"My friend hasn’t told his partner he has HIV. Should I do it for him?"

This is from the latest "Dear Prudence" on Slate.com.

Dear Prudence,
A close friend of mine unfortunately was diagnosed with HIV about two years ago. We are part of a circle of close gay friends. We have been extremely supportive of him, as he is young and nobody wants such a life-altering illness. He avoided dating, as well as sex dates, until he met the person who seems to be the man of his dreams. His boyfriend does not have HIV, and we figured that our friend would tell him his own status soon enough. But it became apparent that he hadn't informed his partner and has avoided doing so for the past year. I assumed they were using protection but the other night I asked the boyfriend about it. He responded, “Of course we don't! We've been together for a year now and are monogamous.” I am in shock. My friend is being bizarrely protected by everybody with people advising that I stay out of their business. I have no idea how to tackle this situation. I feel that my friend's partner deserves to know, but how do I tell him, or who does it?


—Devastating Secret

Prudence's Response


Dear Devastating,
A couple of years ago one of your friend’s dates, or even one of his “sex dates,” neglected to pass on some crucial information to him, and thus passed on an incurable virus. I hope he is not justifying his own negligence by concluding such risks are the price one pays for an interesting sex life. Or maybe he’s engaging in magical thinking and has concluded that if he’s on antiretroviral therapy (which I assume he is) then love and a low viral load will protect his boyfriend. It’s true treatment reduces the chances of transmission. But the risk still exists and absent the use of condoms your friend is playing sexual Russian roulette with someone else’s life. I spoke to Wendy E. Parmet, associate dean of Northeastern University School of Law and an expert on public health law, and she said that in most states a person who is HIV positive and knowingly engages in unsafe sex could be found criminally liable, though such prosecutions are rare. But your dilemma is primarily an ethical one, and I applaud you for recognizing that a wrong is being done instead of shrugging off someone else’s health. Either your friend has been lying to his boyfriend or he’s allowed the new love to make some false assumptions about his risk. That’s a terrible thing to do, and you seem to be the only person in your circle clear-eyed enough to address this. Although I turned to Parmet for legal expertise, I agree with her suggestion about how you should proceed: Have a frank discussion with your friend in which you say you understand the turmoil he must be experiencing, but if it’s true he hasn’t disclosed his HIV status to his boyfriend and they’re not using condoms, then something has to be done. This talk will confirm whether you’ve got your facts straight, and if you do, you should tell your friend he needs to inform his boyfriend immediately. Say that if he doesn’t, you will. Yes, your friendship will likely be at an end. But a person who would endanger the life of someone he supposedly loves is not much of a friend to anyone.


—Prudie


This is a horrible situation, the friend may have to tell the boyfriend but it really should come from his own partner.

That's absolutely repugnant. How could anyone possibly do that to someone he claims to love? :##:

that guy with hiv should be charged with attempted murder. if his friends decide to be on the hush hush about it as well, they should be charged as accomplices as well. this is about as sickening as the jerry sandusky case with all these people knowing about scary jerry raping kids and basically going like "i have nothing to do with this shit". the letter should be turned over to the police since it's basically talking about a crime in progress.

Once again, Prudie comes through with the right answer.

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Originally Posted by loveguys72

Once again, Prudie comes through with the right answer.

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You like Prudie too ? :) Sometimes I tend to disagree with her, but this time she was pretty good.

Yeah, sometimes she gets a little superior, but mostly her advice is level-headed and spot-on.

A year! Unprotected sex! :eek:

Selfish asshole!

Why ruin the surprize?

The guy with HIV continues to be ignorant, reckless and selfish in his life. The same traits and bad choices that gave him HIV in the first place, but still he hasn't learned from his own experience to safeguard partners that he really does not love as he claims to. I can't believe the friends were silent for a full year. If the HIV guy is so reckless to have unprotected sex all along for year, his partner will probably test positive anyway. Some things are too little too late to act upon.

The lesson is: practice safe sex always, even with a "partner" you "trust."

Some people... should be punished.

The sad thing is that even if he tells the boyfriend which would probably result in a break up, this monster will probably do the exact same thing to his next boyfriend. He probably lied saying he got tested and it came back negative and his boyfriend now probably has HIV and isn't getting treated for it which will result in an earlier death.

If you ever decide to do bareback with your boyfriend, you better make sure you both go in together and get tested at the same time and hear the results at the same time no matter how much you think he loves you and how much you think you could trust him. There's always the factor of cheating too from people you think who would never cheat but they do.

Yup. I'd tell. In fact, I have.

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Originally Posted by Harke the Boeotarch

Why ruin the surprize?

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Birds of a feather...

But sounds like one of those friends doesn't quite belong.

*sick sense of humor*

Sounds like a friend with benefits.

Yup, I said it.

I totally second Adrock-Jd's post 100%, a close friend of mine has had friends die for that same reason.

I don't even understand why people have to write to advice columnists to figure this one out. That is the true problem.

Of course tell. And ditch all the "mind your own business" fuckers masquerading as friends. Fuck, what a gong show.

This is why I don't have close friends. I wouldn't need Miss Prue if I had a "friend" who had AIDS and didn't tell his boyfriend. I would have given that motherfucker five minutes to call his boyfriend and tell him the truth or shit will be going down. That's evil to keep such a serious thing like AIDS from someone you're suppose to love.

these things need to be told. otherwise, it's like you dont want to tell about attemted homicide at the house next door, because it's "not of your business".

Usually im the one who don't like to be in the middle of people problems especially couples, I try not to be friends with people boyfriends or girlfriends as soon as drama happens they try to drag you in the middle. But for this situation i would call him the first minute i found out he has hiv

Hmm do you think this story is true?

Im thinking the column editors make this stuff up for shock value to attract more readers. I can believe an individual asshole could lie to his boyfriend but I think having the entire group of friends go along with it stretches the credibility.

I think the editors have no need of fabricating this particular situation. There are plenty of guys who lie about their STDs, plenty who don't ask, and plenty who have no clue about the onus of ethics.

If the Victorians were wrong to remain silent about sex, then all the more so for gay men in the age of AIDS.

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Originally Posted by Harke the Boeotarch

Why ruin the surprize?

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Oh my goodness. I feel terrible for laughing at this...Don't really have a morbid sense of humour but it caught me off gaurd.

Anyway, this whole fucking situation is absurd. Thank goodness for advice columns, amirite? Cos otherwise, what would people without a functioning moral compass do? A mess.

Sorry, I don't agree with the advice. I mean, it sounds fine on paper, and it works if people are going to act like responsible human beings. But this guy is HIV+, having unsafe sex with his partner, and not telling him about it. He's not acting like a responsible human being. If one were to have a heart-to-heart talk about it, and tell him "If you don't tell your partner, I will", I can guarantee what would happen. In addition to the drama and the it's-none-of-your-business and the I-can-never-trust-you-again...the guy would come back the next day and say "I told him. And he's OK with it."

I mean, come on. If he's willing to withhold this information from his partner, he's willing to lie about telling his partner to his friend.

So I'd just tell the partner. You could just say "You know, when X told us he was HIV-positive, we wondered if he'd ever get another boyfriend" and leave it at that.

Lex

Personally i'd tell the partner straight up what was going on, I wouldn't give a rats ass what the 'friends' think as I would drop them all anyway. They sound like a complete bunch of cunts.

This is a huge disappointment to me. In Canada the courts have changed the HIV disclosure status here. I a person has a low viral load, is on medication and wears a condom, they no longer have to disclose their status. I disagree with this decision as therer is still a risk of transmissint the infection. Disclose and let the person decide for themselves.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/10...of-disclosure/

If I were the unsuspecting boyfriend, I'd be in prison. Cause when I found out, I'd probably kill the mother fucker.

Would a self defence plea work in this circumstance?

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Originally Posted by mikey3000

This is a huge disappointment to me. In Canada the courts have changed the HIV disclosure status here. I a person has a low viral load, is on medication and wears a condom, they no longer have to disclose their status. I disagree with this decision as therer is still a risk of transmissint the infection. Disclose and let the person decide for themselves.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/10...of-disclosure/

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I disagree with you, why should they have to disclose their HIV status if they're using condoms? That doesn't seem very fair.

Personally I just couldn't have sex with someone that I knew had HIV. Even though we could have sex safely it would just be too much of a turn off. In a relationship HIV status should absolutely be disclosed, but when it comes to casual sex I just don't think you have the right to know your casual partners health status. In a casual sex hookup you should presume your partner has HIV, hepatitus and play safe.

I don't know what the stats for you guys in the US are but over here in the UK 1 in 20 gay or bi guys are HIV+ and 30% of them don't even know it. If you go into the cities the rate is higher and in London it's 1 in 10. Personally i've never had casual penetrative sex with a guy and I never would knowing these stats. You can bitch as much as you like about this but at the end of the day it's your responsibility to protect yourself, presuming a complete stranger should keep you safe is a bad idea. The law won't protect you anyway, HIV is generally contracted through casual sexual encounters and if all you know about him is his first name is Bob then law or no law why would you presume he would be honest?

I think that what 2 guys do in their relationship is their business. Maybe the bf wants to die of his own stupidity, but that's his right to have unprotected sex, also, how would you as an outsider be privy to what they do intimately. I would recommend that you keep your nose out of other peoples affairs.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mikey3000

This is a huge disappointment to me. In Canada the courts have changed the HIV disclosure status here. I a person has a low viral load, is on medication and wears a condom, they no longer have to disclose their status. I disagree with this decision as therer is still a risk of transmissint the infection. Disclose and let the person decide for themselves.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/10...of-disclosure/

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That is probably because you are not informed. A person who is HIV + and is on meds eventually becomes what is called "undetectable" which means their viral load is so low that it is "undetectable". I will not try to give you what the percentage of chance that a person who is undetectable passes on the virus because I don't know off hand but I believe it is very very low. Slap on a condom and it is even lower, if not 0. I applaud the Supreme courts descision, responsible HIV + people should not be made out to be criminals.

Having said that the guy talked about in this thread is not a responsible person and I would tell the boyfriend the very first chance I got.

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Originally Posted by Deandbn

I think that what 2 guys do in their relationship is their business. Maybe the bf wants to die of his own stupidity, but that's his right to have unprotected sex, also, how would you as an outsider be privy to what they do intimately. I would recommend that you keep your nose out of other peoples affairs.

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Your statement would be fine if the the guy would be aware that his boyfriend has HIV. I believe he doesn't know.

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Originally Posted by Elwood

That is probably because you are not informed. A person who is HIV + and is on meds eventually becomes what is called "undetectable" which means their viral load is so low that it is "undetectable". I will not try to give you what the percentage of chance that a person who is undetectable passes on the virus because I don't know off hand but I believe it is very very low. Slap on a condom and it is even lower, if not 0. I applaud the Supreme courts descision, responsible HIV + people should not be made out to be criminals.

Having said that the guy talked about in this thread is not a responsible person and I would tell the boyfriend the very first chance I got.

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Well I'm informed enough to realize that condoms fail all the time, and there is still a risk, no matter what the percentage is. This is not Herpes or Gonnorreah we're talking about. This is HIV/AIDS, still a life altering illness. I still have the right to an informed decision, don't I?

If a complete stranger wanted to die of his own stupidity, maybe it's not my business. But if it was one of my friends, of course I would not just tell him but shred him along the way.

My friends don't need to bring their affairs around my nose. But if they do, I'll say when something stinks.

And the idea that expecting honesty from someone about having HIV is treating them like a criminal….just doesn't even compute. If being HIV+ with an undetectable viral load is truly no big deal, then nobody should mind disclosing.

The Canadian court decision was a very bad one. I'm entitled to know who I'm sleeping with. If my privacy is so important, then I have no business getting naked with someone.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mikey3000

This is a huge disappointment to me. In Canada the courts have changed the HIV disclosure status here. If a person has a low viral load, is on medication and wears a condom, they no longer have to disclose their status. I disagree with this decision as therer is still a risk of transmissint the infection. Disclose and let the person decide for themselves.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/10...of-disclosure/

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Hmm in this case risk is almost inexistant... I think enforcing such law in this case would be counterproductive in the fight against HIV (wouldn't benefit it)
Are HIV tests mandatory in Canada?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mikey3000

Well I'm informed enough to realize that condoms fail all the time, and there is still a risk, no matter what the percentage is. This is not Herpes or Gonnorreah we're talking about. This is HIV/AIDS, still a life altering illness. I still have the right to an informed decision, don't I?

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Condoms have NEVER failed me... if yours fail you all the time I don't know maybe it's time you tried another brand???

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Originally Posted by Nishin

Hmm in this case risk is almost inexistant... I think enforcing such law in this case would be counterproductive in the fight against HIV (wouldn't benefit it)
Are HIV tests mandatory in Canada?


Condoms have NEVER failed me... if yours fail you all the time I don't know maybe it's time you tried another brand???

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If condoms never failed, there'd be like 25% less people on the planet. LOL! But seriously, the very first time I topped a guy the condom broke. Scared the crap out of me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mikey3000

If condoms never failed, there'd be like 25% less people on the planet. LOL! But seriously, the very first time I topped a guy the condom broke. Scared the crap out of me.

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As a top you were not at much danger. The bottom is always at greater risk of being infected.
If you use a condom properly, the chances of being infected with HIV for a top is so remote, that you shouldn't beat yourself up over it. There is a greater chance that you will be struck by lightning, and it never happened yes?
Just check yourself every year and you'll be fine.
I understand that many people doesn't care how much of a risk there is, because they are freaked out by the mere fact that there is a chance at all to be infected, but if fear takes over your ife, than you are already lost.

So the solution: Find the condom that works for you. Use it every time you have sex, and get checked for every STD every year once.
If you don't want to put yourself at risk, don't have sex. If you want sex, accept the risks. No other way exists.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MissAnne

This is from the latest "Dear Prudence" on Slate.com.

Dear Prudence,
A close friend of mine unfortunately was diagnosed with HIV about two years ago. We are part of a circle of close gay friends. We have been extremely supportive of him, as he is young and nobody wants such a life-altering illness. He avoided dating, as well as sex dates, until he met the person who seems to be the man of his dreams. His boyfriend does not have HIV, and we figured that our friend would tell him his own status soon enough. But it became apparent that he hadn't informed his partner and has avoided doing so for the past year. I assumed they were using protection but the other night I asked the boyfriend about it. He responded, “Of course we don't! We've been together for a year now and are monogamous.” I am in shock. My friend is being bizarrely protected by everybody with people advising that I stay out of their business. I have no idea how to tackle this situation. I feel that my friend's partner deserves to know, but how do I tell him, or who does it?


—Devastating Secret

Prudence's Response


Dear Devastating,
A couple of years ago one of your friend’s dates, or even one of his “sex dates,” neglected to pass on some crucial information to him, and thus passed on an incurable virus. I hope he is not justifying his own negligence by concluding such risks are the price one pays for an interesting sex life. Or maybe he’s engaging in magical thinking and has concluded that if he’s on antiretroviral therapy (which I assume he is) then love and a low viral load will protect his boyfriend. It’s true treatment reduces the chances of transmission. But the risk still exists and absent the use of condoms your friend is playing sexual Russian roulette with someone else’s life. I spoke to Wendy E. Parmet, associate dean of Northeastern University School of Law and an expert on public health law, and she said that in most states a person who is HIV positive and knowingly engages in unsafe sex could be found criminally liable, though such prosecutions are rare. But your dilemma is primarily an ethical one, and I applaud you for recognizing that a wrong is being done instead of shrugging off someone else’s health. Either your friend has been lying to his boyfriend or he’s allowed the new love to make some false assumptions about his risk. That’s a terrible thing to do, and you seem to be the only person in your circle clear-eyed enough to address this. Although I turned to Parmet for legal expertise, I agree with her suggestion about how you should proceed: Have a frank discussion with your friend in which you say you understand the turmoil he must be experiencing, but if it’s true he hasn’t disclosed his HIV status to his boyfriend and they’re not using condoms, then something has to be done. This talk will confirm whether you’ve got your facts straight, and if you do, you should tell your friend he needs to inform his boyfriend immediately. Say that if he doesn’t, you will. Yes, your friendship will likely be at an end. But a person who would endanger the life of someone he supposedly loves is not much of a friend to anyone.


—Prudie


This is a horrible situation, the friend may have to tell the boyfriend but it really should come from his own partner.

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This is disgusting, I honestly think that all people who knowingly spread STDs should be arrested for biological terrorism. However yes you should tell him so he can protect himself if he already dosen't have AIDS to start with. If I knew that my friends kept it a secret that my partner had AIDS and I got it from him then seriously I would be arrested for murder that day!

It's a horrifying thought to think about. To be honest, I've been more trusting with past boyfriends as this when I should have asked to see recent test results after being in a relationship for awhile. This relationship is doomed, and the sad thing is the boyfriend is probably infected if they've been barebacking for awhile. I'm even wondering if the HIV+ friend wanted to use it as a means to entrap his boyfriend into staying with him.

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Originally Posted by Just_Believe18

It's a horrifying thought to think about. To be honest, I've been more trusting with past boyfriends as this when I should have asked to see recent test results after being in a relationship for awhile. This relationship is doomed, and the sad thing is the boyfriend is probably infected if they've been barebacking for awhile. I'm even wondering if the HIV+ friend wanted to use it as a means to entrap his boyfriend into staying with him.

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Depends. If the HIV infected guy was bottoming than the chance of infection is lower, but of course over the course of a year it is significant. An HIV test is absolutely necessary.

Absolutely you should tell. Imagine if u were the boyfriend and when you found out not only did he not tell you he was HIV, but that loads of other people knew as well and none thought to tell you either.

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Originally Posted by hellproof

Absolutely you should tell. Imagine if u were the boyfriend and when you found out not only did he not tell you he was HIV, but that loads of other people knew as well and none thought to tell you either.

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Yep. Heads will roll.


no, seriously. Heads will roll.

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Originally Posted by Huntneo(PT)

Yep. Heads will roll.


no, seriously. Heads will roll.

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They better be. Something like this should never go without being made an example of.

I thought there is a LAW about this thing, It is a crime, and this involve other people life... He should go to Jail for that...

And for "Devastating Secret", What's come around goes around... One day DS will have to deal with the situation he is stuck in, someone will have a secret that could hold his/her life, but they just keep it quiet as you did to someone else. I believe in Karma.

If some so called friend gets to personal with me over my private affairs with boy friend or partner I tend to lie. To give them what the nosy shit head wants, drama and nosy gossip. I don't tell my business to them they need to get a life. Maybe when the snoop goes blabbering at the lips the bf will say "no shit asshole why don't you mind your own business because what I and my lover do in our private life is none of your fucking business".
In my times I find a lot of queeny bitchy drama queen gay guys like this gossip game much like a real bitch so sadly I've had to lie or give these friends the drama they need several time before telling them to fuck off and go watch another drag show. Its a friendship killer.

bottom line you really don't know what 2 people in a private intimate long term relationship discuss behind clothes door and you would be the first to bitch and moan if some christian was trying to see what sort of sodomy you do with your lover.
But its the best some sad sacks can do to get it up and try and create havoc in others life.
Like the guy who comes up and says "Did you know your BF was sucking a guys cock in the car last night I heard it was the 3rd time in fact,....well I thought you should know"
Then they walk away and their needle dick shoots a load and they are happy with themselves for causing trouble. They are shit heads. Why be a shit head when you have no facts of whats what.

So, you are saying...what?

Wow. This is about SO MUCH MORE than someone just wanting to be bitchy, nosy, or 'cause drama'. I can't even.

:dead: :##:

Thankfully, there seem to be enough people who know when to say when and speak up.

No doubt in my mind what I would do in this scenario. I'd tell my friend to tell his bf or I'd do it for him. Privacy and respect end when you are putting someone's health at risk.

A poz guy I know constantly tries to bed unsuspecting strangers. Hell, I was almost one of them. But since I found out he's poz, hates condoms and doesn't disclose, I privately tell each of his victims beforehand so they can at least make an informed decision. I nearly kicked the shit outta him when he tried that shit of a friend of mine. His theory ios that if they don't ask, it's their fault. Big mistake.

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Originally Posted by mikey3000

A poz guy I know constantly tries to bed unsuspecting strangers. Hell, I was almost one of them. But since I found out he's poz, hates condoms and doesn't disclose, I privately tell each of his victims beforehand so they can at least make an informed decision. I nearly kicked the shit outta him when he tried that shit of a friend of mine. His theory ios that if they don't ask, it's their fault. Big mistake.

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See that's the sort of person that should just be locked in a quarantine facility.