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  1. #1
    Thankfully Liberal & Gay
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    The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Another group of people who would very likely kill all of us, if it was legal to do so...no further explanation needed for the below. Behold the total hatred!! This comes from a "blue" state, no less. I guess that it's another of those wacko groups that feel that hatred is a Christian velue.

    Press Release
    Americans for Truth

    FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE: August 24, 2006

    CONTACT: Matt Barber at 847-867-7554 / tiaorg@comcast.net or Peter LaBarbera at 630-546-4439 / americansfortruth@comcast.net to arrange an interview.

    AFT: ARE WAL-MART VALUES FAMILY VALUES?

    Naperville, Illinois— Is Wal-Mart passing the wrong kind of ‘values’ on to its customers? It’s no secret that Walmart Stores, Inc. has been under vicious attack in recent months by leftists and union activists due to its unwavering support of right-to-work policies, and its refusal to allow unions to organize in its stores. But now it seems Wal-Mart is additionally hell-bent on alienating its heretofore greatest and most vocal supporters: Conservatives, Christians, and Traditionalists.

    Matt Barber, Corporate Outreach Director for Americans for Truth, expressed his disappointment with Wal-Mart today for further capitulating to the powerful homosexual lobby by recently partnering with the “National Gay and Lesbian Chamber of Commerce;” an extremely influential homosexual organization steadfastly devoted to furthering the ‘gay’ agenda within corporate America.

    “It’s a real shame, and I think people who value traditional marriage and the Biblical model of human sexuality should sit up and take notice of Wal-Mart’s recent support of radical pro-homosexual/anti-Christian groups and policies that seek to destroy the time-honored institutions of marriage and family, and further aim to silence proponents of traditional family values,” said Barber.

    While understandably flying under the radar, Wal-Mart’s British subsidiary recently introduced a “gay wedding” line of products, and Wal-Mart corporate has inexplicably re-defined “family” in its corporate policies to include sexual partners of the same gender. It has also added employees who choose to engage in dangerous homosexual behaviors to its anti-discrimination policies. “Of course nobody advocates harassment of anyone in the workplace for anything,” said Barber; “but my concern is that Wal-Mart’s recent company policy officially endorsing and promoting the homosexual lifestyle, now discriminates against employees who happen to believe, as Judeo/Christian tradition holds, that marriage is between one man and one woman, and that homosexual behavior is both immoral and unhealthy. What if Wal-Mart decided to hold a “gay-day” like other companies have done? Would pro-family employees then be fired for ‘discrimination’ if they refused to participate because it violated their sincerely held religious beliefs?”

    Peter LaBarbera, Founder and President of Americans for Truth added: “Wal-Mart has always been a favorite of God fearing Middle American customers who hold traditional family values. I’m very surprised that Wal-Mart would now bite the hand that feeds it and thumb its nose at those very customers. It seems to me that Wal-Mart should reconsider its unsavory alliance with these extremist homosexual activists in today’s heated and polarizing culture war. It risks entirely alienating the vast majority of its customer base. Perhaps this great corporation with such an impressive history should play Switzerland in the culture war, return to a position of neutrality, and get back to doing what it has always done best – selling high quality products at the lowest prices available.”

    Americans for Truth indicated its intent to further investigate and report on Wal-Mart’s recent endorsement of the homosexual lifestyle, and to request a meeting with Wal-Mart officials to ensure that its family-values employees will not be discriminated against in light of Wal-Mart’s growing support of the anti-family, anti-Christian homosexual lobby. “We’ll talk with Wal-Mart,” said Barber; “and then determine whether it’s necessary for us to further educate Wal-Mart customers – and employees – on a wide spread basis about the new and not-so-impressive left-wing values now offered to Wal-Mart shoppers.”

    Americans for Truth (www.americansfortruth.com) is the only National pro-family organization solely dedicated to exposing and opposing the anti-Christian homosexual, bisexual and transgendered agenda. For more information, e-mail americansfortruth@comcast.net.
    AFT, P.O. Box 5522, Naperville, IL 60567-5522. Phone: 630-546-4439.
    "All legal U. S. residents who are 18 years or older, shall have an unconditional right to vote." - We need a 28th Amendment to the U. S. Constitution which resembles this...NOW!

    VOTING: Just remember: "Be careful of what you DON'T wish for. You might just get it." GET OUT AND VOTE for what you DO wish for.

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  2. #2
    aww I wanted to explode looseliam's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    And the Bible belt keeps creeping higher.

    So, is gay-friendly Charmin toilet paper worse than god-fearing Charmin?

    Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day.
    Give a man religion, and he'll starve praying for a fish.

  3. #3
    57821 jwest's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    ha.. i was in naperville only a few days ago, and odd enough, i went to wal-mart...

    i saw this report earlier on in the day, and its so stupid..
    There are people who love command and in their eagerness to assume it they are impatient at the formalities of taking
    over from someone else. I love command since it is the ideal welding of freedom and slavery. You can be happy
    with your freedom and when it becomes too dangerous you take refuge in your duty.

    -Ernest Hemingway, True at First Light

  4. #4
    No longer MIA tbonez's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by prairie_looner View Post
    While understandably flying under the radar, Wal-Mart’s British subsidiary recently introduced a “gay wedding” line of products,...
    For me this was the most disturbing part of the article.

    What KIND of wedding? An Elvis impersonator as the minister and Britney Spears as the maid of honour? Wedding gifts from Wal-Mart?? Plastic ashtrays and particle-board coffee-tables? Bulk toilet paper and a polyester Little Mermaid duvet? I'd elope first!

    OK, you can call me a snob now. I fully admit that I just feel dirty walking into the place, so shoot me! Just so one favour and don't buy the ammo at Wal-Mart...Let me die with a shred of dignity.
    Even if we are just worm food then we are also the stuff stars are made of... I can live with that.

  5. #5
    Just Another Hitchhiker CaptainJohn's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by looseliam View Post
    So, is gay-friendly Charmin toilet paper worse than god-fearing Charmin?
    ---
    ---
    "How can you talk if you haven't got a brain?"

    "I don't know. But some people without brains do an awful lot of talking, don't they?"

  6. #6
    No longer MIA tbonez's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by looseliam View Post

    So, is gay-friendly Charmin toilet paper worse than god-fearing Charmin?
    Other way 'round actually... The gay-friendly stuff is much softer.

    Fundamentalist bum-wad is abrasive and rubs me the wrong way.

    Sorry, couldn't help myself!
    Even if we are just worm food then we are also the stuff stars are made of... I can live with that.

  7. #7
    I'd rather be a Sexgod:)
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    No corp., let alone one of the Wal-Mart's magnitude does absolutely anything without having previously considered the impact their action may have on their balance sheet.

    My educated guess here would be that with their new expansion plans in place, and with their 'new revenue' flowing in from more 'gay friendly states', they figured out, if they did not go after the big gay $$$ actively, for fear of alienating their old 'bible belt customer base', they'd be on the loosing side of the equation. Even Wal-Mart knows that gay dudes have a significantly greater amount of 'play cash' in their pockets than their str8 peers. Whoever chooses to disregard this fact and thus, fails to tap into that 'gay dollar' source of revenue is really doing that at his own loss.

    One of the very few pleasures of being affluent is your relative independence. If a market player is not 'your lifestyle friendly', does not want your $$$, gee, you move on to the next one. Wal-Mart must have figured out that their 'ultra conservative, bible belt base with their traditional values' mostly has no other and certainly no better market choice than Wal-Mart. Sure, they'll most like scream and kick for a while but will, just as the consumers always do, vote with their feet and will do, what's best and least expensive for them: Go to Wal-Mart.

    In other words, the potential losses are going to be minimal, whereas the potential gains are going to be substantial. Facing such projections, no corp. of any kind has got any choice whatsoever.

    My topline here: Corporations are here to make corporate profits. Moral values do not enter that equation. Ever. Moral values can be a marketing tool. But that's all there is to it. What money wants is simply: more money.

    SC

  8. #8
    JUB Addict Sausy's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    You've got to be anal if Wal Mart is the god guy in this.It's great though that WalMart is courting the gay dollar despite the pressure.We'll see if profit and community good will can be subjugated to pressure and bigotry.Though Wal Mart's labor policies cause me not to root too hard for them,I can bide those fundies even less.
    unofficial official mini meet Friday- Saturday April 11-12, 2014

  9. #9
    Sex God Brad's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    All poor people who are over worked amd underpaid go to wal-Mart. I do it despite my leftism I am their bitch. What kind of corporation courts bitches with no money? Dumb ass Wal-Mart that's who! It served them well untill their government pulled the rug out from under poor folk. If I made a decent salery as a teacher or anything else, I sure as hell wouldn't be caught dead in there.
    "I'm not ready to make nice. I'm not ready to back down." Dixie Chics

  10. #10
    No longer MIA tbonez's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by sausageeater View Post
    You've got to be anal if Wal Mart is the (edit)> good <(edit)guy in this.It's great though that WalMart is courting the gay dollar despite the pressure.We'll see if profit and community good will can be subjugated to pressure and bigotry.
    "BINGO", as your average Wal-Mart shopper dreams of saying.

    Look at Wal-Mart's target customers, basically people who can't afford to shop anywhere else. Even Wal-Mart acknowledges that most of it's 'customer base' has near zero discretionary spending. When the price of gas or groceries goes up, Wal-mart's sales plummet. You don't see the same trend at A & F or Macy's.

    Wal-Mart has done their homework. Right-wing/religious fundamentalist boycotts are a sad joke. They fail miserably and often result in a back-lash from the 'left'. If you are a good fundamentalist with 8 kids and a job driving the church bus, where else are you going to shop? LL Bean? Don't think so!

    Wal-Mart (where Satan shops!) realizes that they need to attract more customers with greater discretionary spending. They have said so in many corporate news releases. That would be you and me my little homo shop-a-holics.

    I'm still not interested in shirts made of starch or furniture held together with spit and mac-tac.
    Even if we are just worm food then we are also the stuff stars are made of... I can live with that.

  11. #11
    Imbeciles...
    luminum's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by prairie_looner View Post
    Americans for Truth (www.americansfortruth.com) is the only National pro-family organization solely dedicated to exposing and opposing the anti-Christian homosexual, bisexual and transgendered agenda.
    So is that to say that they are ina lliance with the pro-Christian homosexual, bisexual, and transgendered agenda?

  12. #12
    slobone
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by tbonez View Post
    "BINGO", as your average Wal-Mart shopper dreams of saying.
    Gee, you wouldn't be a snob by any chance, would you?

    Quote Originally Posted by tbonez View Post
    Look at Wal-Mart's target customers, basically people who can't afford to shop anywhere else.
    Yeah I guess they stole all those SUV's I see in the parking lot.

    Quote Originally Posted by tbonez View Post
    Even Wal-Mart acknowledges that most of it's 'customer base' has near zero discretionary spending. When the price of gas or groceries goes up, Wal-mart's sales plummet.
    Wal-Mart is the world's biggest grocery chain, so what you're saying makes no sense. Lower prices + equal quality = everybody with any sense shops there.

    Quote Originally Posted by tbonez View Post
    You don't see the same trend at A & F or Macy's.
    They don't lower their prices when the economy is doing badly? Sure they do, only they call it a "sale".

    Quote Originally Posted by tbonez View Post
    Wal-Mart has done their homework. Right-wing/religious fundamentalist boycotts are a sad joke. They fail miserably and often result in a back-lash from the 'left'. If you are a good fundamentalist with 8 kids and a job driving the church bus, where else are you going to shop? LL Bean? Don't think so!

    Wal-Mart (where Satan shops!) realizes that they need to attract more customers with greater discretionary spending. They have said so in many corporate news releases. That would be you and me my little homo shop-a-holics.
    Wait, first you criticize them for catering to poor people, now you criticize them for trying to bring in upscale customers as well? Guess they can't do anything right.

    Quote Originally Posted by tbonez View Post
    I'm still not interested in shirts made of starch or furniture held together with spit and mac-tac.
    Granted they don't carry the same prestige labels as Neiman-Marcus, where you presumably shop. And I do admit that their furniture and clothing is not the greatest (which is more a design issue than a quality issue). But for nearly all other categories of goods, they carry the same major brands you see everywhere, at much lower prices.

    Not to mention that WalMart has forced everybody else to lower their prices and/or rethink their marketing strategy. Target wouldn't exist if it weren't for WalMart. And you'd be paying a hell of a lot more at Sears/K-Mart and JCPenney.

    Dat's enough for now

  13. #13
    ...and I'm not sorry JUB Friend Soilwork's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Peter LaBarbera, Founder and President of Americans for Truth added: “Perhaps this great corporation with such an impressive history should ... get back to doing what it has always done best – selling high quality products at the lowest prices available.”
    ok... I gotta ask.. at what point did Walmart "Sell high quality products"?

    I mean.. have you BEEN to Walmart? They sell crap, knock-offs and unhealthy food.

    I love how they have no problem with Walmart abusing their staff but NO WAY are they going to stop the abused staff from saying "Faggot" on their lunch break.

    what idiots.

    oh, and...

    Peter LaBarbera, Founder and President of Americans for Truth added: “Wal-Mart has always been a favorite of God fearing Middle American customers who hold traditional family values.”
    Translation... Christians are either poor or just cheap and don't care who gets abused in the workplace so long as the faggots can get fired for being faggots.
    Gentlemen.... Thank you.

  14. #14
    slobone
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by Soilwork View Post
    I mean.. have you BEEN to Walmart? They sell crap, knock-offs and unhealthy food.
    I respectfully disagree. They sell the same brands as everybody else. (Along with some great store-brand products that are indistinguishable from major brands at half the price).

    And the grocery department sells both healthy and unhealthy food, just like everybody else. I don't even understand what you're trying to say here. Have YOU been there?

    Geez, am I going to have to defend this giant corporation on this board every 5 minutes? I'm exhausted already.

    I live in a very small town in the Midwest. I'm not even going to try to describe what a pain it was trying to shop here before WalMart opened up. And over the years the quality of their merchandise has steadily gone up, while the prices are still the lowest in town.

    Plus the stores are clean, well-organized, well-stocked, and the employees are friendly and helpful almost without exception. It's a pleasure to shop there.

  15. #15
    ...and I'm not sorry JUB Friend Soilwork's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    I'd never buy anything at a Walmart.. I'd sooner starve.

    What healthy food do they sell? I just saw pop and chips and frozen pizza and Kraft Peanut butter.

    not that it matters. If I lived in a small town and that was the only place to shop.. I'd have bigger problems, I think.
    Gentlemen.... Thank you.

  16. #16
    T-Zero
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    All I hear is...

    Americans for Truth

    ^^^^^ wrong kind of ‘values’

    that seek to destroy the time-honored institutions of marriage and family, and further aim to silence proponents of traditional family values

    YET... Wal-Mart’s British subsidiary recently introduced a “gay wedding” line of products, <<< and that has them all in a tizzy. My goodness gracious. It's such a shame people WANT to get married.

    dangerous homosexual

    Of course nobody advocates harassment <<<< No, of course not. Not after you've inflamed everyone with words like: wrong, viscious, dangerous, destroy, immoral, unhealthy, extremist, anti-family, anti-Christian <<< especially ironic this last one, eh, given the involvements of Dignity, MCC, gay Christians themselves, other Christian denominations who are gay supportive

    Could they have found any more inflammatory adjectives?

  17. #17
    slobone
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by Soilwork View Post
    I'd never buy anything at a Walmart.. I'd sooner starve.

    What healthy food do they sell? I just saw pop and chips and frozen pizza and Kraft Peanut butter.

    not that it matters. If I lived in a small town and that was the only place to shop.. I'd have bigger problems, I think.
    Well Soilwork honey, I've no doubt you do have bigger problems!

    I was referring to the WalMart supercenters, which have fully stocked grocery departments. Produce, dairy, meats, all the same stuff everybody else carries. And they're going to go into organic now in a big way. Unless you buy all your food at the farmer's market it's hard to see how you could do better.

    But yeah, the food departments in the smaller stores are pretty limited. It's mostly stuff that doesn't need to be refrigerated. I guess it depends on whether you consider Little Debbie snack cakes healthy or not... <urp>. Oh, excuse me.

  18. #18
    JUB Addict NedNickerson's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    I live in a very small town in the Midwest. I'm not even going to try to describe what a pain it was trying to shop here before WalMart opened up. And over the years the quality of their merchandise has steadily gone up, while the prices are still the lowest in town.

    Plus the stores are clean, well-organized, well-stocked, and the employees are friendly and helpful almost without exception. It's a pleasure to shop there.
    I agree. I live in a small town, too, and a Walmart Superstore is where I do most of my shopping. The Superstore has a grocery department with bakery, delicatessen, meat and sea food department, etc. And like slobone says, the shelves are always well-stocked and the staff is always always helpful.

    There are no other major department stores in my area where I can shop at without driving another 10 miles or so, and then, I'd have to pay more for the same name brand merchandise that Walmart already has. And with gas prices the way they are, what would be the point of driving an additional 20 miles (10 miles both ways)?

    For those of us who don't earn "mega-bucks," Walmart is the place to shop, like it or not... As it is, I'm happy with it... If Walmart doesn't have it, then I don't need it...

  19. #19
    Student of Human Nature NickCole's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    Not to mention that WalMart has forced everybody else to lower their prices and/or rethink their marketing strategy. Target wouldn't exist if it weren't for WalMart. And you'd be paying a hell of a lot more at Sears/K-Mart and JCPenney.
    On what do you base that assertion?

    Both Target and Wal-Mart first opened in 1962, although both were new discount stores opened by established retailers. The folks at the Dayton Company had the same idea Sam Walton had. And Target was a huge success all along. In fact the trajectory of those two retailers is not dissimilar -- while Target was thriving in Minnesota, Wal-Mart was thriving in Arkansas. And, although I might be mistaken, I think Target went national first.

    Wal-Mart has, indeed, impacted the marketing strategy of other discount retailers, sometimes in good ways and sometimes bad. But it really isn't true that Target, or discount merchandise chains in general, wouldn't exist without Wal-Mart. While Sam Walton did introduce new elements to retailing (like check-out counters being located near the exit rather than throughout the store), he didn't invent the discount merchandising business -- the five and dime existed long before he went into business. And Woolworth's, a hugely successful chain selling discount merchandise before Walton was born and the real parent of the concept, was famous for undercutting the prices of local businesses.

  20. #20
    T-Zero
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    I tend to shop at Target more than Walmart, but that's simply because the Target stores are more conveniently located near me.

    I used to boycott Wal-Mart because I considered them to be a rather anti-gay corporation with regard to hiring practices, store policies, their refusal to sell certain items.

    If the religious reconstructionists are having less influence on their policies and practices now, and Wal-Mart is genuinely improving its diversity practices and treatment of employees, etc., I can only see that as a good thing.

  21. #21
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    ...and the employees are friendly and helpful almost without exception...
    Which one are you shopping at? No Wal-Mart I have ever been in has there ever been trully helpful or friendly employees. Granted there are a couple exceptions but generally all you get is "sorry it's not my department", cashiers who are ignorant and greeters that harass you at the door due to the cashiers not fucking deactivating the alarm and you setting it off as you try to exit.

  22. #22
    I spell spelled spelt
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by prairie_looner View Post
    “It’s a real shame, and I think people who value traditional marriage and the Biblical model of human sexuality should sit up and take notice of Wal-Mart’s recent support of radical pro-homosexual/anti-Christian groups and policies that seek to destroy the time-honored institutions of marriage and family, and further aim to silence proponents of traditional family values,” said Barber.
    I don't understand why these two 'groups' must be mutually exclusive. That is saying that homosexuals are not Christian and Christians are not homosexual. That is not true.

    I do not attend church, and haven't done so in many years, mainly because of the hypocracy I have encountered within the Church. Still, I live my life according to the basic Christian ideals. I can do that without going to a church. That doesn't make me any less Christian and, in fact, makes me even more Christian than many of the fundamentalists. I do not spout hatred at every turn. I do not insist that 'my way' is the 'only way', and I certainly don't insist that it is also 'God's way'.

  23. #23
    slobone
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by NickCole View Post
    On what do you base that assertion?

    Both Target and Wal-Mart first opened in 1962, although both were new discount stores opened by established retailers. The folks at the Dayton Company had the same idea Sam Walton had. And Target was a huge success all along. In fact the trajectory of those two retailers is not dissimilar -- while Target was thriving in Minnesota, Wal-Mart was thriving in Arkansas. And, although I might be mistaken, I think Target went national first.

    Wal-Mart has, indeed, impacted the marketing strategy of other discount retailers, sometimes in good ways and sometimes bad. But it really isn't true that Target, or discount merchandise chains in general, wouldn't exist without Wal-Mart. While Sam Walton did introduce new elements to retailing (like check-out counters being located near the exit rather than throughout the store), he didn't invent the discount merchandising business -- the five and dime existed long before he went into business. And Woolworth's, a hugely successful chain selling discount merchandise before Walton was born and the real parent of the concept, was famous for undercutting the prices of local businesses.
    By "exist" I really meant "exist in its present form." I think its current success is due partly to those parts of the WalMart business model it copied, and partly to the way it has shrewdly differentiated itself from WalMart -- much better design at slightly higher prices. I think without the stimulus of competition from WalMart it would never have found just that niche. Everybody in retailing now defines themselves in relation to WalMart, until maybe you get up to the Nordstrom's and Nieman Marcus's.

    Sam Walton did two very smart things. First, he put his stores into small towns that other retailers had written off, thus giving himself a solid base from which to expand into larger markets. Second, he maintained rigid quality control of every aspect of the store, from purchasing to layout, stocking, lighting, customer service, etc. Target wasn't interested in the first of these ideas, but it has definitely benefitted from the example of the second one.

    Incidentally, I think Target has been a little slow to move beyond some ideas that are starting to seem a little stale, particularly the focus on big name designers. You can only buy so many Michael Graves teapots and Isaac Mizrahi sheets before you get tired of them. I predict Sears is going to run into the same problem with Martha Stewart.

  24. #24
    slobone
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by nurseboy269 View Post
    Which one are you shopping at? No Wal-Mart I have ever been in has there ever been trully helpful or friendly employees. Granted there are a couple exceptions but generally all you get is "sorry it's not my department", cashiers who are ignorant and greeters that harass you at the door due to the cashiers not fucking deactivating the alarm and you setting it off as you try to exit.
    Well, I guess it might depend where you live. Everybody at the store here is very friendly, but maybe that's not true in California, where people tend to be a little more rude.

  25. #25
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    American's for truth? They sure got a lot of different ways to say "I hate Gays".
    Anyway, when did pro-gay suddenly come to mean anti-Christian? This is just one of many so-called "family values" groups that have sprung up just to torment gay people.

  26. #26
    No longer MIA tbonez's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    Gee, you wouldn't be a snob by any chance, would you?
    I did imply as much. Actually I'm not really.

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    Yeah I guess they stole all those SUV's I see in the parking lot.
    Likely only a few are stolen...the balance 100% financed...so "borrowed" from the bank is probably a kinder term that "stolen".

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    Wal-Mart is the world's biggest grocery chain, so what you're saying makes no sense. Lower prices + equal quality = everybody with any sense shops there.
    Funny, I don't qualify as retarded and I don't shop there. Could have something to do with their predatory business practices, the fact they pay 'poverty wages' and are anti 'organized labour'. Not to mention there isn't one anywhere near where I live...Thank God.

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    They don't lower their prices when the economy is doing badly? Sure they do, only they call it a "sale"
    Has nothing to do with what I was saying. Have you even read Wal-Marts own news releases lately? I have.

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    Wait, first you criticize them for catering to poor people, now you criticize them for trying to bring in upscale customers as well? Guess they can't do anything right."
    Get a grip! The don't "cater" to poor people, they victimize them. Big difference! They are trying to attract new customers with some spending power left...those without a maxed out Wal-Mart credit cards and a house full of broken dreck.

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    Granted they don't carry the same prestige labels as Neiman-Marcus, where you presumably shop. And I do admit that their furniture and clothing is not the greatest (which is more a design issue than a quality issue). But for nearly all other categories of goods, they carry the same major brands you see everywhere, at much lower prices.
    Don't shop at Neiman-Marcus...don't think I have ever been in one. Quality IS the issue, as is how they pay and treat employees an their competition. (Not to mention their predatory practices with suppliers.)

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    Not to mention that WalMart has forced everybody else to lower their prices and/or rethink their marketing strategy. Target wouldn't exist if it weren't for WalMart. And you'd be paying a hell of a lot more at Sears/K-Mart and JCPenney.
    I don't mind paying a few cents more so that an employee isn't better off on welfare than working at Wal-Mart. I don't mind paying more for goods that are made in countries without child labour and starvation wages. I don't mind paying more to shop in a store where people have benefits and a decent prospect for a pension.

    Yes Wal-Mart has changed the retail structure in the US...Just not for the better IMO. Cheaper is seldom better...especially in the long run. Where do you think those savings are coming from? Not the shareholder's pockets!
    Even if we are just worm food then we are also the stuff stars are made of... I can live with that.

  27. #27

    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    What tbonez said! (Except that I have shopped in Neiman-Marcus. There seem to be some inverted snobs around here.)
    "I'm chanting even as we speak, sweetie!"

  28. #28
    Temeritous hirsuteness
    Lube's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by tbonez View Post
    I don't mind paying a few cents more so that an employee isn't better off on welfare than working at Wal-Mart. I don't mind paying more for goods that are made in countries without child labour and starvation wages. I don't mind paying more to shop in a store where people have benefits and a decent prospect for a pension.

    Yes Wal-Mart has changed the retail structure in the US...Just not for the better IMO. Cheaper is seldom better...especially in the long run. Where do you think those savings are coming from? Not the shareholder's pockets!
    Slo-bone vs. T-bonez. What is this, the War of the Bonez's??!

    Yeah, although T-Bonez did sound a little uppity at first, I totally agree with the quotes above. I do not shop at Walmart if I can avoid it. Can't remember the last time I've been i one.
    The world never changes if you're forever "minding my own business".
    The mindset that no one knows you're gay because you haven't told them,
    is like the dog that thinks you don't see him stealing the steak because he avoids your glance.
    Staying in the closet is like continuing to sit in the back of the bus.
    It's accepting that it's wrong to be who you are.

  29. #29
    slobone
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by tbonez View Post
    Funny, I don't qualify as retarded and I don't shop there. Could have something to do with their predatory business practices, the fact they pay 'poverty wages' and are anti 'organized labour'. Not to mention there isn't one anywhere near where I live...Thank God.
    Gosh, I don't have the energy to get into all that. I don't agree, but I don't feel like spending all day doing research to back up my arguments. But I can make a few simple points:

    The climate for business and employment has changed drastically in the US and Canada over the last few years, and WalMart is far from the only company whose employees aren't treated as lavishly as they were during the golden years of the 60's and 70's.

    And I think it's interesting that so far, the two people who disagree with me the most strongly about WalMart say they refuse to go in one. So how do you know their merchandise is crap and the employees are miserable?

    Quote Originally Posted by tbonez View Post
    Get a grip! The don't "cater" to poor people, they victimize them. Big difference! They are trying to attract new customers with some spending power left...those without a maxed out Wal-Mart credit cards and a house full of broken dreck.
    You're going to have to help me out here -- I have no idea what you mean by "victimize." Are you implying that they sell over-priced crap? On the contrary, as I already said, they sell the same brands as everyone else at much lower prices.

    Quote Originally Posted by tbonez View Post
    I don't mind paying a few cents more so that an employee isn't better off on welfare than working at Wal-Mart. I don't mind paying more for goods that are made in countries without child labour and starvation wages. I don't mind paying more to shop in a store where people have benefits and a decent prospect for a pension.
    No, the countries with starvation wages and child labor, like most of Africa for example, are precisely the ones whose economies are such basket cases that they can't get it together enough to manufacture things that WalMart would buy to begin with.

    China, which is pretty much what we're talking about, is currently growing at 11% a year -- so fast that the government is desperately figuring out ways to cool the economy down. And that translates into rapid growth in the standard of living. If you can think of a way to make them as rich as Americans overnight, I'd be interested to hear about it.

    And good luck trying to find a store that only sells goods made in North America or Europe. Certainly not Hudson's Bay or Zeller's.

    Quote Originally Posted by tbonez View Post
    Yes Wal-Mart has changed the retail structure in the US...Just not for the better IMO. Cheaper is seldom better...especially in the long run. Where do you think those savings are coming from? Not the shareholder's pockets!
    Well, the shareholders aren't too happy these days, because WalMart's stock price hasn't budged in several years. They can only stay on top by expanding, and they're finding that harder to do.

    Look, retailing has always been a cutthroat business. Stores, and even whole chains, come and go with great rapidity -- and this was true way before WalMart was on the scene. Customers are fickle, that's just a reality.

    Unless you're buying everything from a catalog that features items woven out of straw in third-world villages, you yourself are participating in the ruthless neo-colonialist victimization of all those exploited countries by bloated, greedy American capitalists and their running dogs, comrade. So relax, enjoy yourself, get in the SUV and go get a Big Mac with some Super-Size fries.

  30. #30
    No longer MIA tbonez's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    WalMart is far from the only company whose employees aren't treated as lavishly as they were during the golden years of the 60's and 70's.
    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    ... the two people who disagree with me the most strongly about WalMart say they refuse to go in one. So how do you know their merchandise is crap and the employees are miserable?.
    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    You're going to have to help me out here -- I have no idea what you mean by "victimize." Are you implying that they sell over-priced crap? On the contrary, as I already said, they sell the same brands as everyone else at much lower prices.
    Actually I have shopped there, twice. Both experiences helped me develop my distaste for the place. It's also why I know there is a quality issue.

    I needed an air filter for my Jeep. I bought a Fram with the same part number I always get. When I changed them out, old for new, I noticed the new Wal-Mart Fram was totally different, and inferior. It was the same size but had about a third fewer 'pleats' of filtering medium and the gasket was cheap hard-plastic instead of the usual soft rubber.

    The second time was in Florida when I forgot to pack my trainers. I saw a flyer and they had New Balance trainers that looked like the kind I owned at home...They were about 30% less than I had paid at Foot Locker in Canada. When I got to the store and found my size I noticed that they weren't the same at all, they just looked similar (colour and markings). The uppers were hard and brittle and the insole and arch were CARDBOARD (under the liner).

    Wal-Mart basically tells it's suppliers what it will pay for a product and the supplier reverse engineers the item to meet the cost restrictions. The consumer may think they are comparing apples to apples, but in fact the Wal-Mart apples may be paper-m&#226;ch&#233; and sawdust.

    I can sight other examples. A neighbour of mine has a company that makes furnace filters (In Buffalo). He has a whole litany of Wal-Mart horror stories.

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    No, the countries with starvation wages and child labour, like most of Africa for example, are precisely the ones whose economies are such basket cases that they can't get it together enough to manufacture things that WalMart would buy to begin with.
    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    China, which is pretty much what we're talking about, is currently growing at 11% a year -- so fast that the government is desperately figuring out ways to cool the economy down. And that translates into rapid growth in the standard of living. If you can think of a way to make them as rich as Americans overnight, I'd be interested to hear about it.
    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    And good luck trying to find a store that only sells goods made in North America or Europe. Certainly not Hudson's Bay or Zeller's.
    Actually Africa isn't the problem, it's Asia and East Asia. China is a problem for different reasons (not so much child labour). The standard of living and working conditions (in factories) are better than most in the region...Mining is the exception in China where working conditions are appalling and that's mostly because of corruption, the laws are actually relatively strict there. I have no problem buying things made in China.

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    ...WalMart's stock price hasn't budged in several years. They can only stay on top by expanding, and they're finding that harder to do.
    .

    That is the point. Wal-Mart has itself acknowledged that it's traditional customer base is virtually bankrupt..buying even groceries on credit cards which are almost maxed out etc. More broke customers are not the solution, they are trying to attract people with some spending power left...Increasingly a problem in America.

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    ... you yourself are participating in the ruthless neo-colonialist victimization of all those exploited countries by bloated, greedy American capitalists and their running dogs, comrade.
    I have no real issue with other people engaging in "ruthless neo-colonialist victimization" and I drive a Jeep. (Not a Hummer but hardly a Toyota Yaris.)

    I agree that there are no "perfect" solutions but I feel there are better options than living in a Wal-Mart world. I fully understand why people shop at Wal-mart, for some it is the best, brightest option...Some simply have no real choice. It's just not my choice. One shirt made in Hong Kong or Taiwan or Mexico may cost one-and-a-half times as much as a Wal-Mart knock-off made in some god-forsaken shit hole with child labour, but it will last four times as long IMO.

    Some people may not care, as is their perfect right, but I sleep better knowing I'm not participating in an economy that chains children to machines for 80 hours a week and pays starvation wages. Just my thing.
    Even if we are just worm food then we are also the stuff stars are made of... I can live with that.

  31. #31
    No longer MIA tbonez's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    BTW, about your 'comrade' crack...(No, I'm not offended)

    My politics, economically at least, are more than a bit right of centre. Paying wages so low that your employees can't afford what you sell is bad business practice when you are as 'big' as Wal-Mart. Not paying benefits or pensions by employing mostly part-time staff is off-loading a business expenses to the public sector. When these people get sick, can't work or have to retire who will pay for their medical bills and living expenses...You and I, not Wal-Mart.

    I think that every American/Canadian who is ready, willing and able to work should have the opportunity to do so at a wage that guarantees they have a reasonable chance of living well above the poverty line...For their whole lives and even if they get sick and can't work. That's not "leftist" politics, it's sound economic policy.

    Part of what makes these two countries so great is our shared standard of living. Let's not get in a race with the bottom feeders for the cheapest goods and labour. You may notice they are all trying to pull themselves up to our standard of living.

    I'd just as soon not pass them on the way down.
    Even if we are just worm food then we are also the stuff stars are made of... I can live with that.

  32. #32
    slobone
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    The US still has the highest standard of living in the world, (except Luxembourg), so I'm not too worried. Can't speak for Canada.

    I see people pay for groceries with credit cards everyday. They do it to get some kind of bonus points, or just for convenience. What the heck has that got to do with WalMart?

    You didn't say what the price of the New Balance shoes was, but I'd be surprised if you could find a better shoe at the same price somewhere else. That's the advantage of WalMart's clout -- they can hold manufacturers to quality AND price standards that nobody else can. Naturally you'll find better trainers somewhere else, but at a much higher price unless they're on sale.

    I paid $20 for a pair of hiking boots that lasted me two years. Can't beat that anywhere. Not Vibram soles, but well made in every way. I couldn't believe it myself.

    As for the air filter, I don't know how to explain that. I seriously doubt Fram has two different lines, one for WalMart and one for everybody else.

    And by the way, I've never had a problem returning things there for a cash refund. They have a "no-questions" policy and half the time I don't even have the receipt.

    "Comrade" -- I was hoping you'd get that that was a joke. I obviously don't think you're a commie, or care if you are. But I am a little surprised to hear you call yourself right of center. I guess the center is in a different place in Canada.

    As for labor laws in other countries, please keep in mind that the rest of the world isn't like North America. When people are desperately poor, they have to make hard choices. Sometimes sending your children out to work is the only way to put enough food on the table. Unfortunate but true. And it was common practice in the Western world up till the last century. Are these other countries expected to catch up with us overnight?

    I think people beat up on WalMart for a variety of reasons, some more legitimate than others.

    1) Some undeniably unfair labor practices that they've been caught doing. No argument there.

    2) They're the biggest, so they're the easiest target. Why is that fair?

    3) Snobbism. Their stuff is inexpensive, and sometimes of low quality. But I don't hear any poor people complaining, only the limousine liberals like Rob Reiner.

    4) They've displaced all the old mom-and-pop stores. Well, I remember those stores, and believe me, they weren't all that great. That's just phony nostalgia.

    Anyway -- truce? I can't handle another round, but I'll be glad to give you the last word.

    Enough for me.

  33. #33
    No longer MIA tbonez's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    I live for the last word!

    Well not really, but...

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    The US still has the highest standard of living in the world, (except Luxembourg), so I'm not too worried. Can't speak for Canada.
    US the "highest standard of living in the world"?? I didn't know that. Depends on what your 'standards' are I guess. I'd bet you'd rank in the top twenty on most lists, the top of a few isn't hard to buy.

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    I see people pay for groceries with credit cards everyday. They do it to get some kind of bonus points, or just for convenience. What the heck has that got to do with WalMart?
    Many people are buying the necessities of life with 'debt'... food for example. Not for the "points", because they have NO CASH. That is a bad thing and in particular it's a problem because when people reach their 'limit' they can't afford to buy anything Wal-Mart sells. Wal-Mart has acknowledged as much many times.

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    As for the air filter, I don't know how to explain that. I seriously doubt Fram has two different lines, one for WalMart and one for everybody else.
    They defiantly do (more than two apparently), and New Balance has several similar looking shoes at several price-points, Levis does the same thing with jeans, Quakerstate with motor oil...

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    But I am a little surprised to hear you call yourself right of center. I guess the center is in a different place in Canada.
    Heck yes! Universal healthcare, same-sex marriage, gun control. I think our right starts where your left drops off.

    Quote Originally Posted by slobone View Post
    I think people beat up on WalMart for a variety of reasons, some more legitimate than others.
    I think my reasons are pretty legitimate for me, not to say they are for anyone else. We all get to chose.

    BTW, it was nothing personal. I just was a bit surprised to see a Wal-Mart cheerleader and could resist the temptation to rustle her pom-poms bit.
    Even if we are just worm food then we are also the stuff stars are made of... I can live with that.

  34. #34
    No longer MIA tbonez's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    BTW,

    Based on GDP (NOT the best measure of "standard of living" IMO, but the most common perhaps.) the US ranks sixth, not first.

    Even Norway beats the US, go figure.
    Even if we are just worm food then we are also the stuff stars are made of... I can live with that.

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    No longer MIA tbonez's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    Some other measures of "standard of living":

    The most common lists look at income as well as rates of poverty and quality of life and takes into account not only the material standard of living, but also other factors such as safety, mental health, environmental quality issues etc have:

    1. Norway
    2. Sweden
    3. Canada
    4. Belgium
    5. Australia
    6. United States

    Infant mortality rates: US, 36th (Canada 22nd)

    http://www.geographyiq.com/ranking/r..._Rate_aall.htm

    Literacy rates, the US is tied with about 20 other countries. (Including Canada)

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._literacy_rate

    Income inequality metrics, Richest 10% to poorest 10% sorted in descending order according has the US as 90th. (if memory serves)
    Even if we are just worm food then we are also the stuff stars are made of... I can live with that.

  36. #36
    Imbeciles...
    luminum's Avatar
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    Re: The American Taliban strikes again...read it for yourself

    I was thinking about them all day during my shift yesterday and became determined ot buy a dry erase board and make it my Gay Agenda planner. The first item on it is "Buy text books."

    What makes these people think we care enough about them to plan and exact an agenda to subvert them and their religion? Assholes.

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