Harold Ford, Jr. & Out of State Funding.

[maltese]

In the Tennessee Senate race, 68% of Harold Ford Jr.'s cash comes from out of state sources, while only 8% of Bob Corker's funds do so. As a Tennessean, I'm not sure I like the idea of the majority of a candidate's funding for a State-wide race originating from out of state.

Please note that this is not the party advertising money that both parties are pouring into the state, but rather the individual hard cash donations.

What do you think? Are there similar races in other parts of the country? The Democratic primary in Connecticut comes to mind. I've also seen fund raising letters for Santorum specifically directed to out of state donors. Is this a growing trend, or am I more aware of it because of my particular state's Senate race this time?


http://www.opensecrets.org/races/ins...2006&special=N

[General_Alfie]

I think you should vote for the hate and corruption candidate, kooky Corker.

[JayHawk]

I think you should vote for the hate and corruption candidate, kooky Corker.

Oh don't you mean Herold? How about hating your heritage. Ask ole Herold about that one. Oh yeah and the corruption his family is so deeply involved in here in the great state of TN. Tennesse waltz was all dem. Your party is corrupt sonny boy admit it.

[Lostlover]

Oh don't you mean Herold? How about hating your heritage. Ask ole Herold about that one. Oh yeah and the corruption his family is so deeply involved in here in the great state of TN. Tennesse waltz was all dem. Your party is corrupt sonny boy admit it.

Who hates their own heritage? And who's family is corrupt?

[NedNickerson]

John Ford (Harold Ford, Jr.'s uncle):

Arrested for:
1) Shooting at a truck driver while driving over 100 mph.
2) Pulling a gun on a work crew for Memphis Light Gas and Water

A bill which he sponsored changing the way in which child support payments were figured was of great benefit to him personally, due to the complex nature of his personal life - He has children by at least 3 different women.

He used campaign funds to pay for a daughter's rather elaborate wedding reception.

There's more here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Ford_%28politician%29

Ophelia Ford (John Ford's sister; Harold Ford, Jr.'s aunt):

John Ford resigned his senate seat after he was indicted in Operation Tennessee Waltz. Ophelia Ford ran for her brother's state senate seat and defeated Henri Brooks by 20 votes in the special Democratic primary. Ophelia Ford went on to defeat Republican candidate Terry Roland by 13 votes in the special general election. Both elections fell under allegations of improprieties. In the special general election, a state senate election committee confirmed 12 of the 13 votes were invalid. Names of deceased persons and felons were found on the rolls, and dozens of additional votes were counted from voters living outside the district. Further investigation of the election revealed that one of the election officials purportedly certifying the name of many of the voters in question was actually in New York City the day of the election and that her place was taken, without authorization, by a relative.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ophelia_Ford

Tennesee Waltz Investigation:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Tennessee_Waltz

[NedNickerson]

More on Harold Ford, Jr:

http://www.fancyford.com/

[JayHawk]

The Ford family is quite a lesson in self improvement. I moved here to Memphis 2.5 years ago because of work. It never ceases to amaze me the amount of both racism and political corruption available for consumption here in the Midsouth.

[NedNickerson]

The Ford family is quite a lesson in self improvement. I moved here to Memphis 2.5 years ago because of work. It never ceases to amaze me the amount of both racism and political corruption available for consumption here in the Midsouth.

http://www.memphisflyer.com/memphis/...oid=oid%3A5120

Memphis was recently listed by the FBI as the city with the second-highest crime rate in the United States. In addition, the rate of robbery and burglary are among the nation's highest.

[maltese]

I think you should vote for the hate and corruption candidate, kooky Corker.

Despite the roll-in-the-floor humor of calling Corker the corruption candidate when running against a member of the Ford Family... the question is about out-of-state funding for a Senate race.

Ford has raised more money in New York City than in any other metropolitan area in the country, including his supposed home city of Memphis... more money in Los Angeles than in Nashville, more money in Washington than in Knoxville & Chattanooga, etc...

Is this a good trend in American politics?

http://www.opensecrets.org/races/met...2006&special=N

[JayHawk]

I suppose we got off point.

The push to affect the national voice for one party of another will not change. So no matter whether your for or against, good or bad, the political machines are keying in on weak spots where they feel the money can make the difference. The left realizes that they must control more square footage in both the house and senate to make a difference. They aren't getting this idea on their own. That has been Karl Rove's political startegy for 15 years. The republicans have influenced many local races to come to their strong control of the legislature.

The short answer is just as we are all connected from all over the world on JUB, the political landscape is becoming more connected nationally vice locally.

This could be fixed by true campaign financing laws. Neither party would actually do that. It would be cutting off the wellspring of cash flow.

[iman]

Make your mind up Maltese, campaign spending is either "freedom of speech" or it isn't and can be limited in some ways.

Now, let me see, why couldn't an African-American candidate raise big money in Tennessee? Actually, Tennesseans might do better to worry about what state interests Corker is beholden to for his cash.

[maltese]

Make your mind up Maltese, campaign spending is either "freedom of speech" or it isn't and can be limited in some ways.

Now, let me see, why couldn't an African-American candidate raise big money in Tennessee?

It's always interesting that the race card is played by people who don't live here, and don't know anything about the race. I suspect he couldn't raise as much in Tennessee because he's:

1. Associated with a Memphis political machine that's unpopular in many areas outside of Memphis.
2. Hasn't actually lived in this State since he was about 4 years old.
3. Is a Democrat in a State that largely isn't.

That's for starters.


As for the free speech thing, an interesting question if posed as more than partisan posturing. The question remains on how much we as Americans would like to see contributions flowing across the country to local races. I never suggested legislating a different solution - that's a Democratic tendency you're showing there, to legislate that which you do not like.

[MattieMich]

More on Harold Ford, Jr:

http://www.fancyford.com/

Maltese, is this website included in the 8% of out of state funds? Local or national voice?

[maltese]

Maltese, is this website included in the 8% of out of state funds? Local or national voice?

Actually, this site predates the Corker/Ford race, and is part of a dueling site war between Ford and Frist. Both sites are supported by the major party senatorial campaign committees, and therefore are not included in the either the 8% or 68% mentioned earlier.

http://www.dscc.org/fancy/

[tommyj]

Maltese, it is a campaign issue but entirely legal. When you list out of state (OOS) numbers, are you including donations from RSCC (Rep. Senatorial Campaign Comm.) and other bulk donations too? As for the folks who are posting the Ford family's misdeeds, well, when you have a recipe for allowing one to choose relatives, please let us know.

[snapcat]

At first glance, one may be put off by so much out-of-state fundraising, but I think it's fair to consider some factors which, I believe, apply here.

Would we expect smaller and/or poorer states to run less expensive campaigns? Take Delaware for example. Very small state - very expensive television market. Much of the population in Delaware lives in the Philadelphia suburbs of Northern Delaware. Philadelphia is like the #4 TV market in the country. It would be expensive to advertise here.

Tennessee may not be as stark an example, but it is largely one of the poorer states, but has 5 of the largest television markets in the country - Memphis, Nashville, Knoxville, Chattanooga, and the Bristol-Johnson City-Kingsport Tri-Cities market. All five are in the top 100 largest tv markets in the country.

By contrast, many of the surrounding states of Tennessee have fewer television markets, and it's easier for a candidate to get a bigger bang for it's buck on television. For instance, Kentucky has 3 top 100 markets (Lexington, Louisville, Cincinnati), Mississippi only has 1 (Jackson), Alabama does have 3 (Birmingham, Mobile, and I think Huntsville - I'm pretty sure Montgomery is not a top 100 market), and Georgia only has 1 (Atlanta).

Now while political ads generate revenue for television stations, the stations can only charge their lowest ad rate, which sucks for the station. But, stations often sell a ton of commercial time to the candidates so they make their money by selling ads in bulk.

But when you have to pay for ads in so many television markets: Memphis, Jackson, Nashville, Chattanooga, Knoxville, Bristol, and maybe even Asheville, NC and Huntsville, AL, to reach their constituents, it can get pretty expensive, and I can see the need for out-of-state fundraising.

So, I think it's fair to notice it, but I think we have to keep it in context with the above.

[maltese]

Maltese, it is a campaign issue but entirely legal. When you list out of state (OOS) numbers, are you including donations from RSCC (Rep. Senatorial Campaign Comm.) and other bulk donations too?

As mentioned in the original post, no.

Please note that this is not the party advertising money that both parties are pouring into the state, but rather the individual hard cash donations.

As for the folks who are posting the Ford family's misdeeds, well, when you have a recipe for allowing one to choose relatives, please let us know.

Ah, you've heard Ford enough to quote him, I see. But don't you think that it's a wee bit disingenuous for the Congressman to suddenly express an interest in the recipe to change one's family? When he was raised in private Washington schools as the son of a Congressman, did he ask for the recipe? When he 'ran' for his dad's seat at age 26 from his college apartment, did he ask for that recipe? Has his brother asked for that recipe as he runs for that same seat, seeking to extend family control of their personal seat into the fourth decade? When the Ford's political influence has been bolstered for years by the flood of money directed by Uncle John's illegal activities, did he ask for the recipe, or did he wait until Uncle John got busted by the FBI?

If Mr. Ford had successfully overcome an difficult background that included criminal activity by his family that had naught to do with his career, it would be a credit to him, actually. But Mr. Ford is sitting in the seat that he holds in Congress, and running for the Senate seat, exactly and precisely because of the last name that he holds and the influence that it has bought throughout his career. To suddenly pretend that the family political machine has nothing to do with the families' star politician's career is nothing but political spin.

[maltese]

But when you have to pay for ads in so many television markets: Memphis, Jackson, Nashville, Chattanooga, Knoxville, Bristol, and maybe even Asheville, NC and Huntsville, AL, to reach their constituents, it can get pretty expensive, and I can see the need for out-of-state fundraising.

So, I think it's fair to notice it, but I think we have to keep it in context with the above.

Snaps, good points all, in terms of running a viable political campaign in the State of Tennessee. But these are fundamental structural issues, which are not unique to either party or to this particular election. Perhaps my question should drift into comparisons to similar match-ups in the State. If you have a politician appealing to the tradition sources of party strength, and they happen to be out of state, that's one thing. If you have a politician unable to raise money from the traditional democratic sources within his own state, and is forced to rely on the majority of his funding coming from out of state interests, I think that's something that ought to be discussed during the election.

The other response that I'd be interested in hearing is how this compares to other contentious elections around the country. There may be an election somewhere that the majority of the GOP candidates funds come from out of State. If so, I'm not sure I like that any better.

[smelter]

I could argue that the average Democratic supporter in Tennessee is not in the same favorable discretionary spending position as the average Republican ...... necessitating out-of-State help to level the playing field.

If I knew this to be fact, I'd argue that, but since I don't ....... I won't.

[tommyj]

Maltese, yes I did like the quote...I live in NJ but was in Tenn. 2 weeks ago and read profiles in the Tennessean about Ford and Corker. OK, I agree he basically has to defend his family as all fair in love, war and politics but do u think most voters will hold that against him. What if Phil were running for Senate this year. Would u vote for him or cant u cross the line?

[Bareback1988]

All I know about Mr Ford is that he is one of the sexiest men over 35 (nay, the sexiest) I've ever seen. But it bothers me that some people here rage against him because his uncle is a gun-toting drunk driver and his aunt is corrupt! My father's father was a nazi war criminal: he ordered the execution of dozens of people. Whenever I mention my last name, people start. Then they ask if I'm related (our last name stands out, so of course I am). And that's it. Nobody blames me for what he did (and I work in Antwerp's Jewish neighbourhood).

[maltese]

Maltese, yes I did like the quote...I live in NJ but was in Tenn. 2 weeks ago and read profiles in the Tennessean about Ford and Corker. OK, I agree he basically has to defend his family as all fair in love, war and politics but do u think most voters will hold that against him. What if Phil were running for Senate this year. Would u vote for him or cant u cross the line?

If Phil were running for the Senate this year, I suspect he'd win with or without my vote. He'll get my vote for Governor - he's done a good job for the State, regardless of his party. I'd have to think long and hard about making a contribution to Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, even for Phil. But regardless, the dems made it easy for me by choosing someone I wouldn't support regardless of his party affiliation.

[tommyj]

I think that answer is on the line - actually a foot or so behind it

[maltese]

All I know about Mr Ford is that he is one of the sexiest men over 35 (nay, the sexiest) I've ever seen. But it bothers me that some people here rage against him because his uncle is a gun-toting drunk driver and his aunt is corrupt! My father's father was a nazi war criminal: he ordered the execution of dozens of people. Whenever I mention my last name, people start. Then they ask if I'm related (our last name stands out, so of course I am). And that's it. Nobody blames me for what he did (and I work in Antwerp's Jewish neighbourhood).

His uncle is indeed a gun-toting drunk driver - but more important, he's an influence peddling, bribe-taking, politician who secures kickbacks to benefit his supporters - and then uses that to help the family political machine.

Tell me, would you expect people to feel differently about your family connections if you had your current job because an old buddy of your grandfather thought his actions were great and wanted to reward his family?

[General_Alfie]

Funny, but the Bush family is rife with war profiteers -- even up to today -- not to mention Nazi sympathizers, war criminals, deserters, coke addicts, self-described "born a'gins," alcoholics, and other riff raff. But... they're Republican'ts and they're white and judged by a different measuring stick. Figures.

Tell me, would you expect people to feel differently about your family connections if you had your current job because an old buddy of your grandfather thought his actions were great and wanted to reward his family?

You talking about George W or Jeb?

[JayHawk]

yeah MOM Johnny did this first. and and and

[General_Alfie]

His uncle is indeed a gun-toting drunk driver - but more important, he's an influence peddling, bribe-taking, politician who secures kickbacks to benefit his supporters - and then uses that to help the family political machine.

My Oh My, the hens sure are cackling! Um, George W has a DWI conviction and his so-called "wife" has a vehicular manslaughter or two (or more) notched on her belt, so, like, are you prepared to offer a hen's rant about them? Or, is it because they're, you know, white and Republican'ts they get a "pass?"

[JayHawk]

SO the Senate seat in TN has what to do with Bush?

[MattieMich]

yeah MOM Johnny did this first. and and and

Son, it doesn't matter who did it first or who's was worse, you're both bad. As your mother, and an adult, I can see that. It's wrong for you to think you can be bad just because the Bushs are corrupt and do business with the Nazis. Now, go to your room till your father gets home.

[Lostlover]

What's this whole thing about him hating being an AFrican American or black?

I wrote a report about him and one thing he always mentions was his family being his state's top black family. I always thought he was proud of being black.

Can someone enlighten me?

[iman]

There are a few things that I do not understand about this thread. What is wrong with out of state money? Is Tennessee a sovereign country, have they seceded, again? I would suppose that Tom Daschle got beaten by out of state money. Maybe Tennesseans should worry about what in state big money interests Corker is beholden to.

Does Maltese really believe that Harold Ford should not have attended boarding school or college on his family's money? That's a high standard indeed, good thing the Kennedys and the Rockefellers weren't that scrupulous.


Are these the only reasons one should not vote for Ford? Are there any issues in this campaign?

[maltese]

There are a few things that I do not understand about this thread. What is wrong with out of state money? Is Tennessee a sovereign country, have they seceded, again? I would suppose that Tom Daschle got beaten by out of state money. Maybe Tennesseans should worry about what in state big money interests Corker is beholden to.

Given that the job of a Senator is to represent the constituents in his home state, I think it's significant that the majority of his money is from out of State. And I know it's hard to believe, but I'm actually asking the question about out of state money for the purpose of discussion.... no, I don't think that State races should be limited to entirely state funds, and haven't proposed that it be limited to that. But if this is an unusually high percentage, I think it's fair to discuss why.

Does Maltese really believe that Harold Ford should not have attended boarding school or college on his family's money? That's a high standard indeed, good thing the Kennedys and the Rockefellers weren't that scrupulous.

Interesting that you've focused on going to college, instead of becoming a congressman while in college when it comes to family advantages....

The Kennedys and the Rockefellers didn't stand in front of their constituents and pretend that they have nothing to do with their family. My objection is for someone to benefit from the decades of influence by their very political family, and then to pretend to be affronted and have nothing to do with that family as soon as someone asks about the criminal activities of that same political machine.

Are these the only reasons one should not vote for Ford? Are there any issues in this campaign?

Actually, there are no issues. Ford is such a brilliant political chameleon, there is simply no way to distinguish him from a Republican candidate, other than the letter next to his name.

Here's an article of grudging conservative admiration for the political campaign that he's run that you might find interesting.

A five-term, African-American congressman from Memphis, Ford has come close in his brilliant campaign to cracking the electoral code for Democrats running practically anywhere that’s not dominated by a major urban center. It comes down to “don’t be a liberal,” or at least “don’t be a liberal in easily exploitable ways.”

Ford has sidestepped the symbolic hot-button issues. He is, for instance, against partial-birth abortion and for a ban on flag-burning. The calculation here is plain. Why should Democrats expend an ounce of credibility defending a practice that strikes most people as infanticide and is a tiny proportion of all abortions? And why seem to defend flag-burning, a practice that is highly offensive and happens only rarely anyway? (Liberal absolutists will have answers to these questions, but they never will be elected statewide in Tennessee.)

On national security, Ford voted for the Iraq War and tilted toward President Bush in his dispute with Sen. John McCain on how to interrogate terrorists. Again, even if they object to tough interrogations of a few top-level al Qaeda killers, why would Democrats make an issue of it? On the economy, Ford has supported a slew of tax cuts. Taken altogether, he has systematically eliminated his party’s vulnerabilities on culture, national security and the economy, in a performance worthy of Bill Clinton in his centrist, vote-winning prime.

If John Kerry had been half as deft, he would be president now. The deftness is key. Ford has charisma (he is one of People magazine’s most beautiful people) and knows what he is doing. When a questioner at a recent debate rattled off the issues on which Ford agrees with Bush and asked what he dissents from him on, Ford said he thinks Bush hasn’t done enough to secure the ports or the borders, cannily positioning himself to the president’s right.

[NedNickerson]

What's this whole thing about him hating being an AFrican American or black?

I wrote a report about him and one thing he always mentions was his family being his state's top black family. I always thought he was proud of being black.

Can someone enlighten me?

I think you may be referring to Harold Ford Jr saying that his grandmother was white and now his own family is in an uproar about it.

Check out these links:

http://justusboys.com/forum/showthread.php?t=120168 (look at my post, #10)

http://www.blackcommentator.com/177/...other_pf.html#

http://www.websitetoolbox.com/tool/p...post?id=995026

[iman]

Actually, there are no issues. Ford is such a brilliant political chameleon, there is simply no way to distinguish him from a Republican candidate, other than the letter next to his name.

The Republican is the white guy.

Maybe if someone had not made partial birth abortion and flag burning big issues a Democrat could not easily adopt them. I believe a few Republicans have gotten elected on these issues, no?

Certainly a case could be made that Tennessee is a conservative Republican state and Ford reflects those values. Your problem with Ford is that you don't believe he really believes in his conservative positions. Your probably right, but then a very good case could be made that Bush didn't believe in them either.

Many of those conservative values are not generally believed by many outside the Republican base, but lip service is paid until people begin to reassess their priorities.

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[PabloZed]

Corker is an empty suit. I've watched the debates and he spouts the party lines from Washington and has not uttered a single original thought. That might be why he is susceptible to being corrupt as suggested by the fact that his personal wealth increased some 40% while he served as mayor. The only people who get rich while serving in public office are the Saddam Husseins and Ferdinand Marcos of the world.

[maltese]

Corker is an empty suit. I've watched the debates and he spouts the party lines from Washington and has not uttered a single original thought. That might be why he is susceptible to being corrupt as suggested by the fact that his personal wealth increased some 40% while he served as mayor. The only people who get rich while serving in public office are the Saddam Husseins and Ferdinand Marcos of the world.

And Harry Reid, too, apparently.

And speaking of the party line... the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee trots out their new attack at for the weekend (the 40% deal), and you're posting it here within hours.... and then fussing about spouting party lines from Washington?

[iman]

The real problem is not out of state money or in state money, it is too much money. The amounts of cash needed to run a campaign is corrupting the whole system. Not only are the candidates beholden to all kinds of special interests, but the more money in the campaign, the more the issues are obscured.

If you want to keep elections localized and more reflective of the region, the best way to do so is to limit the amount of money available.

[snapcat]

Maltese, the Chattanooga Police Department doesn't seem to much like their former mayor - they just endorsed Harold Ford!

[maltese]

Maltese, the Chattanooga Police Department doesn't seem to much like their former mayor - they just endorsed Harold Ford!

What??? A public service union supporting a Democratic candidate???

Shocked, shocked, shocked, I tell you.

[Toriko]

The real problem is not out of state money or in state money, it is too much money. The amounts of cash needed to run a campaign is corrupting the whole system. Not only are the candidates beholden to all kinds of special interests, but the more money in the campaign, the more the issues are obscured.

If you want to keep elections localized and more reflective of the region, the best way to do so is to limit the amount of money available.

This is such genius it needed to be repeated.

[Lostlover]

I think you may be referring to Harold Ford Jr saying that his grandmother was white and now his own family is in an uproar about it.

Check out these links:

http://justusboys.com/forum/showthread.php?t=120168 (look at my post, #10)

http://www.blackcommentator.com/177/...other_pf.html#

http://www.websitetoolbox.com/tool/p...post?id=995026

Thanks Ned.

It's odd why he would even state his grandmother's race in the first place. I guess to curry favor with White voters.

But the more I read about him on here, the less respect I have for him. Like calling himself a lawyer even though he hasn't passed a bar exam.