bigotry.

    While you're all worried about what you can clearly see in the Phelps, mega xtian churches with their hundreds of millions of dollars are the ones doing the real damages by funneling millions into anti gay rights campaigns while being politically correct.

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    I have to second that question.
    I was okay with his proposal, but I wasn't okay with the way that he really started believing it as fact and trying to defend the actions of the WBC and trying to convince me that Fred and his clan were on our side.

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by bankside View Post
    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    No. The answer is no. The answer was no before I read the train of thought. It is no still..
    LOL

    True enough. A truly noble man would have managed to leave the kids out of it.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by gsdx View Post
    I was okay with his proposal, but I wasn't okay with the way that he really started believing it as fact and trying to defend the actions of the WBC and trying to convince me that Fred and his clan were on our side.
    Fair enough.

    "Thirty-one* states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "

    --Jonathan Rauch, Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000

    *the number is now forty

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by gsdx View Post
    I was okay with his proposal, but I wasn't okay with the way that he really started believing it as fact and trying to defend the actions of the WBC and trying to convince me that Fred and his clan were on our side.
    Again, did you not read where I said I don't consider this fact? See post 16.

    Your rebuttal amounts to something like this.

    Allied forces pretends to build up forces in north Africa to let the Germans believe they will land in Italy or Greece. Everyone in berman command sees the build up in forces in north Africa and agrees the allied will attack the south. General A proposes that perhaps it's a deception. General B is so outraged that anyone could even propose such a thing when the allied are clearly building up forces in north Africa.

    Do you see my point? If FP meant to caricaturize the bigot position, it would only work if he didn't hold anything back. Otherwise there's no point.

    In the end, it's all a theory on my part. No need to lose sleep over it.

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kulindahr View Post
    LOL

    True enough. A truly noble man would have managed to leave the kids out of it.
    Well, would you agree that people wouldn't be so turned off by the Phelps had there not been kids involved? I think the kids have been a major factor in swaying so many people our way.

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    Re: Could Fred Phelps had been the noblest man on Earth?

    Anyone here remember the Jesus camp video? There have been many videos about xtian extremists and crazies, but people just dismiss them as religious worship. But public opinion was so overwhelmingly against that camp because it involved kids that the camp had to close.

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